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Audio-GD NFB-11 - Page 39

post #571 of 977

Yeah, I understand it now. I have an early FUN.  So, anyway, I ordered the Wolfson module.  Everything will be lovely in the fullness of time.

 

I really like Audio-Gd products.  Pretty fanatical attention to detail for the money. Great value in sound quality. Easy to use.  User upgradeable to some degree. THICK FRONT PANELS!  As I've said before, put a 16 mm aluminum panel on it and I would buy a six-transistor AM radio.  (Even with GERMANIUM transistors.)
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by olor1n View Post

Here you go milosz. I ordered my Fun (upgraded B version with WM8741) towards the end of September so that corresponds with what Elanzer wrote below.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elanzer View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by milosz View Post

This is odd- The FUN I bought is supposed to be Version "A"  - but it has the  DA1852 module in it, not the  DA8741.  This doesn't seem right.  I will send Audio-Gd an email to see why my "A" version FUN has the Analog Devices 1852 in it.



This largely depends on when you purchased it. They only somewhat recently started using the WM8741 in FUN/Sparrow. The "A" versions previously had either the WM8740 or AD1852 as an option, in which the AD1852 is more accurate while the WM8740 is smoother but less detailed, so it was a tossup (unlike the WM8741 which has the best of both chips and can be considered flat out better). The WM8741 option was introduced in September as an improvement for both units. You can buy the WM8741 module alone and upgrade your unit if it doesn't have it, I personally did it with my Sparrow and it was definitely worth it. Anyone who orders the "B" versions of the FUN/Sparrow should definitely pay the extra $15 to get the WM8741.

 

As far as the delays.. I wouldn't be very surprised if they received a ridiculous amount of orders for the NFB-12 since it far outclasses everything else available in the $200 range. For a small company with as little employees as Kingwa has, it does take awhile to churn through all those orders to get everything shipped out as they're built, while applying all the quality control and testing to make sure these things have no issues.



 



Quote:
Originally Posted by milosz View Post

Hmm, my FUN has the USB hardware of the "A" version which supports 96KHz/24Bit, so it doesn't seem they accidentally shipped me a "B" version. Also, I have EVOX capacitors, a Neutrik headphone jack, and the matte-gold "custom RCA jacks" that are all part of the "A" build.

 

I have an early production FUN, ordered just after they introduced it. Maybe the Wolfson DA8741 wasn't the standard part in the "A" version at that early time.  

 

In their reply to my email, Audio-GD did not answer why my "A" version has the DA1862 in it and not a  DA8741.

 

Edwin told me that if I wanted a DA8741 for my FUN it would be $56 including shipping, so I ordered one.


 
post #572 of 977

I was considering ordering the NFB-11 from audio-gd, but noticed that it is listed under the discontinued section. Anyone know what's going on with that?

http://www.audio-gd.com/PriceList.htm

 

post #573 of 977

It's just that, it's discontinued. Kingwa feels the ES9018 DA chip in the NFB-11 (and others) is a "beta" quality product with issues that haven't been ironed out yet by ESS, and that it's not worth buying a large shipment of chips for.

 

Look into the NFB-12, it would have better synergy with your DT770 anyways.

post #574 of 977

But the issues are solved if I read what Kingwa writes in his mail. There is some last testing going on and then the gear will be send.

It's a little bit confusing..........

What kind of issues will still be there in the NFB-11 when it's send to the customers?

 

Regards,

Tini

post #575 of 977

Kingwa thinks the Sabre32 will come out with a new revision relatively soon, he buys these DA chips in batches of 2,000 to reduce cost so it's a big commitment, this batch would be used for several years most likely and the chip isn't up to his personal standards. There's no point in diving in on the beta product knowing it has issues just to potentially be stuck with a bunch of "flawed" DA chips.


Edited by Elanzer - 1/4/11 at 3:23am
post #576 of 977

Ok, that's clear, thanks. So the NFB-11 wich will be send soon wil be without issuesL3000.gif.

 

I hope it will come soon because i'm listening to a Zero DAC now frown.gif and the NFB-11 should be a lot better......

 

Regards,

Tini

post #577 of 977

This article about the ES9018 and it's sound might be of interest to some here:  http://www.lampizator.eu/lampizator/REFERENCES/Buffalo%20DAC/BuffaloDAC.html

post #578 of 977

That makes sense thanks for the input elanzer.

post #579 of 977

Here's the thing, Oppo BD-83SE uses two Sabre32 DAC's (08 for MC and 16 for 2ch), the 08 is not what I would call a good sounding dac just your of the mill. The 16 for 2ch stacking 4dac per ch is a very good sound dac but lacks a little bass depth. 

I had the opportunely to work with Nuforce's Casy on getting a bug out of the Nuforce Edition (uses a 16) 2ch side of the Oppo's BD-83SE board. Also keep in mind that Nuforce works with Oppo and has the schematics of the Oppo BD-83SE audio board, but still had there share of problems getting there modifications right.

 

Also Oppo still can't get get SACD's and LFE ch to work properly for there SE analog audio board.

 

My point is that the Sabre32 DAC's are very difficult to get right in these kind of applications. Its for that reason why I didn't get a DAC with the Sabre32 DAC. And of-course the tonal Quality between the   PCM1704UK Chip and Sabre32, imo it really comes down to what the listener prefers.

 

The folks that have gotten or are getting the Sabre32 chips, don't worry you do have a great sounding chip and I am sure it will but a smile on your face. All I am trying to point out is that the Sabre32 chip is very hard to work with.

