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post #31 of 67


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by loki993 View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeGoodman View Post

The Sansa clip is a normal sounding player. It doesn't do anything really wrong, but then again it doesn't do anything exceptionally well. I have a Fuze that is supposed to sound the same and the sound is pretty flat and non dynamic. I have tried other players that sound much better, such as the S:Flo2 and the QLS QA350. 

 

Anythingbutipod.com is a good site, but sometimes I want to start anythingbutsansa.com to counteract their sansa madness. They are irrationally crazy about the clip because it measure flat on some test. Guess what? it sounds flat as well, and not in a good way. The clip has its place as an ultra portable cheap player that sounds decent, but decent is not anywhere near good. 




The problem with that is those players are $200+ players. If your paitient or dont mind a refurb or used you can get a clip+ for 30 dollars.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkchaser View Post

Source is the most fickle part of an audio rig. There is never 1 source that is good in everything for sure. I know this coz I've had my fair share of DAPs. I can surmise the following:

 

iPods - they are OK sounding players. The iPod 5G is probably the best sounding one I've heard, plus you can use Rockbox on it. Still, I do find that I need to amp the iPods to get a decent sound. 

 

clip+ - After having only iPods, the clip+ was a big surprise. Much better sound quality from a much smaller player. Unfortunately the poor battery life and small screen and size really killed it for me. 

 

s:flo2 - Bad customer service aside, the s:flo2 sounded excellent. It deserves the praise it gets for its SQ for sure. However for me, SQ isn't everything, and eventually the really bad UI and awkward shape made it a bad package overall. 

 

Fuze - Currently using and so far it's the best. Good battery, easy navigation, Rockbox. Don't underestimate the Rockbox impact. Coupled with the Fuze's amp, it pretty much nullifies the need to use an amp for me. I've tried iBasso D12, P4, D4, Cordas, everything short of RSAs, and find that there is very minimal gain using an amp. I think a lot of people can atest to this, judging by a good number of Fuze rigs here without amps. 

 

So yeah, I don't feel the Sansas are overrated. They are definitely bang for buck, and then some more. Maybe Cowons or the s:flo2 may sound better, but they all have their own problems. After the nightmare that is mp4nation customer service, I'm inclined NOT to spend too much on a source anymore. :)



So you say the Fuze had a different amp than the Clip? I was under the impression that they were the same.

 

 

I guess the real question, even though this may be getting a but OT, is there a player in the same price range that can compare to the Clip?

 

I mean really when someone bring up players that sound better than the clip/fuze theyre always the expensive ones. Theres gotta be something to be said about that.

 

I havent heard a clip, but I did get one for my GF for X-mas and Ill take a listen to it before I give it to her, because im gonna rockbox it too. Im interested to see how it sounds.


The biggest impact rockboxing will bring to it, asides from the ability to play m4a files, is battery life and a world-class EQ. And you can set each frequency band to your own freq., so it is truly customizable. And to me, the Fuze and Clip+ sound the same....and I have two of each.L3000.gif

post #32 of 67

My list from best to acceptable:

-Ipod Video 5g RB Flac

-Nokia 5800 Mp3

-Ipod Video 5g RB Mp3

-Creative Zen Mx Mp3

All Unamped.

 

Edit: Got a pair of Westone UM3X and the list suddenly became a little different

Now from best to acceptable:

-Nokia 5800 Mp3

-Ipod Video 5g Flac

-Ipod Video 5g Mp3

-Creative Zen Mx Mp3

Still Unamped.


Edited by Very Legal - 1/9/11 at 6:46pm
post #33 of 67

You guys sound like you know what you're talking about, whereas I know little...  Here's the problem. I load almost everything in lossless format in my 120gb ipod classic and am running out of room.  I've been considering getting a new 160gb, but what concerns me is sound quality.  Does the 160 sound as good as my 2 year old 120?  And what are reliability?  I've read that there are, or were, some issues with the 160.  And I understand there are programs that will transfer the data from one to the other so I don't have to reload everthing... right?   Thanks for any help!


