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Mad Lust Envy's Headphone Gaming Guide: (3/18/2016: MrSpeakers Ether C 1.1 Added) - Page 877

post #13141 of 37437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Change is Good View Post

I beg to differ. They ARE very comfortable... but sound wise, the soundstage is terrible. It's only my opinion, though...


Nah, these are quite close to the PRO 900 / 2900 and in regards of soundstaging. Have them allgs1000.gif. Have at least 7.5 points for competetive. And remeber these are closed, so the staging must be kind of limited. And btw you need to get used to the S-logic driver placement. That needs to happen in your brain and can take some hours.

post #13142 of 37437
Thread Starter 
Oh yeah, as much as I'm amazed by the sound of the 407, I wouldn't buy them. I don't like the pads, the shape, the looks, the comfort. It's too awkward to wear, and I'm consistently annoyed with the crackling it puts out when adjusting the cups on my head. Also worth noting that I have them fully extended, no real headroom.

The only 'stats that would replace my LCD2 would have to be circular shaped (007/009) which I obviously can't afford.

Unless the Koss ESP 950 blows me away and fits better (it at least looks like a headphone), doesn't look like I'll be going 'stat anytime soon. At least the Koss is 'affordable if I find them to be worthwhile.

I did cancel the Momentum though. Thanks to Chicolom for basically pushing further into not wanting them anymore. I really wouldn't have used them much. I DO want them, but that is more impulse than any real benefit to me. I want lots of things that wouldn't benefit me, like the M80 (I guess it's small enough and cheap enough, though not sold on it's looks), X1 (this one I could live with if it fit me right), K712 Pro (just because I want to confirm that it's the Annie in a new color).
Edited by Mad Lust Envy - 4/20/13 at 9:41am
post #13143 of 37437

Now that's the tone I like hearing!

post #13144 of 37437
Thread Starter 
Tone? What, focusing on the negative? Lol. I would've gotten to it eventually when I post the review. biggrin.gif

I mean, you can ask me about any headphone, and what I don't like, I'm sure I can find something with every headphone I've loved, aside from the Annie because while haters gonna hate, that headphone is a 10/10 for me. tongue.gif
post #13145 of 37437

I am a negative nancy.  biggrin.gif

post #13146 of 37437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

Oh yeah, as much as I'm amazed by the sound of the 407, I wouldn't buy them. I don't like the pads, the shape, the looks, the comfort. It's too awkward to wear, and I'm consistently annoyed with the crackling it puts out when adjusting the cups on my head. Also worth noting that I have them fully extended, no real headroom.

The only 'stats that would replace my LCD2 would have to be circular shaped (007/009) which I obviously can't afford.

Unless the Koss ESP 950 blows me away and fits better (it at least looks like a headphone), doesn't look like I'll be going 'stat anytime soon. At least the Koss is 'affordable if I find them to be worthwhile.

I did cancel the Momentum though. Thanks to Chicolom for basically pushing further into not wanting them anymore. I really wouldn't have used them much. I DO want them, but that is more impulse than any real benefit to me. I want lots of things that wouldn't benefit me, like the M80 (I guess it's small enough and cheap enough, though not sold on it's looks), X1 (this one I could live with if it fit me right), K712 Pro (just because I want to confirm that it's the Annie in a new color).

Sorry to let you know even the 009s have that crackling going on tongue_smile.gif.

 

It depends mostly on your head/ear size. My ears are quite big and everytime I yawn/drink water, the crackling appear. Still, once you find a comfortable fit, it's annoying but bearable to get those rare crackling.

post #13147 of 37437
Thread Starter 
At the end of the day, I can live with the crackling, but it is annoying. I can't live with that odd feeling of these plasticky head rectangles strapped to my ears though, lol. It doesn't feel right. It's not uncomfortable, but not good. The pads are terrible though. Too thin. Let me not get started on the plastic they used on the housing. It is strong, but feels like it'd crack under stress. I would be more confident throwing the Slyr around than the 407, and I'm not basing that on price.

Build quality is...meh. But the headband strap... OMG, AMAZING. No doubt.

These headphones are like what $600? $550 of that must have went on sound alone, because the rest needs work.

I won't lie, if it was a dynamic headphone with good comfort and build, I'd peg it as a $800-1000 headphone. It does sound amazing.
Edited by Mad Lust Envy - 4/20/13 at 10:02am
post #13148 of 37437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

At the end of the day, I can live with the crackling, but it is annoying. I can't live with that odd feeling of these plasticky head rectangles strapped to my ears, lol. It doesn't feel right. It's not uncomfortable, but not good. The pads are terrible though. Too thin. Let me not get started on the plastic they used on the housing. It is strong, but feels like it'd crack under stress. I would be more confident throwing the Slyr around than the 407, and I'm not basing that on price.

Build quality is...meh. But the headband strap... OMG, AMAZING. No doubt.

Yea the strap is so smoth bigsmile_face.gif. I think one can glue another pad, or stuff the pad to be thicker to avoid the crackling - not sure how that would do to the sound though.

post #13149 of 37437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

I could never afford any of those alone, lol.

