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***Earbud Guide - 22 Earbuds compared*** - Page 26

post #376 of 592

BXIII is supposed to come out end of this year but they are holding off for the right release date. They told me the flagship may be released early this year but one year has passed and they still don't know how manufacture it, it may take another year or never get released. I found burn-in on my buds, tm5, ok2, m2c all has the same effect:

 

70h, show full potential

300h, develop a smooth fluid like sound, very pleasant but somewhat sticky

550h, dynamics show up and that's when you can begin to appreciate sound stage and layering, individual instrument is integrated and stands alone

750h, the sound is completely integrated, soundstage maximized, more refinement, more instrument noticeable, more details, before the presentation is great but the sound is grainy

1200h, continued refinement, more instrument noticeable, more details, the sound becomes tangible 

2000h, continued refinement, more instrument noticeable, more details, the sound settles with no further noticeable change

 

I guess people don't believe in burning in partly because they just are too lazy or they expect drastic changes over one day. Depends on how sensitive your ears are, it can be very noticeable but certainly not day and night over just  one day. That's why I suggest give it try, it won't kills buds or player. I burnt my m2c, ok2 on near maximum volume on nano4, they didn't break (why should they?). Other than recharging three hours a day, my nano4 run on purely battery non-stop for two months, it didn't break. And I tested the battery life, same album, same volume, still 28 hours.

 

 

I have sent a review package with a 800h m2c included, wait see how they respond.

 


Edited by kanonathena - 12/7/11 at 11:39pm
post #377 of 592
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kanonathena View Post

BXIII is supposed to come out end of this year but they are holding off for the right release date. They told me the flagship may be released early this year but one year has passed and they still don't know how manufacture it, it may take another year or never get released. I found burn-in on my buds, tm5, ok2, m2c all has the same effect:

 

70h, show full potential

300h, develop a smooth fluid like sound, very pleasant but somewhat sticky

550h, dynamics show up and that's when you can begin to appreciate sound stage and layering, individual instrument is integrated and stands alone

750h, the sound is completely integrated, more refinement, more instrument noticeable, more details, before the presentation is great but the sound is grainy

1200h, continued refinement, more instrument noticeable, more details, the sound becomes tangible 

2000h, continued refinement, more instrument noticeable, more details, the sound settles with no further noticeable change

 

I guess people don't believe in burning in partly because they just are too lazy or they expect drastic changes over one day. Depends on how sensitive your ears are, it can be very noticeable but certainly not day and night. That's why I suggest give it try, it won't kills buds or player. I burnt my m2c, ok2 on near maximum volume on nano4, they didn't break (why should they?). Other than recharging three hours a day, my nano4 run on purely battery non-stop for two months, it didn't break. And I tested the battery life, same album, same volume, still 28 hours.

 

 

I have sent a review package with a 800h m2c included, wait see how they respond.

 

 


 

 

I've been in this game for neigh two decades and never once heard any difference after a day or two.  Beyond that, there are no differences that I have ever been able to measure or hear.  If you can hear that, you are either a computer or not human and I envy you beyond imagining.  My M2C sounds no different post 48 hours or so of burn in.  They have at least 500 hours on them, a few hours a day for upwards of the four months I've owned them.  Measurements are identical.

 

A lot of people do not believe in it because not one person has been able or willing to provide any evidence of such drastic changes.  Burn in is definitely authentic, but not as audible as people think.  Nobody on this earth has ears sensitive enough to hear the differences from some odd number like 300 to 500 hours, let alone 1000 to 2000 hours.  There is no way your audio memory is that god like so I attribute any difference in sound you are hearing as purely psychological.  Your ears adjusted over time, not the piece of gear.  Earpad leather or velour softened or stiffened over time, which allowed for the driver to physically lay closer or further away, just as if you press your new headphones into your head.  They will sound different if you push them closer than if you let them rest naturally.  Foam inside deteriorates, wires degrade, grounding and solder wears and tears, kinks in the cable, there are tons of physical problems that cause what people feel to be "burn in" when they actually are not authentic changes in the drivers.

