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New Audiolab DAC - Page 2

post #16 of 857
Quote:
Originally Posted by martook View Post



It's pretty amazing how every DAC is better than DAC:s that cost several times as much... Those expensive DACs must be pretty damn bad, I wonder why anyone buys them in the first place when every DAC under $1000 is better?

 

Oppo BDP-95 the best DAC under 2000? Under _5000_ even? What exactly are you basing that statement on? Not reality, that's for sure...

 

I'm sure the MDAC is a great piece of equipment, but it costs what it costs - if you buy a DAC for $800, you get a 800 dollar DAC, not a 2000+ dollar DAC.


I have a PS3 properly connected to AV receiver that in my opinion sounds much better than my friend's Mcintosh cd player which costed more than $4,000 7 or 8 years ago.  Perhaps 7-8 year is too much of variable.  I don't own Oppo, but I heard it many times.  And, to my ears BDP-95 sounded at least good as if not better than brand new Simaudio cd player which costs like 6k.  Well, that was a moderate statement.  Actually, to my humble ears BDP-95 sounded a lot better than that simaudio (or called moon audio?).  

 

So, anything wrong with sharing my opinion here?  Since you pointed me out, I will point you out too.  Do you really believe that you only get what you paid for?  Well, many times, it is a true.  But, even the quality of 15 cents pencil is not same among the various manufactures. Heck, the quality even varies within the same manufacture these days.  I honestly do not believe price = quality.  Have you heard Beosound 9000?  It looks stunning, but it's sound quality is just ok.  And, it costs over 5k. 

 

Isn't it a rewarding experience when you find a good bargain among the floods of over priced hi-fi stuffs? That being said, I have not heard of MDAC, which I made sure in my previous posts.  I'm just excited about it and thinking of pulling the trigger even though it's not officially available in U.S.  And, I have no reason to promote Audiolab products!!  In a way, you are right.  If you pay $800, you get $800 DAC.  However, this is also true.  You can spend $5,000, and get a DAC which sounds worse than $800 DAC.  

 

I even stated that I had concluded "FOR MYSELF" that Oppo was the best for value for DAC.  Do I must back out my opinion with some kind of scientific evidence?  Well, I don't have on!!  However, the recent Stereophile magazine gave it A+ recommendation.  There were two products under $2,000 which received A+ recommendation.  They were Oppo and Sony 5400ES.  The reviewer, who gave A+ to both, actually compared Oppo vs Sony in previous months and liked Oppo better.  Happy now?  I wonder why I even have to "support" my opinion like this.  

 

post #17 of 857

Yes! As a 95 owner biggrin.gif
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by moonsurf View Post


I have a PS3 properly connected to AV receiver that in my opinion sounds much better than my friend's Mcintosh cd player which costed more than $4,000 7 or 8 years ago.  Perhaps 7-8 year is too much of variable.  I don't own Oppo, but I heard it many times.  And, to my ears BDP-95 sounded at least good as if not better than brand new Simaudio cd player which costs like 6k.  Well, that was a moderate statement.  Actually, to my humble ears BDP-95 sounded a lot better than that simaudio (or called moon audio?).  

 

So, anything wrong with sharing my opinion here?  Since you pointed me out, I will point you out too.  Do you really believe that you only get what you paid for?  Well, many times, it is a true.  But, even the quality of 15 cents pencil is not same among the various manufactures. Heck, the quality even varies within the same manufacture these days.  I honestly do not believe price = quality.  Have you heard Beosound 9000?  It looks stunning, but it's sound quality is just ok.  And, it costs over 5k. 

 

Isn't it a rewarding experience when you find a good bargain among the floods of over priced hi-fi stuffs? That being said, I have not heard of MDAC, which I made sure in my previous posts.  I'm just excited about it and thinking of pulling the trigger even though it's not officially available in U.S.  And, I have no reason to promote Audiolab products!!  In a way, you are right.  If you pay $800, you get $800 DAC.  However, this is also true.  You can spend $5,000, and get a DAC which sounds worse than $800 DAC.  

