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Sennheiser HD650 or HD600 - Do they really need an amp? - Page 2

post #16 of 37


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by harpua View Post

I don't think it's quite fair to categorically rule out all solid state amps as being good matches for the HD600/650's.  For example, many users on this site (not just me) are of the opinion that the Nuforce HDP (DAC/Amp) has a particularly great synergy with the HD650's.  I believe the engineers and designers of the HDP even used the HD650s as one of the headphones they were targeting to sound great with HDP.  In any event, imo, the sound of the HDP with the HD650's is very lush, warm, smooth, transparent, spacious and natural despite the fact that it's a SS and not a tube amp.  Also, imo, the tendency of the HDP to sound somewhat bright and detailed seems to mix quite well and act as somewhat of a counterbalance to the lush warm/dark HD650s.  All imo.

 

I am not trying to say that SS amps is a bad match. However I am trying to state that the ST and M-stage will be a very poor match, from my own experience - which could mean that a lot of amps in the same league will be as well.

There is very much likely a SS amp which will synergize perfectly well, which is what i meant when i wrote that the mids should be in focus and not the highs/lows to remove the veil.

Also the last line I wrote was key; I merely suggested to try a tube amp.

 

However reading my post I can see how it can be interpretted as very anti-SS.
 

post #17 of 37

Wait you want to mix music without an amp and want non coloured sound.

Why am I the only one that thinks about the hd25. These babies are a legend in the pro audio business.

 

To come back to the hd600, I dotn have them but I have the hd580, and they are extremely similar.

Without an amp you will not hear decent bass, I dont have a top quality amp: hifiman ef2 it's barely enough to make them good. I tried them a coupel of times straight out of the pc and it managed to make to music sound boring.

 

 

Honestly if you want neutral and unamped the hd600 would not be your best option. the sony 7506 or hd25 are the most commonly used

post #18 of 37

Why don't you just get a used integrated amp off Ebay? A good Marantz, Rotel or Denon will drive a 650 just fine and sound great as well. Don't be brainwashed into believing you MUST have a dedicated HP amp; it just isn't true.  

post #19 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mong0 View Post


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by harpua View Post

I don't think it's quite fair to categorically rule out all solid state amps as being good matches for the HD600/650's.  For example, many users on this site (not just me) are of the opinion that the Nuforce HDP (DAC/Amp) has a particularly great synergy with the HD650's.  I believe the engineers and designers of the HDP even used the HD650s as one of the headphones they were targeting to sound great with HDP.  In any event, imo, the sound of the HDP with the HD650's is very lush, warm, smooth, transparent, spacious and natural despite the fact that it's a SS and not a tube amp.  Also, imo, the tendency of the HDP to sound somewhat bright and detailed seems to mix quite well and act as somewhat of a counterbalance to the lush warm/dark HD650s.  All imo.

 

I am not trying to say that SS amps is a bad match. However I am trying to state that the ST and M-stage will be a very poor match, from my own experience - which could mean that a lot of amps in the same league will be as well.

There is very much likely a SS amp which will synergize perfectly well, which is what i meant when i wrote that the mids should be in focus and not the highs/lows to remove the veil.

Also the last line I wrote was key; I merely suggested to try a tube amp.

 

However reading my post I can see how it can be interpretted as very anti-SS.
 

Fair enough.
 

post #20 of 37

Man, this thread is just getting me excited. I've been listening to my hd650s out of a misterx portable amp and alien dac while waiting for my new little dot mk4 and musiland monitor 02 to come in....

post #21 of 37

In a word, an emphatic YES. 

post #22 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mong0 View Post


 

 

I am not trying to say that SS amps is a bad match. However I am trying to state that the ST and M-stage will be a very poor match, from my own experience - which could mean that a lot of amps in the same league will be as well.

There is very much likely a SS amp which will synergize perfectly well, which is what i meant when i wrote that the mids should be in focus and not the highs/lows to remove the veil.

Also the last line I wrote was key; I merely suggested to try a tube amp.

 

However reading my post I can see how it can be interpretted as very anti-SS.
 