Hyperbole, when nothing outside of the Denon and AD700 has had a perfect score in a rating? All the ones I mentioned have avaraged to like an 8 or 8.5.

A great headphone is a great headphone. I'm not a typical head-fier, fickle in what they like, then don't like. As soon as they they a new headphone, the last one is suddenly not worthwhile. That's the sort of mentality you SHOULD avoid. So because I like new headphones, and still see how amazing the older ones are, it's hyperbole? Please.

It's not like all the sudden the last headphone lost it's quality.

I may get excited about a new product, yet I don't dismiss what I've felt was great to begin with. The AD700 was my first main headphone, yet it remains the king of competitive gaming for me, so many years later. My ears have gained enough experience to hear and understand their faults (as with any headphone), but I wouldn't ever dismiss them (or any headphone I've felt was good).

If I can personally point out my main fault, it'd be that I'm a slave to my impulses in trying new headphones. Just so happens, that I've chosen/heard consistently better and better (with a few exceptions (like the Mad Dogs, which I like but don't find to be a giant killer like people wanna lead others to believe).

As with every headphone, I'm quick to point out their faults, as well as their strengths. The only headphone I've really truly gushed about lately has been the Annie, and that's because it's almost everything anyone can ask for in a balanced headphone, IMHO. If I only had like $600 and no current gear without being able to get anything after, I'd buy the Annie with a Modi/Magni. In a heartbeat. The Annie IS the best headphone I've heard in their price range that does everything I want.

The 407 has it's faults too, but it IS an electrostatic headphone worthy of note. It certainly stacks up next to any Dynamic I've heard. I can only imagine how good the higher end ones are. It's not hyperbole to believe they'd best basically anything I've reviewed as I keep going higher and higher in the 'stat chain.

I certainly think the LCD2 is overall better for me than the 407, but to say it's clearly better is a stretch. I say its better for my preference, but the 407 is technically masterful, and I don't hear any main issues with it in it's SQ. The mids aren't as forward as the LCD2, it doesn't have the body or the bass fullness, but the treble is certainly the best I've ever heard. A product of it's electrostatic design, I bet. It does sound a bit 2 dimensional and flat, and more headphone-like than the LCD2, so it's imaging isn't near the best.

I applaud you for avoiding the collector mentality. That's a real hard thing to do around here. My problem is I haven't found anything that is great over everything, so instead I use the mentality of "use the right tool for the job." In that sense, I don't think I'll own cans that overlap with each other in terms of situation.

I know you've talked to great lengths about this already, so I'm not looking to spur up old conversation, but I don't think I'll really understand why you got rid of the Annie considering how much you loved it.
post #13150 of 37437
Thread Starter 
It's simple. I couldn't afford both the Annie and LCD2. If I could afford two headphones that cater to mostly the same things, I would've kept them.

Like you, I don't like owning two headphones that I like for basically the same reasons.

As for full sized, I'm more likely to own one fun/bassy, one balanced, and one closed/portable. Basically 3 headphones in an ideal world where I have that much disposable income. For now, I choose to settle with one stellar all rounder, possibly with a secondary.

Like I said, if I didn't have ANYTHING right now, and only had $600, the Annie would be that headphone (with an entry desktop amp/dac). It is that headophone that I consioder jack of all trades, master of none.

Fun but not as much as the LCD2/D7000, detailed, but not as much as the Stax 407, open, but not as open as the Q701/AD700, comfy, but not as comfy as the KSC75 (or KSC35 with 75's clips), etc. It's not the best at any one thing, but it does so many things well, people shopuld look into it if they believe they are a one headphone type person.
post #13151 of 37437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post
I could never afford any of those alone, lol.

Hyperbole, when nothing outside of the Denon and AD700 has had a perfect score in a rating? All the ones I mentioned have averaged to like an 8 or 8.5.

A great headphone is a great headphone. I'm not a typical head-fier, fickle in what they like, then don't like. As soon as they they a new headphone, the last one is suddenly not worthwhile. That's the sort of mentality you SHOULD avoid. So because I like new headphones, and still see how amazing the older ones are, it's hyperbole? Please.

It's not like all the sudden the last headphone lost it's quality.

I may get excited about a new product, yet I don't dismiss what I've felt was great to begin with. The AD700 was my first main headphone, yet it remains the king of competitive gaming for me, so many years later. My ears have gained enough experience to hear and understand their faults (as with any headphone), but I wouldn't ever dismiss them (or any headphone I've felt was good).

If I can personally point out my main fault, it'd be that I'm a slave to my impulses in trying new headphones. Just so happens, that I've chosen/heard consistently better and better (with a few exceptions (like the Mad Dogs, which I like but don't find to be a giant killer like people wanna lead others to believe).

As with every headphone, I'm quick to point out their faults, as well as their strengths. The only headphone I've really truly gushed about lately has been the Annie, and that's because it's almost everything anyone can ask for in a balanced headphone, IMHO. If I only had like $600 and no current gear without being able to get anything after, I'd buy the Annie with a Modi/Magni. In a heartbeat. The Annie IS the best headphone I've heard in their price range that does everything I want.

