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Mad Lust Envy's Headphone Gaming Guide: (3/18/2016: MrSpeakers Ether C 1.1 Added) - Page 1568

post #23506 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Napalmhardcore View Post
 

I'm almost certain that it is digital clipping that I've been experiencing. I've just gone into my sound settings. The strange thing is that last time I tried the test button, above 48,000 hz it said that the audio device was being used by another programme, so I left it at 48,000. This time the test worked fine at 96,000, so I'll try running it like that and see how I get on.

 

BTW, every time I've tried the WMA pro Audio test it's told me that it is being used by another programme. Should I check that box?

 

Thanks for prompting me to test again :)


Ah I see, the clipping is quite obvious it's like random instant interruptions in playback. You probably had music, an online video, a game, etc. going at the time. What really makes a difference is 16 bit to 24 bit, the sound of everything becomes fuller and more organic. Just select okay when it says that, it usually means you are playing an audio file of sort somewhere.


Edited by kman1211 - 5/2/14 at 6:23pm
post #23507 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by kman1211 View Post
 


Ah I see, the clipping is quite obvious it's like random instant interruptions in playback. You probably had music, an online video, a game, etc. going at the time. What really makes a difference is 16 bit to 24 bit, the sound of everything becomes fuller and more organic. Just select okay when it says that, it usually means you are playing an audio file of sort somewhere.

*One finger placed on nose while excitedly pointing at you with the other hand* That's the problem I've been having!

 

I already had the audio at 24 bit, just not at the maximum sample rate. I'm really hoping that is what was causing the problem.

 

Should I check the WMA Pro Audio box then?

 

And thank you again (I'm happily excited that this may have solved the issue).

post #23508 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Napalmhardcore View Post
 

*One finger placed on nose while excitedly pointing at you with the other hand* That's the problem I've been having!

 

I already had the audio at 24 bit, just not at the maximum sample rate. I'm really hoping that is what was causing the problem.

 

Should I check the WMA Pro Audio box then?

 

And thank you again (I'm happily excited that this may have solved the issue).


Ah I see. Do you have a USB 3.0 jack on your computer? If not, I would try other USB jacks and maybe use different USB cables if you have any on the computer and see if any help with the issue if it isn't solved. I found clipping a USB issue, some USB jacks are dirtier than others, some may clip a lot and some don't clip at all, I found all the USB 3.0 jacks I tried clean though and free of clipping and distortion.

 

Yea, I would just check the box. The sampling rate is more of an audio quality thing but it may help with some other issues.

post #23509 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by kman1211 View Post
 


Ah I see. Do you have a USB 3.0 jack on your computer? If not, I would try other USB jacks and maybe use different USB cables if you have any on the computer and see if any help with the issue if it isn't solved. I found clipping a USB issue, some USB jacks are dirtier than others, some may clip a lot and some don't clip at all, I found all the USB 3.0 jacks I tried clean though and free of clipping and distortion.

 

Yea, I would just check the box. The sampling rate is more of an audio quality thing but it may help with some other issues.

Thank you my good man. I shall see how things go and report back after some testing (not tonight though).

 

I'm going to spend a little time researching some tube amps, then I'm off to bed.

 

Thanks for taking the time to help me troubleshoot :)

 

Edit: I don't have USB 3.0. If I still have problems I'll try different ports and/or cables.


Edited by Napalmhardcore - 5/2/14 at 6:54pm
post #23510 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Napalmhardcore View Post
 

Thank you my good man. I shall see how things go and report back after some testing (not tonight though).

 

I'm going to spend a little time researching some tube amps, then I'm off to bed.

 

Thanks for taking the time to help me troubleshoot :)

 

Edit: I don't have USB 3.0. If I still have problems I'll try different ports and/or cables.


No problem. Hopefully you get the problem solved. The clipping issue doesn't effect all USB dacs and USB soundcards, some are more sensitive to dirty USB jacks than others, electronics can be fickle at times.

post #23511 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Change is Good View Post

 

Hahaha! Nice! Coming this summer to a theater near you!

