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Audio-gd Reference 7 Loaner Program (USA) - Page 15

post #211 of 370

Thanks dukja, one more person heard both is commenting Lavry has a more 'digitized' sound. 

I'm more and more convinced to A-Gd DAC now.

 

I wonder whether Lavry 'fix' the 'digitized' sound on DA11 or not. 

 

Btw, did you compare them (DA10 vs Ref. 7) on balance or SE?  cos I don't bother running balance system. 

I know A-Gd put a lot of emphasize and excellent on balance, while the SE is so-so only.  If you compare it only Balance, then it might not all applicable to me.


Edited by RedBull - 11/9/10 at 2:20am
post #212 of 370

I don't think the DA11 has a "digitized" sound but it's definitely very neutral to the point of sterility, dry and edgy. It's like the DAC forces you to listen to each and every note it produces. Detail-freaks will love the DA11 definitely. 

post #213 of 370

no complains here with how lavry sounds..does that means i love digitalized sound ?

post #214 of 370

The SQ signature remains no matter SE or balanced with Ref1/7. 

 

When you hear people talking about Audio-GD need to run balanced, I believed it is regrading to Phoenix, which I have and totally agree.

 

BTW, my Ref7 is on its way here so I have not heard it (with DSP V5).  And Ref-7 with V5 is another level up from Ref-1 with V3 DSP.

 

Actually, I bought Ref-7 to mate with Phoenix and move Ref-1 to be with my CSP2+, which is a SE OTL amp.  CSP2+ really shines with Ref-1 even with SE connection.  I have been considering Audio-GD's SE offering (Ref-9) but eventually jump to Ref-7/1 because its SQ is exactly what I look for.

 

So, take the balanced capability as the bonus for your future (even remotely) possibility to balanced system.  You won't loss much SQ using Ref-7 in SE mode (to my ear).
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedBull View Post
Btw, did you compare them (DA10 vs Ref. 7) on balance or SE?  cos I don't bother running balance system. 

I know A-Gd put a lot of emphasize and excellent on balance, while the SE is so-so only.  If you compare it only Balance, then it might not all applicable to me.

post #215 of 370
Originally Posted by winzzz View Post

no complains here with how lavry sounds..does that means i love digitalized sound ?

 

Not necessarily. Without other DACs to compare it means you like or you adapted to the sound of your DAC.

 

Last weekend I was doing some "updates" inside my RE-1 and during that time I reinstated DacMagic into my main setup. By the end of the second day DM sounded really good to my ears and I was quite enjoying it. But once RE-1 was back online the differences were immediate and obvious... and DM was quietly stored away.


Edited by FauDrei - 11/9/10 at 7:16am
post #216 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by dukja View Post

The SQ signature remains no matter SE or balanced with Ref1/7. 

 

When you hear people talking about Audio-GD need to run balanced, I believed it is regrading to Phoenix, which I have and totally agree.

 

BTW, my Ref7 is on its way here so I have not heard it (with DSP V5).  And Ref-7 with V5 is another level up from Ref-1 with V3 DSP.

 

Actually, I bought Ref-7 to mate with Phoenix and move Ref-1 to be with my CSP2+, which is a SE OTL amp.  CSP2+ really shines with Ref-1 even with SE connection.  I have been considering Audio-GD's SE offering (Ref-9) but eventually jump to Ref-7/1 because its SQ is exactly what I look for.

 

So, take the balanced capability as the bonus for your future (even remotely) possibility to balanced system.  You won't loss much SQ using Ref-7 in SE mode (to my ear).
 


Yup, exactly Phoenix!! how do you know? biggrin.gif  Phoenix is really ordinary to the point to not good with T1 and okay only with HD650, both SE. 

I only heard Phoenix balance on D5000, it didn't WOW me either, maybe just that D5000 is not so sensitive to change in components.

 

It's a good news to know that A-Gd did not ignore SE users with its DACs.

post #217 of 370

Experience are important and I think it is the main problem here not much comparisons only a big talking about Audio-gd.