Edited by eggburt - 12/16/10 at 12:44pm
post #34 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by eggburt View Post

You guys sound like you know what you're talking about, whereas I know little...  Here's the problem. I load almost everything in lossless format in my 120gb ipod classic and am running out of room.  I've been considering getting a new 160gb, but what concerns me is sound quality.  Does the 160 sound as good as my 2 year old 120?  And what are reliability?  I've read that there are, or were, some issues with the 160.  And I understand there are programs that will transfer the data from one to the other so I don't have to reload everthing... right?   Thanks for any help!

 

1. I had the 160GB for over 12 months without a single issue. I dont trust Apple's quality control, particularly when a new model is initially released - they just concentrate on shipping as much product as possible and replace anything that gets sent back : you can do that when you are the market leader, I guess.

 

2. Many here argue that the DAC chip in the 160GB model isnt as good as the chip in the earlier model Classic. I am unable to confirm or deny that, and I dont know how many of the Wolfson fanatics actually spent more than 10 minutes with the newer model.

 

3. I know of only one program that will let you transfer one to the other - its called iTunes. There are about 13 million guides on the Net that tell you how to transfer your music into another version of iTunes on a new computer etc, but my attempts to retrieve music from an iPod onto my hard drive required Linux - if there is a Windows/Mac equivelent, I suspect that Google will tell you.

 

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=103071

 

Finally, my personal opinion is that 160GB wont hold you for as long as you think it will - not with lossless files - you may like to look at a netbook as your music server somewhere down the line and keep the DAPs for 'best of' playlists.

 


 

post #35 of 67

Thank you so much for the reply.  It's food for thought!

post #36 of 67

Get an S9 or J3. In terms of features the are at the top of the line. You can put any interface you want on it (UCI), amazing EQ, great SQ, delicious responsive screen, gap-less playback, and on and on and on. The S9 is at a KILLER price at the moment. The only differences are the improved build (more metal and better buttons), the microSD card slot, and the (useless) speaker.

 

Be warned; It does give some hiss on sensitive players (not noticeable at ALL when the music is actually playing and this is actually quite common with DAPs), it has no AAC, and no h.264 support. I think the numerous other audio codecs and AVI video support make up for the short comings. I don't notice the hiss most of the time either and it doesn't even occur when the EQ is off.

post #37 of 67

Unsure of how the 3g touch sounds, but I had the J3 and itouch 4g side by side for a weekend and A/B'ed for hours. While the J3 had numerous eq setting that were very nice, it also had hiss. I was using ie8s and Shure E5s doing comparisons. The deal breaker for the J3 was the hiss it was producing. I honestly found the 4g touch line out to be super quiet and found three or four on-board eq settings that were right on the J3s heals if not equal to me; so the Cowon was returned and I have zero regrets. I downloaded EQU app and the touch as even better. Ended up with an E7 amp at Christmas and really like it just as well unamped. I'm now using MTPC with the 4g and find no reason to eq or amp...quite satisfying!

post #38 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by 311bliss View Post

Unsure of how the 3g touch sounds


Trust me when I tell you that its ordinary, very ordinary. I have kept mine purely because the Touch does a lot of other things very well - sadly, in the case of the 3G, music playback isnt one of them. It does make a good reference point when I listen to my 6G Nano - akin to going from the covered wagon to a Corvette.

post #39 of 67

My comments on J3: SQ is very average, it has to be spiced up by EQ, as the owner of X5 and M3, I am extremely disappointed by J3's SQ, maybe my expectation is set too high. Without EQ (i hate using EQ), i rate Sflo2, sony (S745), Zune 120gb and good old boys h120 and x5 (all I have) above J3, imo Cowon is going backwards in terms of SQ, If you like fancy UI eye candy and screen, go for it.

post #40 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by sz1999 View Post

My comments on J3: SQ is very average, it has to be spiced up by EQ, as the owner of X5 and M3, I am extremely disappointed by J3's SQ, maybe my expectation is set too high. Without EQ (i hate using EQ), i rate Sflo2, sony (S745), Zune 120gb and good old boys h120 and x5 (all I have) above J3, imo Cowon is going backwards in terms of SQ, If you like fancy UI eye candy and screen, go for it.