 

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

 

I step away for a day and Change busts out my high school yearbook photos. So mean.

post #23512 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by kman1211 View Post


No problem. Hopefully you get the problem solved. The clipping issue doesn't effect all USB dacs and USB soundcards, some are more sensitive to dirty USB jacks than others, electronics can be fickle at times.
Right.
I don't think my USB 3 ports are inherently less "dirty" than USB 2 ports just because they're USB (USB 2 carries more than enough bandwidth to carry pretty much all audio bitrates, I believe even 12mbps USB 1 is technically capable). What I really think is going on is that some USB ports share bandwidth or controllers with desktop case front-USB-headers or aren't well isolated from other electronic interference... USB3 just happens to be new enough and sparse enough that it does tend to not be sharing resources with other components.

On motherboards/computers with "only" USB 2, I suggest keeping peripherals like keyboards and mice plugged in a group near each other (in a serial port, if possible), perhaps unplugging stuff like printers and external harddrives (IMO everyone should have an HDD for backups, you will need a backup one day), and plug audio devices, like an Omni, far away from other stuff.
post #23513 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evshrug View Post


Right.
I don't think my USB 3 ports are inherently less "dirty" than USB 2 ports just because they're USB (USB 2 carries more than enough bandwidth to carry pretty much all audio bitrates, I believe even 12mbps USB 1 is technically capable). What I really think is going on is that some USB ports share bandwidth or controllers with desktop case front-USB-headers or aren't well isolated from other electronic interference... USB3 just happens to be new enough and sparse enough that it does tend to not be sharing resources with other components.

On motherboards/computers with "only" USB 2, I suggest keeping peripherals like keyboards and mice plugged in a group near each other (in a serial port, if possible), perhaps unplugging stuff like printers and external harddrives (IMO everyone should have an HDD for backups, you will need a backup one day), and plug audio devices, like an Omni, far away from other stuff.

That is probably the problem then as the clipping only tends to happen on more power hungry USB dacs. USB 3 tends to have it's own USB controller in computers(the case with my desktop and laptop) which leads to it not sharing resources with the USB 2/1 ports. They are probably made to a higher standard as well due to their sparsity which leads to less electrical interference and making them cleaner overall. In future computers when USB 3 becomes mainstream the same problem may start happening with them.


Edited by kman1211 - 5/2/14 at 10:18pm
post #23514 of 37453

Hey Evshrug where is that comparison video you promised? I'm waiting on people that have different devices with updated firmware post their opinions on audio and mic quality before buying anything. As a matter of fact, I think I found a post of MadLustEnvy over on astro tech support forums from a few years ago saying that the 2013 mixamp has horrible mic quality. It is unfortunate that there are no good products overall. The Recon 3d usb is not good for me since it does not have dolby headphone/digital, the mixamp 5.8 wireless is not good since you need to buy a battery for it to work more than 2-3 hours (and the fact that it's wireless), the 2013 mixamp from the looks of it has less inputs, horrible mic quality, the dss2 is not DH. So at this point its either the 2011 mixamp or the tritton.

post #23515 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by kman1211 View Post

That is probably the problem then as the clipping only tends to happen on more power hungry USB dacs. USB 3 tends to have it's own USB controller in computers(the case with my desktop and laptop) which leads to it not sharing resources with the USB 2/1 ports. They are probably made to a higher standard as well due to their sparsity which leads to less electrical interference and making them cleaner overall. In future computers when USB 3 becomes mainstream the same problem may start happening with them.
So basically, exactly what I just said but in slightly different words biggrin.gif


Quote:
Originally Posted by IBeBallin View Post

Hey Evshrug where is that comparison video you promised?
1.)The Recon 3d usb is not good for me since it does not have dolby headphone/digital,
2.) the mixamp 5.8 wireless is not good since you need to buy a battery for it to work more than 2-3 hours (and the fact that it's wireless),
3.) the 2013 mixamp from the looks of it has less inputs, horrible mic quality, the dss2 is not DH.
4.) So at this point its either the 2011 mixamp or the tritton.

