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Mad Lust Envy's Headphone Gaming Guide: (3/18/2016: MrSpeakers Ether C 1.1 Added) - Page 572

post #8566 of 37400
Chicolom,
Argh I'm too slow to edit! Or just not as good explaining my thoughts on first pass wink.gif

I guess I haven't heard Dolby Headphone, at least not recently (or does the DSS2 also use DH?), but my thinking is that if the processing works for the AD700 so well, it's not really the fault of the processing technique or DAC quality. Also, I think the Q701 performs optimally paired to a good desktop amp, which I don't as-yet have (paid for half, the other half will be paid once it's here). So, I would be double-amping a Monoprice processor or Mixamp anyway biggrin.gif

Edit: I actually haven't listened to music through my Recon3D, I'm pretty happy on the music front with lossless tracks on my 5th gen iPod Video (which has a pretty good DAC) with a FiiO L11 Line Out Dock adapter and E5 amp (upgrading from this, as you know).

No guarantees I wouldn't want a DAC upgrade or source(Xbox360) upgrade someday wink.gif
Edited by Evshrug - 10/20/12 at 5:01pm
post #8567 of 37400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evshrug View Post

Chicolom,
Argh I'm too slow to edit! Or just not as good explaining my thoughts on first pass wink.gif

I guess I haven't heard Dolby Headphone, at least not recently (or does the DSS2 also use DH?), but my thinking is that if the processing works for the AD700 so well, it's not really the fault of the processing technique or DAC quality. Also, I think the Q701 performs optimally paired to a good desktop amp, which I don't as-yet have (paid for half, the other half will be paid once it's here). So, I would be double-amping a Monoprice processor or Mixamp anyway biggrin.gif

Edit: I actually haven't listened to music through my Recon3D, I'm pretty happy on the music front with lossless tracks on my 5th gen iPod Video (which has a pretty good DAC) with a FiiO L11 Line Out Dock adapter and E5 amp (upgrading from this, as you know).

No guarantees I wouldn't want a DAC upgrade or source(Xbox360) upgrade someday wink.gif

 

FYI, DSS2 doesn't use DH.

 

I would disagree slightly, to say that I think some the positioning problems are still because of the processing DSP.  This is because the AD700 is sort of an exception to the rule in that its soundstage is ridiculously good at taking advantage of positional cues - more so than just about every other headphone.  In other words, I think the AD700 is making the Recon sound a bit better than it actually is, and I think your perception of the Recon's ability may actually be conflated with the AD700's own exceptional positioning characteristics.  I'm exaggerating a bit, but you get the idea.  In other words, the AD700 will make any DSP (or even just basic stereo, as some weirdos sometimes to prefer tongue.gif ) sound great. 

 

In that sense, the AD700 doesn't need all that much DSP help to still have good cues, but headphones endowed with a lesser soundstage (like Q701 and everything else <HD800) need all the help they can get, which is why I still think going from THX to Dobly Headphone will be a worthwhile upgrade.

 

But regardless, it does makes sense to get a desktop amp if your a fan of the Q701.

beerchug.gif


Edited by chicolom - 10/20/12 at 5:34pm
post #8568 of 37400
I getcha.
I didn't think the DSS2 uses Dolby Headphone (marketing only mentions "Dolby surround").
Because I want a desktop amp anyway, I'm giving that a shot first. Then, I may end up like MLE sampling almost every other device, lol. I'd try that Monoprice deal, and the original DSS, if I was ready wink.gif
post #8569 of 37400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evshrug View Post

I getcha.
I didn't think the DSS2 uses Dolby Headphone (marketing only mentions "Dolby surround").
Because I want a desktop amp anyway, I'm giving that a shot first. Then, I may end up like MLE sampling almost every other device, lol. I'd try that Monoprice deal, and the original DSS, if I was ready wink.gif

I believe the DSS2 is some proprietary processing.  Seems to work out just fine in the 'real world', but I'm always interested how other processors sound in comparison.

post #8570 of 37400
post #8571 of 37400
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellte2 View Post

I believe the DSS2 is some proprietary processing.  Seems to work out just fine in the 'real world', but I'm always interested how other processors sound in comparison.
That's what I gathered as well. Just like my Yamaha receiver has proprietary surround processing.

I might not have bought the Recon3D or headphone amp if I wasn't living at my mom's. Surprising birthday gift aside, I really need to move out.
post #8572 of 37400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

Welcome to the thread, Raleigh.

 

lol, I've commented quite a few times on this thread before rolleyes.gif

 

Thanks for the advice guys. I think I will sell my turtlebeach x41's. Won't get much for it but that can't be helped. I'm leaning towards the mixamp rather than the receiver, although I will definitely need one towards the end of spring next year. I've seen different mixamps being mentioned. Should I get the latest one or is the 2011 one the best?

post #8573 of 37400
Well, only one person has spoken here comparing the 2011 and 2013 model side-by-side. We're all just Internet yahoos here (yes, I liked the link Chicolom), and we haven't formed a consensus yet. That said, the 2011 mixamp is a safe bet, and anything earlier is fine as well so long as you don't need PS3 chat.
post #8574 of 37400
Thread Starter 
Evshrug, I was under the assumption that you had tried the original DSS, not the DSS2. Then, you REALLY have to try Dolby Headphone FIRST before getting rid of the Q701. You'd be doing a disservice to them, especially since you haven't tried DH yet. I dunno what DSS2 sounds like, but I can assure you, the positioning on DH IS better than the Recond3D by a significant amount.
post #8575 of 37400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

Evshrug, I was under the assumption that you had tried the original DSS, not the DSS2. Then, you REALLY have to try Dolby Headphone FIRST before getting rid of the Q701. You'd be doing a disservice to them, especially since you haven't tried DH yet. I dunno what DSS2 sounds like, but I can assure you, the positioning on DH IS better than the Recond3D by a significant amount.