I will not say what is the best or better dac (it is too much subjective words) but definitely one of the best dac these days is Forssell MDAC-2/MADA-2 no matter on price. It is competitive with everything according to many many people. It is approximately for 3000eur but it is still very cheap against DAD, Emm Lab, Lavry Gold etc. I do not know what high-end is maybe we have just differrent mean what quality or top sound is. Definitely not the Lavry DA10 and definitely not the Benchmark DAC1, it would be quite sad if DA10 was better than ref1/7. And also it is quite funny read that R2R dacs is better than Sigma Delta dacs. It tells maybe a smart guys who sure more read than listen. If money is not issue, to my ears is the best the Meitner player XDS-1, it is simpy terefic and sound is really out of my understand. I know two excellent dacs which is at price 1000-1500$ and are competitive with tops not quite absolutely in the league with Forssell etc but very very competitive, one is diy and one is commercial..I will not write tha names here because it is unknown to this community and things which is unknown here is mostly for many people only laugh as I saw many times.

post #218 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by not_sure View Post
... I know two excellent dacs which is at price 1000-1500$ and are competitive with tops not quite absolutely in the league with Forssell etc but very very competitive, one is diy and one is commercial..I will not write tha names here because it is unknown to this community and things which is unknown here is mostly for many people only laugh as I saw many times.


Why don't you just give it a try. 

 

Or PM those who are interested.  I would like to know those two competitive DACs.  Thanks!

post #219 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by not_sure View Post

Experience are important and I think it is the main problem here not much comparisons only a big talking about Audio-gd.

I will not say what is the best or better dac (it is too much subjective words) but definitely one of the best dac these days is Forssell MDAC-2/MADA-2 no matter on price. It is competitive with everything according to many many people. It is approximately for 3000eur but it is still very cheap against DAD, Emm Lab, Lavry Gold etc. I do not know what high-end is maybe we have just differrent mean what quality or top sound is. Definitely not the Lavry DA10 and definitely not the Benchmark DAC1, it would be quite sad if DA10 was better than ref1/7. And also it is quite funny read that R2R dacs is better than Sigma Delta dacs. It tells maybe a smart guys who sure more read than listen. If money is not issue, to my ears is the best the Meitner player XDS-1, it is simpy terefic and sound is really out of my understand. I know two excellent dacs which is at price 1000-1500$ and are competitive with tops not quite absolutely in the league with Forssell etc but very very competitive, one is diy and one is commercial..I will not write tha names here because it is unknown to this community and things which is unknown here is mostly for many people only laugh as I saw many times.

No one on this forum will laugh. We are all hear to learn and find out what products sound great, the more affordable the better. Please share your info. Thanks
 

post #220 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by not_sure View Post

Experience are important and I think it is the main problem here not much comparisons only a big talking about Audio-gd.

I will not say what is the best or better dac (it is too much subjective words) but definitely one of the best dac these days is Forssell MDAC-2/MADA-2 no matter on price. It is competitive with everything according to many many people. It is approximately for 3000eur but it is still very cheap against DAD, Emm Lab, Lavry Gold etc. I do not know what high-end is maybe we have just differrent mean what quality or top sound is. Definitely not the Lavry DA10 and definitely not the Benchmark DAC1, it would be quite sad if DA10 was better than ref1/7. And also it is quite funny read that R2R dacs is better than Sigma Delta dacs. It tells maybe a smart guys who sure more read than listen. If money is not issue, to my ears is the best the Meitner player XDS-1, it is simpy terefic and sound is really out of my understand. I know two excellent dacs which is at price 1000-1500$ and are competitive with tops not quite absolutely in the league with Forssell etc but very very competitive, one is diy and one is commercial..I will not write tha names here because it is unknown to this community and things which is unknown here is mostly for many people only laugh as I saw many times.


