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New ESS Sabre32 (ES9018) based DAC from Audio-gd....the NFB-1 - Page 3

post #31 of 607

I emailed Kingwa,

 

He said the DSP is not used because the ESS already has jitter elimination features and is very resistant to jitter anyways.

 

The DSP is for R2R dacs that are more vulnerable. He also said specs will be forthcoming in the next few days, but the sound quality technically is higher, although different than the ref 5.

post #32 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by fmzip View Post




I was thinking the exact same thing.

 

One advantage with Wyred is they are stateside, I can call them and have REAL conversation.

 

This Audio GD unit looks intriguing. Thankfully it's not called something tacky like "FUN" or "WOW" or "OH BOY!"

 

Just when I think I  may just may buy my first Audio gd product, I read more from their website. Condcutive then makes me think, is the quality control really there? Suggesting "paper", why not just change the feet??

 

It is better not to stack gear on top of each other, if one must stack DAC NFB-1  on other gear, place a paper or some other insulating material on top of other gears' top board, because DAC NFB-1  has condcutive aluminium feet .

Dont be put off by his warnings, build quality is top notch.  They have more of a Handmade feel than that of a assembly line in a factory.  Tolerances are tight, no gaps or half done workmanship.  He actually gives you felt pads for the feet, at least this was done in my case.  Kingwa has to be the most up front and honest manufacturer I have seen in a long time.  Unlike others he does post detailed spec's and does not print a bunch of hype in order to sale his products, in fact they sale themselves based on their reputation alone.  This is probably why so many people have multiple units of his products.
 

post #33 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom W View Post


 

 

I noticed this today as well...a replacement module similar to Sparrow would have been nice (for me anyway) 2 DACS in one...maybe one musical and the other with possibly more details (or at least a different voicing).
 


These chips are too expensive to be made into such modules :P, the part of the chain where audio-gd likes to add coloration is in pre-amp, their non-headphone amp preamps have different modules for different sounds.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmzip View Post

 

This Audio GD unit looks intriguing. Thankfully it's not called something tacky like "FUN" or "WOW" or "OH BOY!"

 

Just when I think I  may just may buy my first Audio gd product, I read more from their website. Condcutive then makes me think, is the quality control really there? Suggesting "paper", why not just change the feet??

 

It is better not to stack gear on top of each other, if one must stack DAC NFB-1  on other gear, place a paper or some other insulating material on top of other gears' top board, because DAC NFB-1  has condcutive aluminium feet .


The reason it is called FUN is that in Chinese, fun means also "good to play (with)", and the FUN has modules, so it is good to play with.

 

The feet are aluminum because audio-gd thinks that it is a very good material for feet, and sometimes comes with rubber grommets to put underneath to prevent the chassis of two boxes from meeting (ask them in email for the rubber grommets if you need). It is only on their more expensive gear, while their other gear have plastic feet or aluminum lines made out of the chassis. Is the passage you quoted somehow incorrect? I edited it with others to that, and it seems correct to me, but if it is not, please let me know so we can fix it.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynobot View Post



Dont be put off by his warnings, build quality is top notch.  They have more of a Handmade feel than that of a assembly line in a factory.  Tolerances are tight, no gaps or half done workmanship.  He actually gives you felt pads for the feet, at least this was done in my case.  Kingwa has to be the most up front and honest manufacturer I have seen in a long time.  Unlike others he does post detailed spec's and does not print a bunch of hype in order to sale his products, in fact they sale themselves based on their reputation alone.  This is probably why so many people have multiple units of his products.
 

 

I myself have seen only a few quirks in build quality and packaging in audio-gd gear, none major. But some other customers have had some strange experiences, but I wouldn't worry because if they ever make a mistake or something bad happens to the gear that is not just minor cosmetics, they almost always fix it at their own expense.


Edited by haloxt - 8/21/10 at 6:44am
post #34 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shahrose View Post




I wonder how this will compare to TPA's Buffalo implementation of the 9018.



The layout of the NFB-1  http://www.audio-gd.com/Pro/dac/NFB-1/ESS3.jpg   does not look as tight as TPA's,  its essential the regulation used is very high quality and as close to the Sabre chip as possible , quality running  AVCC L&R has a large influence on the performance.

