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Phiaton PS500 - A Disguised "M60"

post #1 of 27
10/27/10 at 8:48pm
Thread Starter 

Initial Impressions:

 

I actually bought these to compare to my awesomely awesome D2000. But, after some initial listening impressions, I kept on having one headphone pop into my head: M50. Seriously, these are like an upgraded M50, or "M60" if you will. These take all the good qualities of the wonderful M50, and enhance them. Not only sound, but comfort and looks as well.

 

No really, this can honestly be considered an M60...

 

Although I don't have the M50 for direct comparison (I had it a few months ago), all I can remember is that this feels, sounds, and even looks like it. Except, improved. Comfort is higher due to the softer ear pads and less clampy headband. Sound has got that "low bass" that the M50 had, but more refined. Even the looks, with the headband adjustment sliders and headband looking almost identical. And, you even get some nice "scaled leather" on the ear cups as well -- a nice plus!

 

As a note, the M50 "feels" more sturdy than this -- as this feels a bit plasticy in comparison.

 

Overall, I'm quite surprised that this is not a well known headphone. It's actually pretty good! And although I most likely won't keep it over the D2000 (Not sure yet, A LOT more testing to be done), I would most definitely keep it over the M50. (D2000 is just such a nice headphone. So it almost seems like the competition is unfair)


Edited by Katun - 10/27/10 at 9:00pm
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Gear mentioned in this thread:

Denon AHD2000 High Performance Over-Ear Headphones
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Phiaton PS 500 Premium Headphones With Studio Grade 40mm Titanium Drivers and...
post #2 of 27
10/27/10 at 9:43pm

Thanks for posting your impressions! The only headphone that gets less attention than the MS 400. Would you say that these were intended to be portable? It's hard to tell from the pictures.

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post #3 of 27
10/27/10 at 9:45pm

Nice M50 / M60 comparison. What equipment are you plugging these headphones into? And how does the "M60" compare to your D2000?

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post #4 of 27
10/28/10 at 7:18am
Thread Starter 

Although I am running the "M60" and the D2000 straight from my iAudio 7, they both sound wonderful with that alone.

 

I will most likely do a comparison between the PS500 and the D2000 a bit later, but for now the PS500 is burning in.

 

I did some brief AB comparisons last night though. Let's just say the PS500 sounds like a "congested D2000" with more bass.

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post #5 of 27
10/28/10 at 11:42am

Glad you found a nice complement/replacement for your AD700, Katun!

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post #6 of 27
10/28/10 at 11:58am

They look nice, alot less garish then the other Phiaton headphones but they are in direct competitions with what I consider some of the bst Price to performance headphones on the market. The $150-250 range is congested with so many good headphones for all tastes. Most notably would be D2000's and a whole slew  of Beryedynamics. And I must not for get that the HD25-II's are right there as well and are to my ears my favorites in this price range by far.

 

On a purely cosmetic standpoint these are beautiful, but I doubt I'd enjoy them more then I would HD25-II's or D2000. Also for about the same amount of money I could own M50's AND AKG K240's which woul;d give me a much wider variety of music and infact would be much better all around. That's my opinion though.

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post #7 of 27
10/28/10 at 12:15pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackzarg View Post

Glad you found a nice complement/replacement for your AD700, Katun!


My excellent D2000 is my AD700's replacement!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoSpecial View Post

They look nice, alot less garish then the other Phiaton headphones but they are in direct competitions with what I consider some of the bst Price to performance headphones on the market. The $150-250 range is congested with so many good headphones for all tastes. Most notably would be D2000's and a whole slew  of Beryedynamics. And I must not for get that the HD25-II's are right there as well and are to my ears my favorites in this price range by far.

 

On a purely cosmetic standpoint these are beautiful, but I doubt I'd enjoy them more then I would HD25-II's or D2000. Also for about the same amount of money I could own M50's AND AKG K240's which woul;d give me a much wider variety of music and infact would be much better all around. That's my opinion though.


Yeah, there are a lot of great headphones in that price range. How do I know? Well, I've tried most of them. I would have to say the D2000 is my all time favorite. Probably followed by the DT880 32ohm.

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post #8 of 27
10/28/10 at 1:43pm

I'm very interested.  I'm wondering how much you paid for these?  On amazon they are going for $190.  Also, do your ears have any problems heating up?

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post #9 of 27
10/28/10 at 3:15pm

The Phiaton PS500 sounds like a congested D2000 because it has an even more recessed upper midrange than the D2000.  Both headphones suck out the upper mids.  The PS500 just moreso.

 

Listen for what's in the upper mids.  Things like the breathyness in a vocal.  The sharpness of consonants in a vocal.  The edgyness (opposite of dull) in a guitar or violin.  Those sorts of things are going to be more recessed on the PS500.  I tried a PS500 at a shop.  The recessed midrange and duller midrange was very noticeable on even the first song I tried which was an R.E.M. song from Eponymous.  The breathyness in the vocal was gone.

 

The difficulty is if you're comparing them directly to the D2000 which also has a recessed midrange in the similar range.  Compare the midrange against a headphone that has a more balanced midrange and you'll notice.

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post #10 of 27
10/28/10 at 3:51pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by xtasi View Post

I'm very interested.  I'm wondering how much you paid for these?  On amazon they are going for $190.  Also, do your ears have any problems heating up?


I've been "price tracking" them for quite a few months now. It seems they are pretty much set at $190 -- which is what I bought them for.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ham Sandwich View Post

The Phiaton PS500 sounds like a congested D2000 because it has an even more recessed upper midrange than the D2000.  Both headphones suck out the upper mids.  The PS500 just moreso.

