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Piracy? A thoughtful inquiry, at least I'd say so... - Page 5

post #61 of 79

Godard says intellectual copyright doesn't exist, donates to accused pirate

 

godard-1284472679.jpg

 


Jean-Luc Godard, master of nouvelle vague cinema, has spoken! But not, however, to the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, which has been waiting for Godard to decide whether or not he will show up to receive his honorary Oscar next year. Instead, the elusive French director has come to the aid of a man fined €20,000 (about $25,000) for illegally downloading music.

French citizen and 37-year-old music lover James Climent (as best we can tell with Google Translate) was investigated for downloading 13,788 MP3s in 2005. His case dragged on for several years until he was ordered to pay the aforementioned hefty fine to SACEM and SDRM, copyright watchdogs based in France. Godard read a story about Climent published in Libération back in August and decided to donate €1,000 (nearly $1,300) to Climent's cause. Speaking to Libération, Godard said (roughly translated), "I am against HADOPI [the recent French law protecting online copyrights]... There is no such thing as intellectual property." Boom! And that's the final word, folks. If you're interested in more broken-English coverage, try the Google Translate version of Climent's blog post about the affair here.

post #62 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by SP Wild View Post

 

 

Protecting "Artistic and creative content"....I think these musicians need to get a job.  In my collection, I would say that the statement applies to 10 percent of my collection....the other 90 percent, which I paid for...I think would be lying to call it "Artistic and creative" - but that's all subjective.  If someone chose to become a musician solely for financial reward and not for the love of it...hmmm how creative is that?

 .


Artists who are really passionate about their art want to do it full time not just as a hobby.

Creative work takes a great deal of time.

If you can make money from it then you can do this and make more and better art.

Being a professional in any artistic field takes a LOT of hard work and luck.

This not helped when people steal the fruits of your efforts.

Plus every business has to allow for some losses but if you are not already doing OK

those losses will be felt harder than those who have already achieved a good measure of success.

 

 

.
 

post #63 of 79


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by setmenu View Post




Artists who are really passionate about their art want to do it full time not just as a hobby.

Creative work takes a great deal of time.

If you can make money from it then you can do this and make more and better art.

Being a professional in any artistic field takes a LOT of hard work and luck.

This not helped when people steal the fruits of your efforts.

Plus every business has to allow for some losses but if you are not already doing OK

those losses will be felt harder than those who have already achieved a good measure of success.

 

 

.
 


If an artist is doing poorly...I highly doubt his art creations are being pirated at any sort of a scale that is causing him to do poorly.  I think he needs to look at other reasons why his CD sales are doing poorly.

 

I have no statistics to back me up.  But I'd imagined the art works that are being pirated in large quantities are those that are high in demand - Lady Gaga is being pirated at multitudes of Mr creative genius.  Just simple economics.  Lady Gaga is not saying a word about piracy, because its all part of breaking it into the big time.

 

Mr creative genius really needs to learn to kiss the right asses.  Thats the bottom line, not piracy - no ones pirating your work and costing you sales...lets just say without the pirating, no-one is paying to buy your CDs.  Without pirates...no one actually know you exists outside of your little circle of self-deluded creative genuises.

 

(I don't mean you personally setmenu...I'm sure you're the real mccoy in artistic terms). 


Edited by SP Wild - 9/16/10 at 3:14am
post #64 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by batphink View Post

Godard says intellectual copyright doesn't exist, donates to accused pirate

 

godard-1284472679.jpg

 


Jean-Luc Godard, master of nouvelle vague cinema, has spoken! But not, however, to the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, which has been waiting for Godard to decide whether or not he will show up to receive his honorary Oscar next year. Instead, the elusive French director has come to the aid of a man fined €20,000 (about $25,000) for illegally downloading music.

French citizen and 37-year-old music lover James Climent (as best we can tell with Google Translate) was investigated for downloading 13,788 MP3s in 2005. His case dragged on for several years until he was ordered to pay the aforementioned hefty fine to SACEM and SDRM, copyright watchdogs based in France. Godard read a story about Climent published in Libération back in August and decided to donate €1,000 (nearly $1,300) to Climent's cause. Speaking to Libération, Godard said (roughly translated), "I am against HADOPI [the recent French law protecting online copyrights]... There is no such thing as intellectual property." Boom! And that's the final word, folks. If you're interested in more broken-English coverage, try the Google Translate version of Climent's blog post about the affair here.


25 grand is a lot.  I'm sure I personally know someone that has downloaded that many MP3s...the guy might have a family to feed - I'd prefer he looked after his family and send his kids to college with this 25 grand instead of going into someone else fat pockets.

 

Piracy IS A PROBLEM.  In China, where mass duplication is occuring and going to market for a profit (not the CD industry but things like headphones etc - where real pirate are doing real damage) ....even fining 1 man 25k, isn't going to make a dint in a teenagers download collection.  Big Music should wake up to smell the coffee.  Even if Big Music stops promoting superstars....Music Lives

 

Humans will get their MUSIC - it was with is us since the dawn of time and it was free.  This is why big music is stuck...they can't just stop producing music...someone else will and profit...music is always in demand and music will always be created....by passionate hobyists that hold a real job even - with real creativity.