 

These dacs are known to be hard to use,  they are capable of average to excellent  performance , theres a few things in the design of these chips which make them differ from  the usual types

post #35 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by TigzStudio View Post




Go go AudioGD Sabre DAC!  Be the first guinea pig....its fun! ;)


Guess I will be one of the first Guinea Pigs, just pre-ordered.  I will compare it to the Ref5 DSP.

post #36 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynobot View Post




Guess I will be one of the first Guinea Pigs, just pre-ordered.  I will compare it to the Ref5 DSP.


awesome! :D

post #37 of 607


You my friend Roc! ;P

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynobot View Post




Guess I will be one of the first Guinea Pigs, just pre-ordered.  I will compare it to the Ref5 DSP.

post #38 of 607

I just hope it sounds near as good as the Ref5 DSP.  At $850 shipped its a great deal in my book.

I used to own a few 1K Dac's and the Ref5 beats all of them easily.  Even the 1.5K Dacs like the RME and Metric Halo would be hard pressed to beat it.

 

I think Kingwa has a good design philosophy and is just as capable if not more than anyone to get the most out of a Sabre DAC chip.....I hope

post #39 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by haloxt View Post

I looked at the page just now and notice it says there will be some circuitry differences between this test version and the final version, 5 group psu instead of 4, and a different motherboard.

 

I bring this up here because this latest change contradicts this statement which was on the page for most of its time up.

 

 

 

I will send Kingwa an email and try to get this worked out.


Any updates?

 

What are the odds of a second revision of this being brought out within months of the original? I'm tempted...but don't want a new version to replace this in a short time. :-)

 

Where does Kingwa find time to design and engineer new gear? Does he ever sleep?

post #40 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawn_low

Where does Kingwa find time to design and engineer new gear? Does he ever sleep?



I have asked myself this question a few times,I don't understand.When I'am having a conversation, it seems like the product he's discussing is the only one at hand,couple weeks later he introduces a brand new item.

post #41 of 607

shawn: I once asked Kingwa for details of where to solder a wire for a switch and he sent a screenshot, which, suffice to say, was very busy.  

 

It looks as if he has removed all the excess parts for the digital circuitry in a Ref 5 to build the NFB, as the Sabre has them built-in.  I imagine a final design will be suitably adapted around the chip.  I did ask him about how he reckoned it sounds vs. the PCM1704, as previously he'd said he hadn't found a better sounding DAC.  He said it was a little livelier but as good. Considering how precise he is about even the slightest differences in sound, even on low-end gear, it was very unexpected.  I think (and I said this in the other thread) he is more worried about people rejecting the idea of a non-PCM1704 DAC from him.

post #42 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawn_low View Post

Any updates?

 

What are the odds of a second revision of this being brought out within months of the original? I'm tempted...but don't want a new version to replace this in a short time. :-)

 

Where does Kingwa find time to design and engineer new gear? Does he ever sleep?


Interesting you mentioned this.  I spoke to him tonight and was asking him if he planned on making a dual-mono ES9018 DAC (using two of these chips) in the form of something like the Reference 7.  I was quite surprised when he said he won't be designing anything else for awhile because he needs to rest -- yes, he actually said he needs to rest.  I hope he's okay and not sick or something like that:

 

"I am a bit tired want some months rest.

So I think I can't design and can't sure I can design dual ES9018,

Kingwa"

post #43 of 607

PCM1704 based DACs have become a religion for most if us, audio-gd holds its ground because of these amazing DACs.

 

But that is what test users are for,i'am sure the initila purchases will reveal the differences.What can be nicer then a cheaper DAC that exceeds the Ref 5

post #44 of 607

I have just started to use DAC-19 DF for less than 2 months. It's very tempting to get this one. What the heck should I do?

post #45 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by SaiSai View Post

I have just started to use DAC-19 DF for less than 2 months. It's very tempting to get this one. What the heck should I do?


You can either A:  wait for impressions of the new dac 

 

or B:  Sell the dac-19 and get it nao!

 

 

personally I would go B.  lol

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