 

I even stated that I had concluded "FOR MYSELF" that Oppo was the best for value for DAC.  Do I must back out my opinion with some kind of scientific evidence?  Well, I don't have on!!  However, the recent Stereophile magazine gave it A+ recommendation.  There were two products under $2,000 which received A+ recommendation.  They were Oppo and Sony 5400ES.  The reviewer, who gave A+ to both, actually compared Oppo vs Sony in previous months and liked Oppo better.  Happy now?  I wonder why I even have to "support" my opinion like this.  

 



 

post #18 of 857
Quote:
Originally Posted by WarrenR View Post

There is no way this DAC is going to be $600-700, it is £600 over here in England.  It will be more like $900+.


$749.00 intro pricing in Canada. Very good deal for Canucks (for once).

 

o

 

post #19 of 857

Hmm, this DAC is soo tempting, making me want to get it and not wait for the Schiit Statement DAC. I love the design and from its specs, I think the performance should be comparable to things like the W4S DAC2

post #20 of 857

Hey people,

 

I'm going to call the NA distributor today and inquire about a group buy. I assume we can get a handful of people to go in on this.

 

Stay tuned.

  

post #21 of 857

I just spoke to the distributor. He didn't think group buy would work, but the M-DAC is on sale between now and Dec 1 for $749 (pre-order special).

 

https://www.planetofsounddistribution.com/products/p/Audiolab-8200MDAC-DAC

 

I will probably pull the trigger -- it's amazing how the price has dropped for a DAC with these features.

 

Shipping should be mid-December.

 

 

post #22 of 857


Probably a bad exchange rate our side for Chinese goods.

 

Thats a very good price for you guys!  If I didn't have a Rega dac and was Canadian I would snap one up at that price for sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by orkney View Post




$749.00 intro pricing in Canada. Very good deal for Canucks (for once).

 

o

 



 

 


Edited by WarrenR - 10/28/11 at 1:05pm
post #23 of 857

Oh man, I just saw this thread and did some research on the 8200CD and M-DAC.

Now I am trying to decide between the two of them and the incoming Schiit balanced DACs.

I think they would be worth the wait!

I guess it would be a no brainer if I want to play CDs... 8200CD.

 

Decisions, decisions, decisions...

post #24 of 857

Hi guys. Am very excited about the new MDAC too. 

 

I know this is a little OT but I figured this is the best thread to post this question. 

May I know has anyone here tested out the headphone jack out of a 8000A or a 8000CDQ? I am keen on a speaker setup but would like an amp which can drive headphones well too. 

 

Thanks a mil. 

 

Again, sorry for being OT. 

post #25 of 857

Pre-ordered! Couldn't resist this one -- also nice to see the distributor passing on commission to the local dealer where applicable. Looking forward to hearing this latest Westlake effort.

 

o

 

post #26 of 857

I wasn't sure I was going to reply to this, but since I couldn't resist last time, why even bother to try this time? :P

 

First of all, none of those devices are actually a DAC, and that includes the Oppo... In my opinion (and I don't know

if the rest of the world agrees, but who cares? :) a DAC is something you connect a digital transport to (with USB,

coax, or whatever) and get the signal output in analogue. A CD/DVD/BD player without digital inputs are not DACs,

they are CD/DVD/BD players. With a built in DAC obviously, but they are not an actual DAC unit.

 

Like I said, you get what you pay for - but I do agree that you don't always get sound for the money. Sometimes

you pay for a nicer looking box, a brand that's famous, a really well built device not made in some sweatshop, or

perhaps you just pay for a cool design. The thing is, companies will always try to get as much from their

investments as possible. So, you get what you pay for - but you are right, price doesn't always equal the best

sound. But most of the time it at least equals better sound. :)

 

The reason I called you out on it is because I considered it complete rubbish. First of all, you only compared

it to other mid-level devices that cost less than a grand - so thinking it's the best DAC under 5 grand is sort of

hilarious in my not-so-humble opinion...

