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Amps that can drive the HiFiMan HE-6 planar headphones - Page 43

post #631 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarsHP View Post

In that case, I'd save my money and buy a less expensive headphone - perhaps the HE-500 - and get a good amp to drive it (assuming you already have a good source already). It's a chain of components that makes the sound and thus determines sound quality. Headphones are the most determining in terms of sound character and quality, but they still need reasonably good amps and sources to play what and how they can.

I'm currently planning on getting the HE-400, it's efficiency, comfort, and similar sound for a cheaper price is just too good to pass IMO. I'm still considering the HE-500/HE-6, but I will most likely go for the HE-400.

post #632 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoupRKnowva View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by moodyrn View Post

I remember reading a few times about you commenting on the need of resistors to protect otl amps. I'm I'm a little confused. I know some time ago there was a hot topic about the need to protect against transformer couple tube amps, and the need to protect the transformers. So have I missed something in regards to otl amps? In what ways do otl amps need to be protected?

You dont really need resistors to protect OTL amps, the tubes are just fine driving the high impedance load of the HE-6s, and will typically perform much better than.

The reason why you need the resistors is that in transformer coupled amps, they design the taps on the transformers for certain loads, and if you present a higher load, it overloads the transformer, so you put the resistors in to bring that down so that you dont hurt the transformer, but in the process you waste most ofthe power just as heat in the resistor

Okay I had that backwards, sorry. I use resistors on my SS speaker amp (now through the speaker taps of the WEE) just to equalize the impedance regardless, it satisfies my OCD if nothing else.

What is Skylab's Leben, it must be transformer coupled? I remember that he stopped using the speaker taps for the HE6 because of this issue.


Quote:
Originally Posted by daniel521 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by LarsHP View Post

In that case, I'd save my money and buy a less expensive headphone - perhaps the HE-500 - and get a good amp to drive it (assuming you already have a good source already). It's a chain of components that makes the sound and thus determines sound quality. Headphones are the most determining in terms of sound character and quality, but they still need reasonably good amps and sources to play what and how they can.
I'm currently planning on getting the HE-400, it's efficiency, comfort, and similar sound for a cheaper price is just too good to pass IMO. I'm still considering the HE-500/HE-6, but I will most likely go for the HE-400.

The HE6 can be driven quite well from the right $200 speaker amp.

Bridge two mono guitar amps? Hmm...
popcorn.gif
Edited by grokit - 10/30/12 at 5:10pm
post #633 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by daniel521 View Post

I'm currently planning on getting the HE-400, it's efficiency, comfort, and similar sound for a cheaper price is just too good to pass IMO. I'm still considering the HE-500/HE-6, but I will most likely go for the HE-400.

The HE400 and HE600 are not that similar. They do share some qualities but if you A/B them you would not characterize them as the same signature. 

 

 

On another note has there been anyone other then elwappo99 (i think thats the user) who has tried the emotiva mini-x with the HE6?

post #634 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by rawrster View Post

The HE400 and HE600 are not that similar. They do share some qualities but if you A/B them you would not characterize them as the same signature. 

 

 

On another note has there been anyone other then elwappo99 (i think thats the user) who has tried the emotiva mini-x with the HE6?

Nope, Mikek200 owns that combo. But he's in NY (Sandy blackouts)....

post #635 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxper View Post

Nope, Mikek200 owns that combo. But he's in NY (Sandy blackouts)....

 

I'm guessing no one else owns that combo. At that price there isn't much to lose. I'll probably end up with the amp before I get the adapter cable to use it. At a bit more than $200 shipped not much to lose.

post #636 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by rawrster View Post

 

I'm guessing no one else owns that combo. At that price there isn't much to lose. I'll probably end up with the amp before I get the adapter cable to use it. At a bit more than $200 shipped not much to lose.

I think Sphinx just ordered one, I could be mistaken. Haha

post #637 of 3230

He did except it's for speakers and not headphones :P

post #638 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by rawrster View Post

The HE400 and HE600 are not that similar. They do share some qualities but if you A/B them you would not characterize them as the same signature. 