Thank you for your interest! I finished it, but it was too long to post to YouTube. I'm going to make a playlist for these and split them up.

One thing I'd like to mention: Dolby headphone is good, but different people's ears will work better with different surround DSPs, so if you've never heard another option then you don't need to automatically not count it as a viable option.

1.) As I said above, THX processing is no slouch, actually my personal favorite for consoles (with my ears).
2.) I got more hours than that with my AAA's, but a rechargeable battery pack waaaaay pays for itself in the long run anyway. Wireless is always a trade off, the Mixamp 5.8 is less of a trade-off than built-in solutions but still people will differ in opinion if it's worth it.
3.)mic quality is up to the mic used, I think they took away the ports to use for LANs but I'm not sure (haven't had one of these 2013 models myself).
4.) If you've narrowed it down for you, that can be good, but you've made a few assumptions that might make you miss out on possibly your best solution.
post #23516 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stillhart View Post
 

I heard he's beta testing the Ragnarok and Yggdrassil.

 

 

:popcorn:

God I love their names.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kman1211 View Post
 


That is true, it's not warmth that separates tubes from solid state. Tubes do have a different sound though. Best way to describe tubes is that tubes have a more analog sound. Cheaper tubes can be a bit wooly like you said. And some tubes are extremely transparent and very clear sounding with sparkle but also sweet and smooth sounding.

Questions about some stuff that's been floating around:

1. Perhaps this has been discussed earlier in this thread (perhaps a zillion times) but I'm interested in opinions on tube amps vs solid state amps. I was looking at the Magni vs Vali and I noticed the massive difference in output impedance. Then I did some other reading about tube amps' "warm sound." Is it not the case that tube amps get this by massive distorting the sound, increasing the bass and colouring the mids? That if we want to listen to the whole sound we should just get a SS amp which just leaves the sound as is?

 

2. As for sound cards, I read some opinions that they make absolutely no difference over plugging headphones directly into the onboard audio (as long as you plug headphones into the motherboard directly rather than the front), and all they do is add output impedance.

 

3. In particular, Stillhart, you're using PC->Omni->Modi->M-stage? I don't understand what the Omni is doing here. I thought the point of a DAC+amp was to take digital audio from the harddrive and process it into an analog signal externally from the PC (and thus avoid all the introduction of noise inside the PC which is the reason some people use sound cards in the first place).

 

No disrespect intended, it's very likely that I'm missing something.

post #23517 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmencius View Post

God I love their names.

Questions about some stuff that's been floating around:
1. Perhaps this has been discussed earlier in this thread (perhaps a zillion times) but I'm interested in opinions on tube amps vs solid state amps. I was looking at the Magni vs Vali and I noticed the massive difference in output impedance. Then I did some other reading about tube amps' "warm sound." Is it not the case that tube amps get this by massive distorting the sound, increasing the bass and colouring the mids? That if we want to listen to the whole sound we should just get a SS amp which just leaves the sound as is?

2. As for sound cards, I read some opinions that they make absolutely no difference over plugging headphones directly into the onboard audio (as long as you plug headphones into the motherboard directly rather than the front), and all they do is add output impedance.

3. In particular, Stillhart, you're using PC->Omni->Modi->M-stage? I don't understand what the Omni is doing here. I thought the point of a DAC+amp was to take digital audio from the harddrive and process it into an analog signal externally from the PC (and thus avoid all the introduction of noise inside the PC which is the reason some people use sound cards in the first place).

No disrespect intended, it's very likely that I'm missing something.

I may be able to answer some of these...

As for the Magni vs Vali, it all depends on what type of cans you are using. I'm gonna end up getting the Vali as it will help with the harshness of the K712's highs. Again, not all tube amps distort or make the sound warmer. It all depends on the tubes. It was mentioned here that some tubes can be very analytical and transparent.