I agree that my 6g Nano sounds better than my J3 if I don't use the EQ.  However, if I use the J3 EQ I can make it sound better, to my tastes, than my Nano.  The Nano seems to sound best when played without the EQ.  In any case, it is my impression that Cowon's EQ is one of their major selling points...at least it was for me.  Both players, set the way I like them, sound slightly better than my 5.5G Ipod classic and much better than my Creative X-Fi2.  Still want to pick up a cheap Sanza just for fun at some point.

post #41 of 67

cowon players are definitely not the BEST sounding when used without EQ..I heard the sansa clip+ and was totally blown away by it's sound when flat  but like others said,the battery life is too short and it doesn't have enough space for me.   but cowon also sound awsome imo even without EQ, i use the EQ only for headphones that need a little correction in frequency response.

so cowon is the best compromise between great sound and features/battery life , they are the best all around players imo.   the j3 is the best cowon so far imo (before there were the I7 and D2)

post #42 of 67

Samsung P3 wasn't mentioned here at all?  

 

Samsung P3>Cowon J3>iPod 4G>Zune HD>Sanza (Never heard it Rockboxed)

 

The Samsung has a beautiful, open, full, and warm sound.  It's also a very nice looking player, including the interface.  The problem is that the interface is laggy, the screen can be unresponsive/inaccurate, and no software if you really need it and don't wanna do things manually (which I prefer tbh).  You also have to unlock it and find where on the screen just to pause it.  

 

Honestly, I'd put the Cowon J3 on the very bottom without EQ.  It's a very finicky player and it's only good if you get the EQ just perfect for your headphones.  You must also have good headphones, preferably with a warmer sound over a crisp/detailed pair.  The J3 provides the clarity but the sound is bitter and cold.  With the right combination it could be amazing but to be honest, it was an annoying process and I can't wholeheartedly recommend it.  The Samsung P3 on the other hand has at least all the basic software functionality and sounds nice to boot with anything and still better than the J3 after EQ with certain tracks.

 

*The Cowon J3 DOES support AAC.  It supports AAC-LP which is what music is usually encoded in.  The player just can't display any of it's properties/tags.  It also supports H264.  I think it just has to be a low profile and limited to a certain resolution.

 

 

-Sorry for such a late response (probably useless by now :/)


Edited by Typhoon859 - 4/11/11 at 5:31pm
post #43 of 67

Sony X Series>Samsung P3>Cowon J3>Sansa clip+(Rockboxed)>iPod classic>Zune HD

 

FWIW, I would have loved a 64gb Samsung P3,...it's fantastic - I loved it.

 

My personal order. The iPod touch 4G and the iPhone 4 are equal in SQ to the top rated player, since the inception of EQu & Equalizer

post #44 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by nywytboy68 View Post

Sony X Series>Samsung P3>Cowon J3>Sansa clip+(Rockboxed)>iPod classic>Zune HD

 

FWIW, I would have loved a 64gb Samsung P3,...it's fantastic - I loved it.

 

My personal order. The iPod touch 4G and the iPhone 4 are equal in SQ to the top rated player, since the inception of EQu & Equalizer


Really?  Zune HD is that bad in quality?  Then wth is it's point?  I only got to hear it once and it sounded good to me.  Other than that I always heard that it sounded better than the iPhone 4.  If it's worse than that, then that's simply terrible.  It's the only one I don't have sufficient experience with.  Maybe I should switch it around with the iTouch 4G.

 

post #45 of 67

I sometimes get the feeling that Cowon purposely built the flat setting of the J3 to be fairly ordinary so that you would use the extensive eq options, which I do. Once I have it set how I want it, it is hands down the best thing I've ever heard. 

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