 

 

On another note has there been anyone other then elwappo99 (i think thats the user) who has tried the emotiva mini-x with the HE6?

 

 

Dag man - here goes this headphone again.  I still can't find it on the Head Direct site.  Where are you guys getting this new HiFiMan Headphone fromwink_face.gif

post #639 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by rawrster View Post

He did except it's for speakers and not headphones :P

Ah, I must have missed that bit. I think Morbid use to own the mini-x and HE-6. (Really trying here) biggrin.gif

post #640 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxper View Post

Ah, I must have missed that bit. I think Morbid use to own the mini-x and HE-6. (Really trying here) biggrin.gif
LOL! Thank you for this.
post #641 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by grokit View Post


What is Skylab's Leben, it must be transformer coupled? I remember that he stopped using the speaker taps for the HE6 because of this issue.

Yes his leben is transformer coupled.
post #642 of 3230

Hello,

 

I own a HE500 and I don't have a amplifier for it.

 

It's interesting to buy directly a speaker amp for it ?

 

Cordially

post #643 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by grokit View Post

What is Skylab's Leben, it must be transformer coupled? I remember that he stopped using the speaker taps for the HE6 because of this issue.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by moodyrn View Post

Yes his leben is transformer coupled.

 

Any tube experts out there?  I think I have my head around this, direct drive from speaker taps on transformer coupled tube amps is "depends"...  Take it all with a grain of salt, I'm pretty much self-taught on DIY tubes over the last 15 years, I'm not an engineer.

 

Four items go into the mix:

 - primary impedance of the output transformer

 - secondary impedance of the output transformer

 - the impedance of the attached output device

 - tube operating points (the impedance that the output tubes like to "see")

 

For the Leben CS300 and HE-6:

 - transformer is probably 8k primary impedance for the EL84's (big assumption, but a common sweet spot for PP).

 - output impedance selectable 4/6/8 ohm (assume 8 ohms used)

 - HE-6 impedance = 50 ohm

 

The ratio of the impedence mis-match of the output device to the output tap =  50 ohms / 8 ohms = 6.25

Thus, the "reflected" primary impedance that the tubes "see" is (very roughly) 6.25 * 8,000 = 50,000 ohms. 

 

Waaaay more impedance than those EL84's want to see.  The amp is going to run hot; that's when bad things happen.  Also, the transformer is being operated ouside of design parameters, the frequency balance will tip "up" and the transformer will saturate at a higher low frequency output (higher bass roll-off, probably less noticeable on headphone draw than on speakers). 

 

The Hifiman "box" and other DIY solutions rely on reducing the impedance placed on the secondary, probably by running a resistor across the output (parallel). I'm sure they use a more sophisticated circuit to reduce noise as well, but that's the gist of it.  In the above Leben/HE-6 example, I would use a "box" or use output transformers with a 50 ohm (or close) tap.

 

 

 

I am thinking of running the HE-5LE directly off of speaker taps, but the ratios look much better for my application.  Running a DIY push-pull 300B amp, class AB1

 

 - transformer primary = 4300;  lowish for 300B's in PP

 - output impedance selectable 8/16 ohm (will use 16 ohms)

 - HE-5LE impedance  = 38 ohms

 

ratio of 38 to 16 is a much more manageable 2.375;  "reflected" impedance that the primary "sees" is (roughly) 10,000 ohms.     While it's not an optimum operating point, it's within the "normal" curves for a pair of 300B's in push-pull.  Again, since the transformer is being operated outside of its design parameters, frequency response might get funky, but my head is liable to saturate at output levels well before the transformers do . 

 

 Make sense, or I am full of it? (don't answer that biggrin.gif )

post #644 of 3230

ok, burn in for almost 3 weeks. this is my impression.

 

when i used master 6 paired with ref 1 via acss cable, it gives you neutral, detailed transparent.  this is the same impression as other users

found at master 5/6/8 thread. i turned the volumn to 42/70.

if no comparison, , i will find master 6 is ok for he-6. ( in fact, master 6 is very good to drive hd650). 