Wasn't the m-stage based off the linear? That said you can find many posts saying there is good synergy with the hd650 and the m-stage. I have found through some testig that replacing the stock HP cables with a heavily shielded OFCC cable bring the mids to life and keeps the lowend and highs in check. I've tried moderetely shielded silver plated OFCC and while the detail became even clearer, the highs became overbearing at times. I would not rule out SS amps for the senn's. The type of music you play as well as your hearing bias play a bug role In what your preferences can be. Just because you did not like it does not mean they are a bad match. You also mentioned you upgraded the opamp, did you try it stock for a little bit? When going from the ST what did you use for the transport cable?
Did you use the stereo output of the ST? If so, you do realize that the stereo output of the ST has an opamp that the audio passes through right? Your essentially running your music through 2 opamps if that is the case.
Edited by spydur - 12/17/10 at 8:18pm
post #23 of 37

You guys are making me poor... I feel like I should buy an amplifier now... Have to sell some stuff first though. :D

post #24 of 37

It's all depends on the source you gonna attach them to because i'm currently enjoying my HD650 while driving them straight from Auzen X-Fi Prelude sound card

post #25 of 37

don't buy the 555s or 595s

 

you'll only end up selling them.

 

my advice:

 

buy the 600/650s, tough it out for a while, then amp them.

 

Once you get the headphones, everything else will fall into place.


Edited by roker - 12/20/10 at 2:57pm
post #26 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by spydur View Post





Wasn't the m-stage based off the linear? That said you can find many posts saying there is good synergy with the hd650 and the m-stage. I have found through some testig that replacing the stock HP cables with a heavily shielded OFCC cable bring the mids to life and keeps the lowend and highs in check. I've tried moderetely shielded silver plated OFCC and while the detail became even clearer, the highs became overbearing at times. I would not rule out SS amps for the senn's. The type of music you play as well as your hearing bias play a bug role In what your preferences can be. Just because you did not like it does not mean they are a bad match. You also mentioned you upgraded the opamp, did you try it stock for a little bit? When going from the ST what did you use for the transport cable?Did you use the stereo output of the ST? If so, you do realize that the stereo output of the ST has an opamp that the audio passes through right? Your essentially running your music through 2 opamps if that is the case.


If you ask the people know, they will tell you that the BCL is not identical in sound to the m-stage.

 

I dont believe in cables, sorry but im using a belkin interconnect, was like 35$ dollars. And yes but the ST has opamps, but you know what? So does a DacMagic and other popular dacs as well.

 

post #27 of 37

I should have made my post clearer about the Op-amps. the stock op-amp in the ST IMO is terrible. It makes anything sound hollow and lifeless. Most likely the combo used (op-amps) had a bad synergy to begin with. As for cables, i am the first at bat when it comes to being a skeptic. What did i do? i went and bought some el cheapo cables off of Ebay and made my own using the cards plugs. Believe it or not, the type of cable definitely makes a difference in the sound you can "hear" if you know what to listen for. I know i just opened another can of worms, frankly if your ears are sensitive like many here you CAN hear the difference. If not, well then enjoy cheap cables and be content you have reached your sonic plateau.

post #28 of 37



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mong0 View Post

 

The tube amp i got is the Argon HA2. It is only distributed in scandinivia and it has been very newly released so there isnt much information about it on the internet at all. 


it has a Burr Brown Chipset the PCM2702E. with a 16 bit resolution. Sample rate is from 32 to 48. The Tube is a 6N2J from China. The tube is a copy og the USSR built 6N2P. and i agree i sounds great! I have ordered though a originaly heavy duty type tube, a USSR built 6N2P -EV, just to try it out, on other forums its belived to be a better sounding tube. 
 

 

post #29 of 37

Get an asgard! Pretty cheap and drives the hd600/650 very well.

post #30 of 37

The 650s when they are not amp'ed may actually sound worse than other cheaper headphones. When my old amp died I listened to my pair of HD-25's because without an amp they sounded better than my 650s without an amp. But now that I am fully equiped again the 650's are my weapon of choice. When they are properlly powered the 650s are a pair of headphones to fall in love with.

I am currently running:

PC -> Matrix Mini-I -> Lovely Cube Premium -> 650 (soon to be cabled by Chris_Himself)

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