ATH-AD2000 Owners: DAC/Amplifer suggestion?

Hey, Head-Fiers.

I recently picked up a pair of ATH-AD2000s and I fell in love with them. In fact, I love all my headphones; my Grado SR80i's, and my Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 10vi IEMs too. I'm a firm believer that every set of cans has their own place to shine.

I've been looking at a replacement for my Astro Mixamp (I also have a Mini^3, but I believe neither can drive these cans properly, even if they are easy to drive). I've also been looking as a possible replacement to my Creative X-FI soundcard in the form of a decent DAC (USB, RCA output).

My search has shown lots of people with differing opinions, from 2003 to 2010. A common amplifier people used was the GIlmore Lite. Unfortunately, they don't make Gilmore Lite amplifiers anymore. It also looks like some of the amplifiers suggested since 2003 are quite rare, and some I couldn't even find information on (Terminator Amplifier?).

Does anyone have any experience with these headphones and uses a DAC+Amplifier or a combination unit? Is it even worth it, compared to a mixamp? These cans aren't very hard to drive, and neither are my other headphones. I'm assuming there is a DAC/Amplifier or a combination unit which can drive anything I throw at it and not be picky about the gain.

Before I forget... someone mentioned low gain with these headphones. I can't find what gain the DA-152 has, so I'm not sure if it will work as a suitable DAC/Amplifier combination. The HA-006+ does have a low gain option, however. I can't find a decent DAC to use with it, though.

Here are some of the the things I looked at:

KECES DA-152

Sheer Audio HA-006+ (Lower gain is better?)

Pico DAC (also, the Pico Amp/DAC combo)

M^3 and other offerings at YBM Audio, such as the B22 (Probably a lot more expensive and out of my league, however buying a few kits from glass jar would be fun to build)

Thanks 

Quote:

Originally Posted by tranhieu 

My vote goes to the M3 + S11, I'm using it with the opa627/637 and it yielded a very satisfying result. very good, accurate bass response, which I notice that it's not very far behind my low s.n k1000's bass. the m3 happens to be quite a warm amp so it helps the bass somehow, but the mid is what I totally love! very ath-ish, though you know it's colored the moment you put them on your head but it's like doing drug, you cant get them off! Treble is quite rolled off but it's a worthwhile trade anyways

My opinion here might be biased toward the M3 since I havent heard any of the others in your list, but I'm sure you wont have a bad time with that combo ;)

Tranhieu,

AMB designs great stuff. I've never heard a M3, but if it's anything like my Mini^3, I'm sure it's a great amp. I use my Mini^3. iPod exclusively. 

I couldn't much online except for schematics for a M3, and nothing regarding a S11 on the net except for some head-fiers selling both bundled. I did find some people mentioning how rare the two are, though. I don't see many M3s for sale, either. I think only two professional builders make them. I suppose I could build one, but I'm wondering if the return is worth it compared to getting a B22 4 board kit with a double sigma kit and working towards building that.

Assuming I did buy all of that from Glass Jar Audio, the total parts would run over $700 and require a lot of soldering and work. It might be fun, though.  If I did that, I'd be DAC-less except for a Creative X-FI though. Would it make more sense to go for a good amp/DAC combo, a good amp and a separate DAC, or a good amp with a good PSU and keep the soundcard?

Quote:

Originally Posted by tranhieu 

a balanced b22 + 2 s22 will cost you 3 times as much a m3 + s11 does, and honestly I see no reason for building a b22 if all you want to power is a ad2000 pair. they're pretty easy to be driven, even straight from my little udac they still sound quite good.

what do you mean by finding nothing regarding the s11? i think it's right here: http://www.amb.org/audio/sigma11/

i built the m3 + s11 myself, not very a tough job but you should have some basic understanding about electronic beforehand, especially for troubleshooting (i blew a transistor and soldered the wrong things several times)

the m3 is pretty famous around here for its efficiency so I think if you go choosing it in the end, upgrading source is what you'd do in the long run, and that'd be better than having an amp/dac combo as you'll have more choice choosing the source you want plus you already have quite a good amp already

Bah. Silly me. I kept looking for a σ in my mind, not a s.

That explains why I couldn't find one. A question, though.

With this setup, how would I route the amplifier? Assuming the headphones go into the front of the amplifier and I use a RCA to Stereo adapter from the back, how would I connect it to my computer? Into a lowly Creative X-FI Soundcard? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of using such a great amp with such a great pair of cans?

After spending the latter half of the day thinking on this topic, I haven't been able to make a decision at all. 

I've been reading a lot of different reviews on Amplifiers and DACs, but no modern reviews really mention my pair of headphones specifically. That makes it a bit hard to make a comparison, because there are a few headphones similar but have some differences which would change what amplifier goes best with them.

That being said, using an Astro Mixamp or my YBM Audio High Performance Mini^3 (or even a Banzai CMoy, which is another of my portable amps) is probably not sufficient for any noticable gains either.

I'm still thinking I need a DAC to fully appreciate my ATH-AD2000's. I'm not so sure my Creative X-FI can handle a decent encode. Most of my music is FLAC, of course, but I wonder if some 24-bit vinyl rips may be suitable for the future.

I've really been considering building a Beta 22 (3 channel) with a Sigma 22, just to have a side project. Glass jar has most of the parts, and it looks like fun. It would probably pay off in the end, according to the reviews and comparisons I've read. It would take a while, but it would probably be more worth it than a simple M3. It would also be future proof, and probably able to drive near any pair of cans or IEMs with ease. 

As for the idea of a M3, there are a few on sale. I think RockHopper has one with some OPA627 opamps already built. That would be a nice and quick impulse buy, and would suit my needs well (if it's still listed, that is). It does use a wall-wart and I could probably either make or buy a sigma 11 (they're rare, though), but I'm not sure if it's economic compared to the idea of a B22 I listed above. That, and again I really can't justify buying anything if I have a cheap Creative X-FI without something else.

SO... I'm back at square one, with no idea on a great amp that can drive anything I throw at it, and a decent way to connect it to any computer to complete a rig. 

(PS: Does anyone know anything about the M-Stage amp? I saw a review but nobody has any cans similar to my AD2000's)

Update - Picked up a M3 with a Sigma 11 and OPA627 OPAmps continuously variable gain from YBM.

It sounds great! 

However, I wonder about the Essence STX. It sounds great with its ASIO driver, but it sound even better with ASIO4ALL (???). This makes me wonder if a better DAC would make it sound a lot better.

It also makes me want to upgrade. I listened to some Sennheiser HD800s and some Beyer T1's and I'm sure they would be a great addition to my collection if I had a DAC too. In fact, I probably wouldn't need anything else, now would I?

Anyways, thanks for the suggestions folks.