 

but when i used audio-gd c501 (250 w/ch) paired with ref 1 via acss cable, speaker output via hifiman adapter with cheap 7' speaker cable, this is really another league. i turned the volumn to 16/70.

 

i can hear he-6 gives you layer to layer endless power ,plus detail, and transparent, huge soundstage, darker background, a little little tube amp.warm.  

you feel  you are listening to a speaker, not a headphone. Use speaker amp, the weight that master 6 cant give this quantity when c501 was  turned to lower volumn 10/70..

 

- bad/good recording - absolute no forgiving, , , 

- for vocal - will prefer 300b tube amp to drive he-6, this is coloured that c501 wont offer.

- orchestral classical  - he-6 already very high quality , like  you were sitting 10 rows before the stage, if  hd800 to listen to orchestrail classical ,like you were

  sitting 30 rows before the stage. 

- treble - this is weaker ,  hd800 can offer transparency treble. (possible need more time to burn-in, i had audition another he6 before, the treble was quite transparent.)

- body weight - both hd800 and he-6 got 10 stars out of 10 , both really need speaker amp to drive. 

 

i think if you consider this speaker amp as head amp , price is very attractive. i had audition phonitor paired with he-6. price is nearly the same. but 

phonitor gives less body weight, congested details, less punchy. and dont forget, i can set a speaker later on. 

 

 

700

 

next project - 1. change to jumper connector, try to get rid of hifiman adapter, speaker output directly to he-6, this is the first  priorty i want to try. 

 

2. buy a speaker to fully use this 38 kgs tank.

3. sell this c501 and got a master 3 power amp from audio-gd ( it will take a long time until i can sell this amp.)

post #645 of 3230
Quote:
Originally Posted by colour97 View Post

ok, burn in for almost 3 weeks. this is my impression.

 

when i used master 6 paired with ref 1 via acss cable, it gives you neutral, detailed transparent.  this is the same impression as other users

found at master 5/6/8 thread. i turned the volumn to 42/70.

if no comparison, , i will find master 6 is ok for he-6. ( in fact, master 6 is very good to drive hd650). 

 

but when i used audio-gd c501 (250 w/ch) paired with ref 1 via acss cable, speaker output via hifiman adapter with cheap 7' speaker cable, this is really another league. i turned the volumn to 16/70.

 

i can hear he-6 gives you layer to layer endless power ,plus detail, and transparent, huge soundstage, darker background, a little little tube amp.warm.  

you feel  you are listening to a speaker, not a headphone. Use speaker amp, the weight that master 6 cant give this quantity when c501 was  turned to lower volumn 10/70..

 

- bad/good recording - absolute no forgiving, , , 

- for vocal - will prefer 300b tube amp to drive he-6, this is coloured that c501 wont offer.

- orchestral classical  - he-6 already very high quality , like  you were sitting 10 rows before the stage, if  hd800 to listen to orchestrail classical ,like you were

  sitting 30 rows before the stage. 

- treble - this is weaker ,  hd800 can offer transparency treble. (possible need more time to burn-in, i had audition another he6 before, the treble was quite transparent.)

- body weight - both hd800 and he-6 got 10 stars out of 10 , both really need speaker amp to drive. 

 

i think if you consider this speaker amp as head amp , price is very attractive. i had audition phonitor paired with he-6. price is nearly the same. but 

phonitor gives less body weight, congested details, less punchy. and dont forget, i can set a speaker later on. 

 

 

700

 

next project - 1. change to jumper connector, try to get rid of hifiman adapter, speaker output directly to he-6, this is the first  priorty i want to try. 

 

2. buy a speaker to fully use this 38 kgs tank.

3. sell this c501 and got a master 3 power amp from audio-gd ( it will take a long time until i can sell this amp.)

 

 

So wait.  Did you put the HD800s on that speaker amp as well?

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