 

 

post #378 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by swbf2cheater View Post

 


 

 

I've been in this game for neigh two decades and never once heard any difference after a day or two.  Beyond that, there are no differences that I have ever been able to measure or hear.  If you can hear that, you are either a computer or not human and I envy you beyond imagining.  My M2C sounds no different post 48 hours or so of burn in.  They have at least 500 hours on them, a few hours a day for upwards of the four months I've owned them.  Measurements are identical.

 

A lot of people do not believe in it because not one person has been able or willing to provide any evidence of such drastic changes.  Burn in is definitely authentic, but not as audible as people think.  Nobody on this earth has ears sensitive enough to hear the differences from some odd number like 300 to 500 hours, let alone 1000 to 2000 hours.  There is no way your audio memory is that god like so I attribute any difference in sound you are hearing as purely psychological.  Your ears adjusted over time, not the piece of gear.  Earpad leather or velour softened or stiffened over time, which allowed for the driver to physically lay closer or further away, just as if you press your new headphones into your head.  They will sound different if you push them closer than if you let them rest naturally.  Foam inside deteriorates, wires degrade, grounding and solder wears and tears, kinks in the cable, there are tons of physical problems that cause what people feel to be "burn in" when they actually are not authentic changes in the drivers.

 

 


rhydon says the magnum drivers change for up to a month. I tend to believe the guy that designs the drivers :)

 

post #379 of 592


I don't know all the technical ins and outs of drivers...but drivers do move correct? 

Quote:
Originally Posted by swbf2cheater View Post

 


 

 

I've been in this game for neigh two decades and never once heard any difference after a day or two.  Beyond that, there are no differences that I have ever been able to measure or hear.  If you can hear that, you are either a computer or not human and I envy you beyond imagining.  My M2C sounds no different post 48 hours or so of burn in.  They have at least 500 hours on them, a few hours a day for upwards of the four months I've owned them.  Measurements are identical.

 

A lot of people do not believe in it because not one person has been able or willing to provide any evidence of such drastic changes.  Burn in is definitely authentic, but not as audible as people think.  Nobody on this earth has ears sensitive enough to hear the differences from some odd number like 300 to 500 hours, let alone 1000 to 2000 hours.  There is no way your audio memory is that god like so I attribute any difference in sound you are hearing as purely psychological.  Your ears adjusted over time, not the piece of gear.  Earpad leather or velour softened or stiffened over time, which allowed for the driver to physically lay closer or further away, just as if you press your new headphones into your head.  They will sound different if you push them closer than if you let them rest naturally.  Foam inside deteriorates, wires degrade, grounding and solder wears and tears, kinks in the cable, there are tons of physical problems that cause what people feel to be "burn in" when they actually are not authentic changes in the drivers.

 

 



 

post #380 of 592
Thread Starter 

I tend to trust guys like Tyll who provide accurate measurements that support burn in over the course of a short period of time over anyone who has yet to do so.  If Rhydon has an immensely sensitive laser that can measure the length a diaphragm ( or any moving part ) changes from stock to X amount of hours later, I would be one happy audiophile.  If there are changes in the amount of space any moving parts undergo then they should parallel any sonic measurements as well.  Those physical changes are so small I just can't believe they are audible.

 

 


Edited by swbf2cheater - 12/8/11 at 12:45am
post #381 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by swbf2cheater View Post

I tend to trust guys like Tyll who provide accurate measurements that support burn in over the course of a short period of time over anyone who has yet to do so.  If Rhydon has an immensely sensitive laser that can measure the length a diaphragm ( or any moving part ) changes from stock to X amount of hours later, I would be one happy audiophile.  If there are changes in the amount of space any moving parts undergo then they should parallel any sonic measurements as well.  Those physical changes are so small I just can't believe they are audible.

 

 


Then what is that? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jxdOEpiCTs&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

 

P.S. I have my cheap chinese 9$ headphones for 4 years now and at the begining I did heard a difference in their sound at around 80 hours of usage. Maybe more than 100 Hr  is overkill and not so many people will hear the difference, but that doesen't mean there won't be any.