 

 


Edited by sillysally - 1/4/11 at 5:31am
post #580 of 977

Today , the ESS Chinese agent contact me, once he know we have to discontinued the ESS9018 based products, some hours later he allow our order low to 200pcs and get a much forgive price. But I had post the inform on web in public, I am afraid if we going back to the ESS9018 , maybe get some laughing.

 

IMO, the ES9018 had some little bugs but can fixed.
The clock lose in PCM mode. We think we had fix but still can't get enough users feedback for confirm because the express delay these days .

 

In default, the PCM mode signal output level is 1/4 of the SPDIF mode.  We had fix.

 

The output of the ESS9018 is voltage source in fact, the chip built in a 781 ohms in series on each output , I think this is not good for standard analog output design, so ESS advice users still applied a I/V converter , the I/V converter must bring a negative on SQ and performance.

 

Read the PCM1704 file , the PCM1704 specs already include a I/V converter (NE5534, a lowest OPA in today )  .So if the ES9018 specs include a same I/V converter , the specs must a bit degrade.

 

I think if the output is a real current source (as the PCM1704) or a real voltage source ( as the WM8741 had low output impedance allow users just feed to a difference design OPA )  will be perfect work with standard analog circuits. But because we are applied ACSS circuits, so we don't care , we just connect between ES9018 and the ACSS modules, without any I/V converter after the ES9018.


Edited by Kingwa - 1/4/11 at 8:24am
post #581 of 977

Hi Kingwa! Thanks for the update!

 

Does this mean Audio-gd will be offering the Sabre32 products as well? I think it would be great, more choices for customers. I at least might be interested in an NFB-7 later this year.

post #582 of 977
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingwa View Post

Today , the ESS Chinese agent contact me, once he know we have to discontinued the ESS9018 based products, some hours later he allow our order low to 200pcs and get a much forgive price. But I had post the inform on web in public, I am afraid if we going back to the ESS9018 , maybe get some laughing.

 

IMO, the ES9018 had some little bugs but can fixed.
The clock lose in PCM mode. We think we had fix but still can't get enough users feedback for confirm because the express delay these days .

 

In default, the PCM mode signal output level is 1/4 of the SPDIF mode.  We had fix.

 

The output of the ESS9018 is voltage source in fact, the chip built in a 781 ohms in series on each output , I think this is not good for standard analog output design, so ESS advice users still applied a I/V converter , the I/V converter must bring a negative on SQ and performance.

 

Read the PCM1704 file , the PCM1704 specs already include a I/V converter (NE5534, a lowest OPA in today )  .So if the ES9018 specs include a same I/V converter , the specs must a bit degrade.

 

I think if the output is a real current source (as the PCM1704) or a real voltage source ( as the WM8741 had low output impedance allow users just feed to a difference design OPA )  will be perfect work with standard analog circuits. But because we are applied ACSS circuits, so we don't care , we just connect between ES9018 and the ACSS modules, without any I/V converter after the ES9018.



Hi Kingwa....

 

This could be fantastic news.....You worked so hard on the ESS9018, it would be a shame to completly stop it now that it could be possible to sell DACs again !!! I just started a new thread asking wich of the Ref 5 or NFB 1 I should buy, but I prefer waiting for you to reconsider the Sabre chip as it was my first choice...

 

We'll see

 

Denys

post #583 of 977


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingwa View Post

Today , the ESS Chinese agent contact me, once he know we have to discontinued the ESS9018 based products, some hours later he allow our order low to 200pcs and get a much forgive price. But I had post the inform on web in public, I am afraid if we going back to the ESS9018 , maybe get some laughing.

 

IMO, the ES9018 had some little bugs but can fixed.
The clock lose in PCM mode. We think we had fix but still can't get enough users feedback for confirm because the express delay these days .

 

In default, the PCM mode signal output level is 1/4 of the SPDIF mode.  We had fix.

 

The output of the ESS9018 is voltage source in fact, the chip built in a 781 ohms in series on each output , I think this is not good for standard analog output design, so ESS advice users still applied a I/V converter , the I/V converter must bring a negative on SQ and performance.

 

Read the PCM1704 file , the PCM1704 specs already include a I/V converter (NE5534, a lowest OPA in today )  .So if the ES9018 specs include a same I/V converter , the specs must a bit degrade.

 

I think if the output is a real current source (as the PCM1704) or a real voltage source ( as the WM8741 had low output impedance allow users just feed to a difference design OPA )  will be perfect work with standard analog circuits. But because we are applied ACSS circuits, so we don't care , we just connect between ES9018 and the ACSS modules, without any I/V converter after the ES9018.

Dear kingwa,


I first your like to formally apologize to you and Edwin, my DAC19 DPS1v5 came today. It would seem that DHL was at fault here and didn't give me the correct information. My DAC was repackaged and the waybill number was changed by DHL.

 

Anyway I did open my new DAC to have a look inside and I must say your workman ship is wonderful. Right now I am just using frequency sweeps to get some hours on my new DAC, later tonight I will connect the DAC19 to my main system.

 

I am sure after looking at how you have setup my DAC19 DSP1 you will solve the ES9018 puzzle.

 

God bless,

 

Peter.


Edited by sillysally - 1/4/11 at 9:09pm
post #584 of 977

^ Nice.

post #585 of 977

Kingwa,

 

thank you for taking the time to post in this thread

 

i am eagerly awaiting my NFB-12! : )

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