The Forssell is also very ugly IMO and from its looks it seems to be based for commercial use more than home use. Also, I think Lavry DA10 and ref 7 are pretty much the same and neither are high end. IMO audio-gd pays more attention to the parts being used rather than how those parts contribute to the sound. I agree with you that people who think R2R dacs is better than sigma delta in general read more than listen. Both have have their strengths and weaknesses. But I must say the best sounding dac I have heard yet is a sigma delta based dac. Anyway this thread is getting off topic.

post #221 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by not_sure View Post
one is diy and one is commercial..I will not write tha names here because it is unknown to this community and things which is unknown here is mostly for many people only laugh as I saw many times.

 

Shoot!
I won't laugh, promise!  biggrin.gif

post #222 of 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by computerparts View Post




IMO audio-gd pays more attention to the parts being used rather than how those parts contribute to the sound. 


I dont know where you come off making that claim but since its your opinion you are entitled to it. Kingwa listens to a lot of high end equipment and studied their circuitry (ex CAST). 

post #223 of 370

The R2R v. Sigma-Delta debate doesn't really mean much to me.  I've heard DACs using both and have liked some and haven't like others--on both "sides."  Of the DACs I have heard, the two the Ref-7 reminded me of the most were the Esoteric D-70 and the Bryston BDA-1.  That's based on recollection and not direct comparison, so take with some salt.

post #224 of 370
Thread Starter 

I've owned a DA-10 and it isn't anywhere near as capable of the Reference 1, either in sounding natural nor resolving detail.  IMO of course.  To me, there is little more irritating than trying to enjoy jazz or classical music where the violins and pianos sound "digital" and unnatural.  I'm still scratching my head as to what is most responsible for this in DACs, as I've had all sorts of different experiences with digital inputs and whatnot with varying degrees of success in rectifying this problem.

post #225 of 370

Some updated stories from the adventures of the Audio Gd Reference 7.

 

What a massively built device. Quality is the first thing that comes to mind when you see it with the cover off. Well laid out interior and fully populated. No feeling you bought a box with a pcb in it. Only thing I take issue with is the power plug being put directly under the inputs.

 

Initial listening impressions was that while it was very resolving, I had a difficult time with the soundstage. Nice balance and full sound with no hint of adding it's own flavor to the material. Many things just sounds right that other dacs have some level of compromise doing. For one, the dynamics is massive. You can certainly hear all that gear it has under the hood. Bass is the best I've heard from a digital source. Impactful without being loose. Piano finally sounds the way a piano should, horns are metallic and brash, drum textures are there for the hearing, the strings are resonant and soaring.

 

After a couple of days with it, I as able to share with some of the gang at the Cincinnati meet. The good thing about this meet is the maturity of the members and the quality level of gear. Lots of experience with all levels of gear. We were able to rotate it through several amps of both persuasions. We didn't have a bruiser SS amp like the Beta but the Ultra stack was there for the balanced HD800s. I think all who was able to give more than a minute or two to get an idea of it's performance would agree it deserves it's press.

 

After giving everybody a taste of it's character, we changed the DSP to the V5. We again gave it the tour and total agreement that there was an improvement and yes it was noticeable. For me, I was able to finally identify the soundstage. The sound is much smoother. All benefits to the LCD-2 being used for my listening experiences. There is no high end harshness and even hot recordings are given a fresh breath.

 

She is back at home and preparing for a full week of work and a heavy dose of music over Turkey festivities and football.

 

This machine has opened up my reference to new potential. Thank you Audio GD and Amos for giving me the chance to witness this delightful piece of art.

 

PS

 

Let me comment on material and SQ. We had many high resolution transports and USB converters. I can say that 128k files improved drastically. I mention this for those that ripped their cds to a lossy format. Great material will always sound that way but the plain Jane material really gets a boost in SQ. Poor material don't have a chance though. Still sounds poor, just smells better.

 

Last, thank you Jude for giving up some of your time to let our meet happen with the Ref. 7. Gracious as always.

 

David

 

 


Edit: The optical did work. I will be trying it later this week but it was working at the meet.


Edited by Happy Camper - 11/21/10 at 8:33am
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