All this being said, I've been considering buying the MDAC myself, as I also believe it could be a great device

for the money. I'd rather wait for some actual reviews though... And I'd much rather have an Anedio D1 which

doesn't cost that much more but is actually a tested device (a lot of positive feedback). Maybe a W4S D2?

Or perhaps a Audio-GD Ref 7.1. All three of them cost less than 2 grand. Oh, and all three of them will most

likely beat the Oppo hands down. But I haven't seen any comparisons between them and the Oppo, so it is

rather hard to say for sure... but if it was that good, it would fly off the shelves I think. Even if it isn't a "real" DAC...

 

Anyway, this is getting silly, sorry about that... I guess we can just agree to disagree and if you want to

 discuss it further you are quite welcome to PM me and we can keep the battle on there... I doubt anyone

 else is interested to read about it though, so we better keep it out of this thread.

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by moonsurf View Post


I have a PS3 properly connected to AV receiver that in my opinion sounds much better than my friend's Mcintosh cd player which costed more than $4,000 7 or 8 years ago.  Perhaps 7-8 year is too much of variable.  I don't own Oppo, but I heard it many times.  And, to my ears BDP-95 sounded at least good as if not better than brand new Simaudio cd player which costs like 6k.  Well, that was a moderate statement.  Actually, to my humble ears BDP-95 sounded a lot better than that simaudio (or called moon audio?).  

 

So, anything wrong with sharing my opinion here?  Since you pointed me out, I will point you out too.  Do you really believe that you only get what you paid for?  Well, many times, it is a true.  But, even the quality of 15 cents pencil is not same among the various manufactures. Heck, the quality even varies within the same manufacture these days.  I honestly do not believe price = quality.  Have you heard Beosound 9000?  It looks stunning, but it's sound quality is just ok.  And, it costs over 5k. 

 

Isn't it a rewarding experience when you find a good bargain among the floods of over priced hi-fi stuffs? That being said, I have not heard of MDAC, which I made sure in my previous posts.  I'm just excited about it and thinking of pulling the trigger even though it's not officially available in U.S.  And, I have no reason to promote Audiolab products!!  In a way, you are right.  If you pay $800, you get $800 DAC.  However, this is also true.  You can spend $5,000, and get a DAC which sounds worse than $800 DAC.  

 

I even stated that I had concluded "FOR MYSELF" that Oppo was the best for value for DAC.  Do I must back out my opinion with some kind of scientific evidence?  Well, I don't have on!!  However, the recent Stereophile magazine gave it A+ recommendation.  There were two products under $2,000 which received A+ recommendation.  They were Oppo and Sony 5400ES.  The reviewer, who gave A+ to both, actually compared Oppo vs Sony in previous months and liked Oppo better.  Happy now?  I wonder why I even have to "support" my opinion like this.  

 



 

post #27 of 857


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by orkney View Post

Pre-ordered! Couldn't resist this one -- also nice to see the distributor passing on commission to the local dealer where applicable. Looking forward to hearing this latest Westlake effort.

 

o

 


So excited for you! beerchug.gif

May i know which part of the world are u in?

 

 

post #28 of 857

Just ordered mine!!

 

I'm told 2 weeks till they are in stock but others have quoted 4 weeks and others have said I'll be lucky to get it for xmas, we'll have to see.

post #29 of 857

Where from? There seems to be limited stock and high demand already and it looks like It wont be widely available until mid December. I was tempted to preorder it but I don't fancy having £600 locked for an long time and be dissapointed by ongoing delays.  I think I will just wait until they are in stock in shops and check the first reviews...

post #30 of 857

I plan on getting this DAC, although I hate having to pre-order something. I want instant gratification and with free 2 day shipping! biggrin.gif

 

 

Was just catching up with the ongoing Audiolab thread at pink fish media forums and gleamed the following bits of information - all quotes from designer John Westlake. I hope nobody minds me cross-posting these quotes from another forum.