Edited by SP Wild - 9/16/10 at 3:27am
post #65 of 79
Quote:
 
The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers
 

 

 

BTW:  I actually own a parrot.  She likes to sit on my shoulder.

post #66 of 79
The parrot speaks.
post #67 of 79

I personally blame the industry for most of the piracy:

 

- Don't make your clients feel like idiots/fools/morons » When Sony Music first came out with their "fail-safe" protection all us idiots bought these CD's just to find out, too late, that the Original would only play on very few sources. It was almost impossible to find a car CD player that it would accept...

The Pirates at the time carried around their Mitsui copies that played on everything - even when scratched/dirty/covered in dust...go figure.

 

- Give the client something extra » A well designed Digipack(sp)/good booklets/lyrics/album-art/photos of the band etc.

These are the only CD/DVD´s I will now spend my money on...oh, good sound and durable hardware is also a must (don't sell CD/DVD recorded on the cheapest supplier you can find).

 

Piracy might be a crime, but the first blood was drawn by big corporation greed - like always. 


Edited by NorthWolfeCND - 9/17/10 at 1:35am
post #68 of 79

I do not agree with the lack of access argument. It was far harder to access music when i was a teenager. There was vinyl and cassettes, which often meant sitting in front of Top Of The Pops with a microphone trying to record off a mono speaker. The radio was a matter of waiting for you favourite programme to come around once a week. Cassettes eventually died a death to CDs anyway. Now, with computer access to music from Spotify, Grooveshark, digital radio, LastFM, MySpace etc etc, no matter which way the pirates turn, their justifications only work if they ignore part of what is actually there.

post #69 of 79

With sources like last.fm I have no reason to pirate.

I agree with the digipack, or pack in souvenier things (like a poster) that can't be pirated... it would make purchasing the hard copy that much more tempting.

post #70 of 79

just checked out last FM. a nice concept, which got me thinking...

since it is lawful to copy your purchased music onto your computer (though I think in australia technically its illegal!), I wonder if you can set up a closed network system, like facebook where you can upload to the internet and allow access for your friends to stream.. I mean we technically are allowed to listen to music at home, in a car etc with friends, why would this run into problem with copyright? no downloads allowed, and if you can make it into limited membership, lets say to certain members like firends , can you circumvent copyright protection. again no illegal downloads, but just access to your homepage of a friendship network, which is uploaded by each individual say for backup of their music collection...? 

post #71 of 79

Interesting concept, but IS it legal to listen to your friends music/share your music aloud to others? I thought we decided (in this thread) a license is needed. Absurd I know, but it's not really enforced. However, a setup like you suggest might draw more attention...


Edited by 11amaberry - 9/17/10 at 11:03am
post #72 of 79

well, I'm not sure technically if it's illegal to listen to purchased music with friends but it would seem pretty absurd if it is. and not sure if it can be law if its blatantly unenforceable, since such a law would diminish the standing of law in society and practically make everyone committing a crime. I would assume at minimum it is legal as long as it is in the premise of owner's property (house, car, shop etc.). so to make such a networking to happen you must prove the system to be not of public space, which I am not sure if you can even if you limit to a closed network system. even then I guess you have the problem with copyright protection in 'only for personal use'.

well there it is, I've pretty much answered my own question, which is... IMPOSSIBLE    :P 

post #73 of 79

That's why this whole 'license' thing will have to be abolished sooner of later.  The vague and immaterial concepts amount to contracts of adhesion which usually contain terms which would be considered "unconscionable" in most other situations.  Information is free and will always be free.  In the past, such media was expensive merely because it was difficult to reproduce.  Now it can be reproduced for free.  The cat is now well and truly out of the bag.  Anything short of the complete destruction of the internet will be insufficient to stop the information revolution and the abolition so-called 'intellectual property' laws as we know them.

post #74 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Erik View Post

There was an interesting argument I came across a few weeks back that one of the causes of piracy is just how awful commercial radio has turned. It used to be that people would explore new music on the radio. After trying it, they could choose to buy. Today, there's so little music played on the radio that the only way to explore new music is to download it. That's not an excuse for piracy, but maybe Big Music could do itself a favor by taking the crap off the radio and having DJs develop their own playlists and taking requests.

Of course, it might be too late for that. I don't know any young people who take radio seriously any longer. The only dedicated listeners I know are devotees of certain AM personalities and public radio nuts. Everyone else shuffles through playlists on a DAP.


Doubt that's true as the vast majority of purchased and pirated music are the songs that commercial radio is pushing. And really, it's hard to blame the radio stations for the shift to power rotations over DJ driven selection. People only listen to the radio in 5-10 minute bursts on average, with 2 minutes being the most common listening period. Power rotations maximize the chances that the listener won't change the station and will hear something they like in their short listening periods. While Big Music may want to promote more music, Big Radio is much more interested in keeping listeners on long enough to shill for a few products.

 

As far as radio's popularity, it's death has been greatly exaggerated. It's losing mindshare and listening time, but the average person still hears the radio for something like 17.4 hours a week. That's a pretty decent chunk of time even if the audience isn't engaged for most of it.

post #75 of 79

I am sure that domestic use is perfectly acceptable. Use in a shop, restaurant, oil rig etc is where you need a license. So having your mates round to listen, or together on the internet would IMO be fine.

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