Would you rather live in the ascendency or descedency of a civilization?

Interesting. How do you know if you are in the ascendancy or the decline? Times are always both good and bad. This seems to be a question designed to get you thinking about just what is a "civilization"?

I mean according to all the manure I keep hearing things are supposed to be heading towards some grand new utopia of change at least in the USA. However to me it looks like we're heading for the crapper in a bullet train.

 With criminal, murderous elements on the rise and honest God-fearing working people on the decline it is at once the rise of "crapp" civilization and the decline of "good" civilization.

 

How are things looking in Bali?

it's simple.  just ask glenn beck. 

O tempora! O mores!

You're not old enough to comprehend Glenn Beck.  hee
 

Crime in the United States, especially of the violent sort, has been in a steep decline since its peak in the late 80's early 90's and has fallen to levels that haven't been seen since the 70's. The reason for the decline is in dispute by criminologists, but there's little doubt that it has been declining.

 

Not so ironic in the case of the Russians or the Japanese. Their last two decades haven't been too hot and their demographics are disastrous. And if it weren't for the threat of nuclear retaliation, the long term prognosis for both countries would be rather more grim than they are now.

im quite sure we are in decline

Can't disagree with ^.

Can't disagree, Marvin. A few of the EU countries aren't looking so good with their demographics, either.

I don't think the US is in that bad of shape. There are some significant policy and institutional problems, but that touches on politics. I'm not talking about simple partisan stuff you find in the media, but the "boring" details. No more gaming FASB regs and the bankruptcy laws need a heavy, pragmatic hand. The financial industry needs some sunlight, a few cups of bleach and perhaps should be run through an autoclave. But once that's fixed, I think the economy would right itself and things would be OK.

Redcarmoose:

 

Heh, me too.

 

This thread reminded me of one a quote from one of my favorite historians Dan Carlin, "the story of empires: boots go up the stairs, slippers come down."

Nice quote. Reminds me of "in like a lion and out like a lamb".

I live in a van down by the river, so it's all the same to me. 

Which country is civilization? Never heard of it before.

Not a huge fan of the Roman-inspired (as far as I can tell) model of ascent, apex and decline model of 'civilization' - societies have ups and downs, and at the same time parts of society might be improving whilst others are in decline. 

i think what makes civilisation in decline is we no longer care about the long term.  all we care about is the short term, be it profitability, everything being disposable etc.  take houses, look at Georgian buildings, all great stone built, as solid now as they were 100 years ago.  all new build propertys are all built to a 25 year life expectation and so solid a swift kicking would knock them down.

 

if you stop planning for the future you will have no future.