Sound cards DO in fact make a difference. Plugging your headphones directly into a MOBO is essentially like using a bad source (depends on the MOBO). A soundcard is a nice thing to have. It all depends on whether you want an external or internal sound card. Both can help with sq.

When it comes to the Omni, Stillhart is using it as an external sound card. It's also how he's getting the virtual 5.1 surround sound. It is in fact a DAC and amp combo. It's taking the audio via USB and converting it into either 5.1 or two channel sound (depending on what you want).

I'm not the most knowledgeable when it comes to these things (especially when I'm compared to the others who frequently answer questions in the thread). Anyone, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong for any of these points.
Edited by grumpy1471 - 5/3/14 at 11:43am
post #23518 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmencius View Post
 

God I love their names.

 

Questions about some stuff that's been floating around:

1. Perhaps this has been discussed earlier in this thread (perhaps a zillion times) but I'm interested in opinions on tube amps vs solid state amps. I was looking at the Magni vs Vali and I noticed the massive difference in output impedance. Then I did some other reading about tube amps' "warm sound." Is it not the case that tube amps get this by massive distorting the sound, increasing the bass and colouring the mids? That if we want to listen to the whole sound we should just get a SS amp which just leaves the sound as is?

 

2. As for sound cards, I read some opinions that they make absolutely no difference over plugging headphones directly into the onboard audio (as long as you plug headphones into the motherboard directly rather than the front), and all they do is add output impedance.

 

3. In particular, Stillhart, you're using PC->Omni->Modi->M-stage? I don't understand what the Omni is doing here. I thought the point of a DAC+amp was to take digital audio from the harddrive and process it into an analog signal externally from the PC (and thus avoid all the introduction of noise inside the PC which is the reason some people use sound cards in the first place).

 

No disrespect intended, it's very likely that I'm missing something.

2. I think that's simply wrong. Integrated on-board [Realtek, etc.] simply does terribly with headphones IMO. The sound is very often muddy and lacks any definition [tested with my own Realtek] and that's when an internal/external soundcard comes in. Some are made to work well with headphones and eliminate the purpose for a stand-alone headphone DAC/amp. Many headphones do fairly well with a decent soundcard, but the most demanding or power-hungry headphones will always benefit from a dedicated headphone amp/DAC. 

 

3. Omni serves to provide the signal processing [DH, SBX, THX, etc. ] only. It doesn't do anything else [like converting the signal from digital to analogue or amping, that's what the other two do.] but processing, much like U3, etc. can, then Modi does the DAC function and Mstage amps it.

 

EDIT: grumpy is right too.


Edited by conquerator2 - 5/3/14 at 11:53am
post #23519 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by conquerator2 View Post

2. I think that's simply wrong. Integrated on-board [Realtek, etc.] simply does terribly with headphones IMO. The sound is very often muddy and lacks any definition [tested with my own Realtek] and that's when an internal/external soundcard comes in. Some are made to work well with headphones and eliminate the purpose for a stand-alone headphone DAC/amp. Many headphones do fairly well with a decent soundcard, but the most demanding or power-hungry headphones will always benefit from a dedicated headphone amp/DAC. 

3. Omni serves to provide the DSP [DH, SBX, THX, etc. ] only. It doesn't do anything else but processing, much like U3, etc. then Modi does the DAC function and Mstage amps it.

EDIT: grumpy is right too.

You answered #3 a lot better. Essentially, Stillhart is bypassing the Omni's DAC and amp features and offloading those to the Modi and M-Stage, correct?
post #23520 of 37453
Quote:
Originally Posted by grumpy1471 View Post


You answered #3 a lot better. Essentially, Stillhart is bypassing the Omni's DAC and amp features and offloading those to the Modi and M-Stage, correct?

yes, the Omni acts as a processor only, nothing more, nothing less.

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