 

Listen for what's in the upper mids.  Things like the breathyness in a vocal.  The sharpness of consonants in a vocal.  The edgyness (opposite of dull) in a guitar or violin.  Those sorts of things are going to be more recessed on the PS500.  I tried a PS500 at a shop.  The recessed midrange and duller midrange was very noticeable on even the first song I tried which was an R.E.M. song from Eponymous.  The breathyness in the vocal was gone.

 

The difficulty is if you're comparing them directly to the D2000 which also has a recessed midrange in the similar range.  Compare the midrange against a headphone that has a more balanced midrange and you'll notice.


Yeah, so far that is what I hear. But even though they "both" have recessed mids, It's 100% obvious that the PS500 has a lot more recession than the D2000. In fact, I've even EQ'ed the D2000 in favor of the mids, and I find it just fine with a flat EQ. It's a really quite nice sounding headphone -- no bloated bass like everyone is talking about...

 

(PS500 is up to 30 hours of burn in. I'll give it about 10-20 hrs more before I do "the comparison".)

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post #11 of 27
10/28/10 at 4:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ham Sandwich View Post

The Phiaton PS500 sounds like a congested D2000 because it has an even more recessed upper midrange than the D2000.  Both headphones suck out the upper mids.  The PS500 just moreso.
. 

 

The PS500 is truly an awful headphone. I got them hoping they would be an improvement (refinement) over the MS400. Not a chance. Muddy, dark, murky, and no upper midrange. I sent them back and got the D2000 which is less awful.

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post #12 of 27
10/28/10 at 5:02pm

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katun View Post

 

Yeah, so far that is what I hear. But even though they "both" have recessed mids, It's 100% obvious that the PS500 has a lot more recession than the D2000. In fact, I've even EQ'ed the D2000 in favor of the mids, and I find it just fine with a flat EQ. It's a really quite nice sounding headphone -- no bloated bass like everyone is talking about...

 

 

The people who complain about bloated bass in the D2000 are just scared of bass or confused by having entire new octaves in their music revealed to them.  The music is simpler and easier to comprehend without those annoying low octaves intruding.  

 

Here's a neat video that I found yesterday.  It's a test of the low bass of the D2000 and a couple other headphones:  Dave Rat - The Mighty Headphone Quest Part 5 of 5

 

The D2000 goes down to 20 Hz very reasonably cleanly.  No excessive distortion.  There's some extra harmonics that make the bass less clean, and that may be where some complain of bass bloat.  The bass of the D2000 isn't as clean as ideal, but at least it goes down low without too much distortion and does a better job than many other headphones that completely fall apart in the low end (below 100 Hz) even though their frequency graphs at Headroom show they can do 20 Hz.  If you absolutely need clean bass down low then you'll have to suck it up and get the LCD-2 at almost $1000.  The D2000 does a very reasonable job with the bass for a $250ish headphone.

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post #13 of 27
10/28/10 at 5:13pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beagle View Post



 

The PS500 is truly an awful headphone. I got them hoping they would be an improvement (refinement) over the MS400. Not a chance. Muddy, dark, murky, and no upper midrange. I sent them back and got the D2000 which is less awful.


I wouldn't say awful. Even before burn in, (that's assuming burn in provides improvement) it didn't sound all that bad. But the D2000 had the advantage all over the PS500. (We'll see how it sounds when I compare them tomorrow -- as burn in time is almost complete). I'll also be coming them with the "audio demonstration disc" I got today, so we'll see.

 

But I know what your saying. It's not "that" good, but it's not "that bad either...

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ham Sandwich View Post

 

The people who complain about bloated bass in the D2000 are just scared of bass or confused by having entire new octaves in their music revealed to them.  The music is simpler and easier to comprehend without those annoying low octaves intruding.  

 

Here's a neat video that I found yesterday.  It's a test of the low bass of the D2000 and a couple other headphones:  Dave Rat - The Mighty Headphone Quest Part 5 of 5

 

The D2000 goes down to 20 Hz very reasonably cleanly.  No excessive distortion.  There's some extra harmonics that make the bass less clean, and that may be where some complain of bass bloat.  The bass of the D2000 isn't as clean as ideal, but at least it goes down low without too much distortion and does a better job than many other headphones that completely fall apart in the low end (below 100 Hz) even though their frequency graphs at Headroom show they can do 20 Hz.  If you absolutely need clean bass down low then you'll have to suck it up and get the LCD-2 at almost $1000.  The D2000 does a very reasonable job with the bass for a $250ish headphone.

 

Ah, it's nice to see someone who sticks up for such a nice headphone. I was about to say that myself, I thought: "This bass is absolutely fantastic! Why on earth do people think it's bloated and low quality?"

 

Nice video. I have never seen that. Really quite interesting.

 

Yeah, so far the D2000 is everything I wanted in a headphone. Especially for sound. But it's comfort and build quality is absolutely superb as well! So, I think I've finally found my headphone...
 

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post #14 of 27
10/28/10 at 5:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katun View Post

Ah, it's nice to see someone who sticks up for such a nice headphone. I was about to say that myself, I thought: "This bass is absolutely fantastic! Why on earth do people think it's bloated and low quality?"

 

Nice video. I have never seen that. Really quite interesting.

 

Yeah, so far the D2000 is everything I wanted in a headphone. Especially for sound. But it's comfort and build quality is absolutely superb as well! So, I think I've finally found my headphone...
 


x 2

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post #15 of 27
10/28/10 at 5:58pm

I don't doubt there are some as you describe, but I also think poor synergy with the associated equipment is part of the reason for such complaints.   
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ham Sandwich View Post

The people who complain about bloated bass in the D2000 are just scared of bass or confused by having entire new octaves in their music revealed to them.  The music is simpler and easier to comprehend without those annoying low octaves intruding.  

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Gear mentioned in this thread:

Denon AHD2000 High Performance Over-Ear Headphones
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