The 407 has it's faults too, but it IS an electrostatic headphone worthy of note. It certainly stacks up next to any Dynamic I've heard. I can only imagine how good the higher end ones are. It's not hyperbole to believe they'd best basically anything I've reviewed as I keep going higher and higher in the 'stat chain.

I certainly think the LCD2 is overall better for me than the 407, but to say it's clearly better is a stretch. I say its better for my preference, but the 407 is technically masterful, and I don't hear any main issues with it in it's SQ. The mids aren't as forward as the LCD2, it doesn't have the body or the bass fullness, but the treble is certainly the best I've ever heard. A product of it's electrostatic design, I bet. It does sound a bit 2 dimensional and flat, and more headphone-like than the LCD2, so it's imaging isn't near the best.

 

It's rare here on Head-Fi that anyone makes the distinction between "subjectively better" and "technically better", and I applaud you for that. Too many people have this weird expectation of other people having the exact same preferences they do when giving out recommendations. Especially when it concerns bass; I think that's part of the reason people tend to think Stax sets are bass-lean, even though they still have noticeably more than the AD700 on the low end. It just tends to lack some of the tactility (is that the "body" and "fullness" people here speak of?) at the same level of volume.

 

The SR-202 and HE-400 weren't exactly my cup of tea, after all, but I could understand why people liked them and wouldn't hesitate to recommend them myself. And while the AD700 soon found itself utterly trounced, it has the advantage of being significantly cheaper and much more sensitive (read: not picky about amplification), thus making it easier to recommend to people who are into competitive gaming.

 

And I know that feeling in wanting to try out new headphones, all too well...but my wallet is just way too thin for that. It's already a major fluke that I bought an SR-Lambda and SRD-7/SB for a mere $250, less than most of the "mid-fi" dynamic and ortho sets mentioned here (which tend to shoot up to $300-400). That doesn't include the receiver I'm using to power the transformer box, but I had one lying around otherwise unused.

 

Also speaking of cost, that's one big reason I favor just having the one "all-rounder" set with a few secondaries for portable use. $250 was already a lot for me to spend on a headphone system, even though it's peanuts to most Head-Fi folk, and the way I look at it is that if the headphone's more expensive for being technically superior, then I EXPECT it to excel at multiple things, otherwise it's just overpriced.

post #13152 of 37437
Even if a headphone is categorically flawless and technically perfect, you will get bored of it eventually if it is the only thing you have. Perhaps not in a few weeks or months, but certainly in a few years.

That's when you realize the application should supercede the equipment and you probably need to back away from the hobby for a while.

Hm, this makes me want to sell everything but my JH13s again..

You should probably get the K702-65, appreciate how they have no weaknesses or faults from your point of view, and just appreciate the sweet gaming and music.
Edited by 3X0 - 4/20/13 at 11:27am
post #13153 of 37437

I see the term 'technically better' thrown around on head-fi too many times, and it's usually people using it as a subjective means-- not that I'm saying this is one of those moments.

 

Technicalities are based on facts, and only something like objective graphs can convey a technicality.  I keep hearing things like 'he-400 is technically better than the hd600, it has better instrument separation, clarity and bass texture.'  'hd600 is technically better than the he-400, it's more balanced and has a larger soundstage.'  I see it thrown around for akgs, audeze phones, sennheiser-- the whole deal.

 

It drives me up the wall!

post #13154 of 37437
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMRaven View Post

I see the term 'technically better' thrown around on head-fi too many times, and it's usually people using it as a subjective means-- not that I'm saying this is one of those moments.

Technicalities are based on facts, and only something like objective graphs can convey a technicality.  I keep hearing things like 'he-400 is technically better than the hd600, it has better instrument separation, clarity and bass texture.'  'hd600 is technically better than the he-400, it's more balanced and has a larger soundstage.'  I see it thrown around for akgs, audeze phones, sennheiser-- the whole deal.

It drives me up the wall!
Correct. Assertions of technical advantage much absolutely be validated with measurements, otherwise such claims are probably less credible and useful than subjective impressions.
post #13155 of 37437
Quote:
Originally Posted by pietcux View Post


Nah, these are quite close to the PRO 900 / 2900 and in regards of soundstaging. Have them allgs1000.gif. Have at least 7.5 points for competetive. And remeber these are closed, so the staging must be kind of limited. And btw you need to get used to the S-logic driver placement. That needs to happen in your brain and can take some hours.

 

I don't doubt the PRO900/2900 but I haven't tried them. My distaste for the PRO 550 drew me away. I may have overreacted by saying the soundstage was "terrible" but it was definitely disappointing, however. They also lacked highs, IMO, and were quite bass heavy.

 

They were fun cans, no doubt, but didn't fit my taste. I would give the soundstage more of a 6 than a 7.5. But then again, at the time I was used to sound whoring cans like the AD700...and now currently own the Q701. I guess open cans are my preference, especially for gaming. Which is crazy because I like closed cans for when listening to music. I had purchased the PRO 550 solely for that purpose, and was still disappointed. Maybe it WAS the S-logic driver placement that threw me off... but who knows because they are long gone, now tongue.gif


Edited by Change is Good - 4/20/13 at 11:55am
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