 

Improved power supply and matching sized transport/streamer for MDAC:


"First new product will be the upgrade PSU, then Power amps, then matching "transport" - we aim to have the above released within the next 6 months."
- John

 

 

-----

 

And for those who like technical details a few more posts by John Westlake of interest:

 

-----


"The idea behind Clock Syncing is to lock the DAC's Clock to the Data Source - thus allowing the DPLL BW of the ESS to reduce to its lowest setting - thus least intrusive ASRC.

In simple terms, unlike other implementations of ASRC, the ESS leaves the vast majority of Audio samples "Bit Perfect" and only very occasionally say every second will it insert an additional sample (say 1 out of 84 Million) to correct for Time domain energy errors.

"Conventional" Sample rate converters modify EVERY sample - the real beauty of the ESS ASRC is to leave the vast majority of Audio samples untouched - in fact only adding "Correction" pulses...

Locking the MDAC to the Data source - minimises the need to insert these "Correction samples" – and also removes any “Audio related” Modulation – I.e. removes any correlated jitter patterns (and thus Correlated correction pulses).

The Clock Lock interface will work with older CD transports I mentioned earlier + its really intended for our future Transport / Streamer.

We have full control of its function (Clock Rate) via software – so we can increase it functionality via a later software update – i.e. add direct support for units such as the SB (if it has a Clock In interface).+

- John (Westlake)

 

-----

Quote:
Originally Posted by uwe061 View Post
John, i follow this thread for a long time and i have a question. I have a lot of 24/192 files on hard disc (vinyl rips and hires downloads) and want to play the music from my MacBook Pro with Audirvana Plus (player software). Which will bring better sound quality: to use the MDAC with USB and with Upsampling (not bit perfect…) ore to buy an high quality 24/192 USB/SPDIF-Converter (Audiophilleo2, Stello U3…) and go with the coaxial input? From what i understand the USB input of the MDAC is more jitter-optimized than the coaxial input…? What do you think? Best regards from Berlin, Uwe

I don’t recommend using Upsampling on the PC as this will just introduce Transient ringing (standard FIR response) - I suggest just setting the MDAC Digital filter to Optimal Transient or Optimal Transient XD type.

If you can wait for 4-5 months, then our matching CD Transport / Streamer will offer isolated & clock-lock Async. USB to 192 kHz.

Otherwise, yes MDAC's Async. USB input is "Clock-Locked" to the DAC - so in thoery offers better performance then the SPDIF inputs, however I believe the difference should be small.


John

 

-----

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gints View Post
If you are going to make a transport with CD mechanism, would it be more logical to update a CDQ with MDAC output stage and other transport/streamer features? As a potential buyer who still is interested in CD and need to make a savings before purchase, I will be confused, especially you earlier said that there is a later plan to update a CDQ with MDAC output stage as well.

Hi Gints,

There's very good technical advantages in separating the Streaming device (with its WiFi connection) and USB (with its PC Ground noise) from the DAC sections...

The units will feature Clock-Locked operation; so much is to be gained from separating the "Noisy" sections from the DAC - with no performance "Disadvantages" (due to Clock-Locking)...

John

 

----

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by anubisgrau View Post
what's the reason that inputs on USB & optical are limited to 96/24 while SPDIF is 192/24 ?

(i remember this was explained somewhere in one of the threads but god knows where)

Are you referring to the MDAC? The optical does function to 192kHz, its just most optical sources and Cheap Plastic Fiber are so bad that its not a reliable connection - so rather then having to constantly field customer complaints that the MDAC’s Optical connection does not work at 192kHz (due to no fault of our own) - we have just rated them to 96kHz.

USB is limited due to the USB1.1 hardware Spec. Our hardware is designed using the TAS1020B which is a USB 1.1 device (A maxim of 12Mbps, which is just a tad too slow for 192kHz Audio Streaming).

John

 

------

 

The CD Transport / Streamer will also include an Async 192 kHz Clock-Locked (and galvanic isolated) USB connection,

John

 

------

 

and finally here is a link to the pink fish media thread as of today:

http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=108045&page=18

 

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