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Audio-gd NFB-10 - Page 5

post #61 of 2814

I can barely tolerate the thought of a hi-end headamp with no no remote.  A preamp is useless without a remote at any price, I only have audiophiles to blame for this ridiculous situation...remotes degrade sound or profit margins?  Audiophiles...whatever.

 

Carry on...

post #62 of 2814


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SP Wild View Post

I can barely tolerate the thought of a hi-end headamp with no no remote.  A preamp is useless without a remote at any price, I only have audiophiles to blame for this ridiculous situation...remotes degrade sound or profit margins?  Audiophiles...whatever.

 

Carry on...



A remote control selector/vol attenuator circuit limits what parts you can use unless you go the route that Kingwa uses, which BTW, is not cheap nor easy. The usual setup (with the Adcom GFP-750 for example) is to use the motorized ALPs pots which are nowhere near the quality of a relay based stepper....RC done poorly (source selection and or volume) will impact overall performance in a negative manner...if you need proof of such simply take a mid fi unit with a motorized ALPS vol pot assembly and swap it for a manual stepped attenuator (a quality one) and be amazed by the level or layers of gunk that are peeled away from the source signal.

 

I absolutely agree that having RC is a very good attribute for a prospective unit but not if it means degrading the SQ for that convenience  (not even a little bit is acceptable in my books). It's too bad that more HQ circuits aren't used these days...so many manufacturers lavish all kinds of attention on the analog circuits and the power supplies only to take a giant step backwards with a "off the shelf" attenuator that they know will degrade the performance.

 

Peete.

post #63 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pricklely Peete View Post


 



A remote control selector/vol attenuator circuit limits what parts you can use unless you go the route that Kingwa uses, which BTW, is not cheap nor easy. The usual setup (with the Adcom GFP-750 for example) is to use the motorized ALPs pots which are nowhere near the quality of a relay based stepper....RC done poorly (source selection and or volume) will impact overall performance in a negative manner...if you need proof of such simply take a mid fi unit with a motorized ALPS vol pot assembly and swap it for a manual stepped attenuator (a quality one) and be amazed by the level or layers of gunk that are peeled away from the source signal.

 

I absolutely agree that having RC is a very good attribute for a prospective unit but not if it means degrading the SQ for that convenience  (not even a little bit is acceptable in my books). It's too bad that more HQ circuits aren't used these days...so many manufacturers lavish all kinds of attention on the analog circuits and the power supplies only to take a giant step backwards with a "off the shelf" attenuator that they know will degrade the performance.

 

Peete.


I'm still blaming audiophiles for not creating a demand for high quality remote attenuation systems - if the demand was there, surely competitive pressures mean that the correct product will fill the vacuum...I'm going to go further and blame the vinyl guys.  Some of the prices that these companies charge, at those prices if they're not going to supply a remote, at least it should come with a third world servant to do the changing for me... but a servant would more than just two AAs.

 

That is why I like Audio GD...they were logical enough to include a no compromise remote solution to the Phoenix...which more or less sealed the deal with the REF7 for me (the ref7 over the ref8 for that matter...knowing that the Phoenix will be mine sooner or later)...seriously, who knows how differently my path would have taken had the Phoenix not have a remote...likely away from Audio GD.

 

To keep things on track...I am amazed at how Audio GD has the Source forum on lockdown - has this actually ever occurred like this in this scale in the Head-Fi's past?  If I weren't such a finicky bastard, I'd quite happily settle down on this NFB10 unit - this product just seems too "right" in pricing and features, almost perfect in fact...if it only had a remote...


Edited by SP Wild - 10/28/10 at 10:34pm
post #64 of 2814

What exactly do you want the remote to do?

post #65 of 2814

Have you guys never heard of Bent Audio?  They make a remote control motorized control for DACT and Goldpoint stepped attenuators (as well as an ALPS system, and Shallco switch).  The great thing about it is that the power is only on when you press the remote button.  You can also still rotate the knob the old fashioned way, with your hand.

 

http://bentaudio.com/remotes/step.html


Edited by IPodPJ - 10/29/10 at 1:05am
post #66 of 2814


deleted!