I think I have heard the original DSS a long time ago... I just assume that it's better than the DSS2, which I would actually place behind the Recon3D and Yamaha's Silent Cinema. Part of why I was interested in the super-low eBay prices on the DSS (would need a Monoprice optical cable tho) a month or so back, instead of the recon3D. The DSS2 was pretty poor, like a rather narrow oval shaped positioning field that was hardly better than right-left panning. I did end up blowing my birthday money on much-needed shoes & a non-trial version of Win8 Pro.

I kinda wish Zigis would finish my amp so I could hear it already! Also, don't feel bad about the Q701... I love them and find them very musical, they make me feel rich to have something so refined, it's just that if money becomes a worry, between the option of AD700 for gaming and my speakers for music once I move out in the long run, the Q701, the Recon3D, and the desktop amp may lose out to gas money or some other essential. I WANT to keep them and tune everything around them perfectly.

Since my mom forgot to turn off the mobile hotspot tonight, I'm tempted to see if I can listen to the DH and CMSS-3D videos through my iPad.
Edited by Evshrug - 10/20/12 at 8:10pm
post #8576 of 37400
Thread Starter 
You need to spend some time time these surround amps. I could never gauge the performance of the DSS and paired headsets off what I hear in Bestbuy, because it all sounds horrible there. The vids they use don't even sound like they are in surround. @_@
post #8577 of 37400

I'm beginning to think that buying the Recon3D USB solely to review really wasn't the best of decisions.

 

I'm not truly satisfied with it, and especially now that Mad Lust Envy wasn't truly satisfied with it, I'm left with a $70 device I can't sell.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicolom View Post

FYI, DSS2 doesn't use DH.

 

I would disagree slightly, to say that I think some the positioning problems are still because of the processing DSP.  This is because the AD700 is sort of an exception to the rule in that its soundstage is ridiculously good at taking advantage of positional cues - more so than just about every other headphone.  In other words, I think the AD700 is making the Recon sound a bit better than it actually is, and I think your perception of the Recon's ability may actually be conflated with the AD700's own exceptional positioning characteristics.  I'm exaggerating a bit, but you get the idea.  In other words, the AD700 will make any DSP (or even just basic stereo, as some weirdos sometimes to prefer tongue.gif) sound great. 

 

In that sense, the AD700 doesn't need all that much DSP help to still have good cues, but headphones endowed with a lesser soundstage (like Q701 and everything else <HD800) need all the help they can get, which is why I still think going from THX to Dobly Headphone will be a worthwhile upgrade.

 

But regardless, it does makes sense to get a desktop amp if your a fan of the Q701.

beerchug.gif

 

You forgot Stax. Seriously, a typical Lambda-series set is AD700 on super-steroids. More atmospheric soundstage, more clarity, more speed, and heck, even some bass presence. wink.gif The amp requirements can be ridiculously demanding if you don't already have a nice speaker amp/receiver, but I can definitely say it's a natural progression for AD700 fans.

 

That said, even my "AD700s on super steroids" couldn't really help THX TruStudio Surround compared to CMSS-3D Headphone for PC gaming. The deficiencies in positioning were still noticeable in my comparisons, and I'd expect no less even if I still had my AD700s.

post #8578 of 37400
Thread Starter 
Now I feel bad. Maybe I should've waited until after you sold it to put up the review? Lol. Try Ebay?

I lost $30+ for something I bought one month ago (E17). Sigh, every little bit does sting.
post #8579 of 37400
Thread Starter 
A heads up, that faulty DT990/32 is back up on Amazon for $149. Do NOT buy it. Right there on the description, it says discoloration, no sound from the right side, and no returns accepted.

Pay attention!

I'm interested in that Monoprice headset for sure. Can't afford to buy anything unnecessary, but still, that DH amp may be a gem, and the headset may actually be a good starter can. I may gift it to my brother for Xmas, and tell him I need a few days with it. biggrin.gif
Edited by Mad Lust Envy - 10/20/12 at 9:07pm
post #8580 of 37400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

You need to spend some time time these surround amps. I could never gauge the performance of the DSS and paired headsets off what I hear in Bestbuy, because it all sounds horrible there. The vids they use don't even sound like they are in surround. @_@

Definitely had the "these don't even sound like they are in surround" feeling at BB. The store was almost empty, and I replayed the surround video 5-6 times, paying especial attention to the part where they play a swoosh that is supposed to circle corresponding to the circle of loudspeaker icons... No joy.

Finally found Nameless' video links from a week back (this post: http://www.head-fi.org/t/534479/mad-lust-envys-headphone-gaming-guide-updated-10-16-12-ps3-bd-playback-in-dolby-digital/8265#post_8774789). I can't say anything conclusive, because my right ear feels awful right now. For some reason, the first video says it's unavailable right now. I also listened to the vid Mad has posted on the first page (embedded YouTube videos have only recently started showing up on Head-Fi when viewed on an iPad)... again, can't say anything conclusive, but front-back surround worked better for me. Sadly, the part where the gamer was standing in the center of the circle of turrets was the only part out of both videos that sounded realistic to me. Mad, DH rear positioning cues are quieted/muffled just like THXTSP does! But that never bothered me.

My right ear is actually starting to feel irritated right now as I type this though. Clogging, pressure, hot... unfun. I'm gonna flush it out, but I think another day will be more fair.
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