 

post #382 of 592
Thread Starter 

Then you are I are on the same page and believe the same thing, My number was 50, yours was 100 hours, not really that different at all in my experiences. I don't believe the small physical changes are audible over that drastic period of time.  Whether they exist or not is not what we are talking about, its if they are audible in time increments from stock to 50 hours, 50-x amount of hours and so on.  I don't believe anyone's ears are that sensitive and i really dont believe anyone here is a savant with an exceptional god like mind capable of remembering what something sounded like 1000 to 2000 hours prior and everything in between.  Of course you will hear the difference between stock and 1000 hours but that wasn't what I was debating,  I want to know if 50 hours sounds audibly different from 1000 hours and if you can tell which one is more or less " burn in " at specific times during the process.  

 

I said I didn't hear any change in the majority of my headphones after 50 hours.  Tyll did not test it in increments and take measurements at each point.  I would love to see him do this for us.  Maybe someone can ask him to try that out next time, stock to 50 hours, 50 hours to 100, 100 to 200 ect ect.  My word isn't law, I didn't brandish it as absolute truth lol im not God so please do not take it as undeniable truth.  It is simply my experience through my ears.  In the case of earbuds, this is an especially firm observation for me.  Their parts are even smaller yet and would physically move less over time vs a full size.

 

 

 

 

 

 

post #383 of 592

It would be interesting to know from an actual developer how this process works.  If the moving driver isn't the explanation of how the sound changes, I couldn't possibly imagine what else would make that happen.  I always assumed that as a driver had the ability to move and settle into a position that's what caused the slight sound change.  There are very few headphones I've ever owned that I truly noticed sound change over time.  Most are very subtle and I assumed that maybe my hearing was just adjusting to the headphone.  But the Edition 8 there was no doubt.  The bass changed very noticeably over time.  And I am positive there was about a 20 hour period in that process where the mids went way to the back and then came back.  That could have been all in my head...who knows.  Doesn't the VModa M80 have it's own developed driver?  Perhaps he would be a good person to give a definitive answer. 

post #384 of 592

swbf2cheater I don't want to argue. I just want to mention that there is no two identical pair of ears on earth. Everybody hears different.

 

Here is some science materials on this problem from soviet union. It basically shows the frequency response of an average human.

 

1d0e60e0_c02b14f1cac3.gif


Edited by TiEx - 12/8/11 at 5:30am
post #385 of 592
Thread Starter 

I implied that my experience could be different from yours and my word is not the undisputed truth in my last comment :\  so yes, I of course agree.  

post #386 of 592

id like to add that my mx980 is so impressive, that it had survived a lot of drops and falls.

post #387 of 592
Thread Starter 

AMAZING Dunu mystery earbud added

post #388 of 592

Hmmm... With "bright", do you mean something similar to the 9wave studio? They have gotten less and less listening time from me. The 9wave have a strong focus on treble, but not in a very "finesseful" way like the vintage Aiwa HP-D9. The 9wave sounds quite harsh and sibilant, something that the Aiwa D9 manages to avoid while being focused on the same sort of sound signature. I like the detail and spaciousness that focus on treble can produce, but not the harshness that often is the result. The Aiwa D9 never sounds harsh or silibant and the only EQing needed is to compensate for the weak bass response.

 

Do you know how the impedance is with the new Dunu earbuds?

post #389 of 592
Thread Starter 

I know absolutely nothing about them.  They are brighter than the 9wave and yes, they can be harsh but the 9wave are just not as nice and will be nasty no matter what you EQ with,  These Dunu have loads of treble and upper mid range and with a slight EQ tweak, toggling the highs down a little, the experience is very nice.  Definitely worth it to my ears.  They may be too harsh for some but I love bright treble, gives me the ability to toggle eq to my liking and not sacrifice quality. 

 

 

post #390 of 592

Have you tried them out of an ordinary MP3 player? I heard that the new Dunu have got an impedance around 150ohms.

 

How is the soundstage compared to the M2C?

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