Diary of a Madman (My wild one day CES ride) - Page 3

Originally Posted by Anaxilus 

Not necessarily.  Remember, when monitoring studio music you want to make out finer details.  Sometimes this means touching up the treble a bit, leaning out the low end, etc.  You want uber clarity yes, but transparency, as in getting 'lost' in your music, is not necessary or even desired for a professional mixing tool.  I'm notorious for bad car analogies so here is another one.  Imagine you want to buy the 'best' car.  Another person says, check out this new Ferrari.  It has the best 0-60, best skidpad performance and best braking.  So you go for a test drive and you realize you can't carry your luggage and golf clubs, it only seats two, gets terrible mileage and hurts your back getting in and out.  The Ferrari is the 'best' car as a 'tool' for a specific purpose.  To live with as a daily driver is another matter.  YMMV, no pun intended.    Hope that makes some sense.

Originally Posted by Anaxilus 

No worries.  For mixing and tracking get the UEIERM IMO.  Let's look at the cymbal example.  First, unless you were at the actual recording event there is no way to know exactly how the actual source sounded.  I was going by samples I am familiar with but did not record myself.  There is also the debate about what is 'accurate' to the source versus what is 'accurate' to the recording.  I reference an article from Stereophile comparing the Koss ESP950 and Stax Lambdas on the matter here.  Scroll down half way to 'Is it real..."  To paraphrase:

 

"The question still remained, however: Which set of headphones was the more accurate? My final conclusion came down on the side of the Staxes, but it was not without some degree of uncertainty. The Kosses seemed to err slightly on the warm side of neutral at the low end, while the Staxes sounded a bit leaner than the live piano. The top end of the Kosses seemed closer to what I was hearing from the piano itself, with the Staxes slightly emphasizing air and ambience. But one additional variable—difficult to judge precisely—seemed to tilt the balance in favor of the Staxes: the sound of the Manley mike. Judging from how it compared with the sound of the B&K omnis, it would seem to have a trace of leanness in the bass. David Manley also indicated that, like many condenser mikes, it has a small rise on top—perhaps +2dB at 12kHz—resulting in slightly lean bass and a slight increase in top-end air.

This sounded very much like my impression of the Stax headphones compared with the live sound. The Staxes thus appeared to be telling me what the mikes were picking up. The Kosses, in contrast, were just a bit sweeter, warmer, and more forgiving..."

 

So IERM to my ears sounds more akin to what a mic would pick up.  They sound fantastic and wring ever bit of detail out they can but I as often feel like I am not actually there hearing the performance in a transcendent way.  The ES5 on the other hand does that.  They are less concerned w/ spatial cues to the n'th degree but more so w/ the overall atmosphere and sound as a cohesive, natural entity.  So back to the cymbals, the IERM might sound more accurate along the FR or add a bit more sparkle to enhance the detail for effect, but the ES5 gives it weight and body impressing upon you the feeling it is ringing right next to you in a room you are actually in.  From the impact of the strike to the richness of its reverberations.  It's really two different things.  Like being analytical versus Intuitive.  On one hand you listen and perceive everything you are able to take in that is presented.  On the other hand you don't so much as listen, the music just washes over you and it takes you there.  If you are looking for something to do both, I haven't heard it yet.  It seems to be a rather zero sum game from my listening experience where compromises have to be made.  So for what you are asking for, the IERM is the better choice IMHO.

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict 

What you're missing here is that the ES5 as a full dual-bore custom IEM is even better sounding and more detailed than the demo version. I think they are my best custom IEM, and could be used by audiophiles, musicians, and mixers. I do think your descriptions of the differences in universal demos is good, but I thought the UE RM demos were not as good as the ES5 demos or actual custom for my enjoyment.

Originally Posted by daveDerek 

SC, you've undoubtedly read (and read and read....) impressions posted throughout this website. methinks you'll just have to either pull the trigger at some point, or better yet go to a big show and listen for yourself prior to making a decision!  too bad you weren't at ces (or rocky mntn or canjam or .....).

Originally Posted by Sinocelt 

Too bad going to any of those shows would cost me as much as buying both the IERM and the ES5.

Originally Posted by daveDerek 

 

yeah, but you'd have a good time answering your questions, and then you could start a thread abut your awesome experience!

Originally Posted by daveDerek 

 

maybe you should just buy the jh-3a and be done with it. the demo es5 i heard was excellent, and that was comparing it to my jh13s (and you have a pretty good idea just how good those are), but the jh-3a is a game changer. from what i've heard, the ue ierm is quite special too.

Originally Posted by daveDerek 

maybe you should just get them all, and then get back to us.

Originally Posted by Sinocelt 

Thank you again, Anaxilus. Yes, I understand better now. By the way, just like you, I'm interested in UE's silicone option, but the latest email I got from them on that very subject doesn't bode well for a prompt release, in spite of what they'd told me in October.
 

 

Actually, Anaxilus said the same, about the enjoyment part: that he preferred the ES5. But enjoyment may not be my priority. You do mention "mixers" in your post; so how would you compare the ES5 and the IERM from a mixer's point of view?

 

OK, maybe I should be more specific. Here's my situation: I work as an Assistant Professor of French, and moonlight as a translator. I also used to work as a voice actor for New York Audio Productions, before I left the States. Since then, I've only worked on audio projects for my university, but later this year, I'll have the opportunity to record audiobooks for my favorite author: Orson Scott Card. I've got thousands of dollars to invest to start with. By the end of January, I'll receive a pre-selection of different microphones, among which I'll get to pick a few (for three to four thousand dollars) before sending back the rest. That's the first task for which I'll need customs. The second task will be tracking (and since I'll be recording myself, enjoyment can actually matter, as I'm likely to perform better if I like what I hear) then "mixing" (if I don't let someone with more technical expertise take care of this stage of the project; I probably will).

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict 

 

Well, I don't do mixing. But my logic is that I'd be afraid that with my JH13Pro or UE11Pro that they would have me add too much mids and too little bass to the mix, because of their sonic balance is geared towards having louder bass than mids. And mixing with the ES3X might result in mixing in too little mids into the recording because of their forward mids. The ES5 seem better balanced to me than the others, and sound very accurate to me along with great speed and micro detail, so I figured they'd work well in that regard. Truth be told, there may be a warm tint added with the ES5 and a slight boost in the treble sparkle, but that depends on my source and amp as well, and it's not very pronounced. I thought the UE RM demos sounded a little colder, but not thin or bright. As far as enjoyment goes, I preferred the UE18 demos over the RM (JH16 demos too).

Originally Posted by cooperpwc 

Interesting. I personally don't find the ES5 treble to be especially bright. But it is quite lovely.

 

(I may be influenced by the fact that my main full-size cans are the DT880/600s which are famously on the slightly bright side - although not so much with USB Monica which synergises with them nicely.)