Edited by SP Wild - 10/29/10 at 2:17pm
post #67 of 2814

SP Wild, I am finding your "third world servant" comments to be offensive. I would appreciate it if you stay on topic without the unnecessary jitter (pun intended). Thanks.

post #68 of 2814


I find his comments quite amusing and entertaining to be honest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoyNamedSue View Post

SP Wild, I am finding your "third world servant" comments to be offensive. I would appreciate it if you stay on topic without the unnecessary jitter (pun intended). Thanks.

post #69 of 2814

Sorry it's my fault for asking a stupid question and therefore getting a stupid, albeit funny, answer. 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoyNamedSue View Post

SP Wild, I am finding your "third world servant" comments to be offensive. I would appreciate it if you stay on topic without the unnecessary jitter (pun intended). Thanks.

post #70 of 2814

Sorry for derailing the thread a bit. I usually have higher tolerance for asinine comments from other forums (e.g., espn), but I guess I have higher expectations of headfi since I find most members here to be mature/sophisticated. The funny thing is, I usually enjoy SPwild's posts as he posts often in the Denon d7000 thread that I follow, but this one hit a nerve for me.


Edited by BoyNamedSue - 10/29/10 at 9:55am
post #71 of 2814

Has anyone had the chance to compare the NFB-10 to the Lavry DA-10/11 or Wyred4Sound DAC-1/2?  I'm mostly interested in the sound quality of these DACs with headphones and without any external amp.  The NFB-10 seems to provide amazing value, but I don't like the single XLR 4-pin output.  Will a 3-pin to 4-pin converter degrade the sound substantially?

post #72 of 2814

There's 3pin outputs on the back =)smily_headphones1.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by dj nellie View Post

Has anyone had the chance to compare the NFB-10 to the Lavry DA-10/11 or Wyred4Sound DAC-1/2?  I'm mostly interested in the sound quality of these DACs with headphones and without any external amp.  The NFB-10 seems to provide amazing value, but I don't like the single XLR 4-pin output.  Will a 3-pin to 4-pin converter degrade the sound substantially?


Edited by WalkmanMan - 10/29/10 at 11:34am
post #73 of 2814
Originally Posted by dj nellie View Post

...but I don't like the single XLR 4-pin output...

 

Dual 3-pin XLR-s on "balanced" headphones are just waste of space and money with no benefits over 4-pin solution.

 

Originally Posted by dj nellie View Post

 Will a 3-pin to 4-pin converter degrade the sound substantially?

 

It would be heavy (male 4-pin XLR + 2 female 3-pin XLR connectors + 2 existing 3-pin male ones), cumbersome, perhaps even ugly, but if done properly (preferably with the same wire as the rest of the headphone cable) it will not degrade the sound.

 

Originally Posted by WalkmanMan View Post

There's 3pin outputs on the back =)smily_headphones1.gif

 

XLR pre-outs on the back are XLR male sockets. To connect headphones there you would need two 3-pin female to female XLR adapters (not to mention that pre-outs are not designed for headphone loads).


Edited by FauDrei - 10/29/10 at 12:46pm
post #74 of 2814

Actually I would prefer 4 pin over dual 3 pin for practical reasons especially if I had multiple balanced headphones to plug/unplug daily.

post #75 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by WalkmanMan View Post

There's 3pin outputs on the back =)smily_headphones1.gif


 



Oh ok cool, thanks for clarifying that.  I thought those were inputs for the NFB-10's amp.  It's confusing, 3-pin outputs seem to be male, while 4-pin outputs seem to be female?

 

And to clarify my last post, I don't know any reason to prefer 3-pin over 4-pin or vice versa.  I'm just wedded to 3-pin with my current headphones, and it seems that 3-pin designs are much more common.

 

Anyway, this DAC is definitely intriguing, there are just so few (or zero?) reviews and impressions out there.  I'm especially curious to hear how the USB implementation compares to the W4S, Lavry or Benchmark USB models.


Edited by dj nellie - 10/29/10 at 12:53pm
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