Are iPods a no-go for audiophiles? - Page 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by Specman 

I was replying to the post before me which said 'I love ipods' - the same kind of thing as guys buying them at their launch date. It just makes no sense, why buy a crap product, cause you're in love with it? I love my RH1 and other stuff but it's not an average bad sounding product like ipods. It looks good and sounds great.

To be sure, I said that I loved Apple products.  Mainly their computers since I have been using them exclusively for the majority of my life...  their DAPs would certainly be of interest to me.  I also claimed that I have many sources and it depends on my mood which I listen to.  I was agreeing with you because it makes me sick that Apple has become so popular and consumer-driven.  I have used iPods from the beginning when they were out of most people's price range and actually had really nice headphone outputs.  Just because you despise a product doesn't give you the right to assume that other people are blind to buy everything that is Apple, that is certainly not indicative of who I am.  I was trying to offer unbiased information to the OP because I honestly believe that iPods get an unduly bad reputation for SQ.  So chill, hoss.    

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hero Kid 

The way I see it many people try and avoid iPods either because of a personal vendetta against Apple, they are using windows and being chained to iTunes isn't pleasant, they want more control over their players (eg, EQ, better file support), they have the highest focus on SQ and straight up overlook them or don't want to be seen with a DAP that's bought by the masses.

I disagree with that if I understood it correctly. Ipods and itunes do not go hand in hand if you mean deleting and adding music files to your player. There are many options across all platforms whether you have windows, macs or linux. I used linux the majority of the time when I had a 5.5G ipod however if that has changed recently with the itouch and classic and their other recent products then what I'm saying here is no longer valid and thus useless.

the thing is, theres a million and 1 plugins to put music on to an ipod, but in the end, its the same thing, you have to use a patch or a trick or an add on, when a MSC player will allow you to add music just by dragging it in, no extra software requiered, its about controling something you own, and not having to pass trough hoops to be able to do what you want with it,

Oh I definitely agree that I would much rather have something that is simply drag and drop instead of going through some kind of program to put your music on but it is what it is. The reason that there are so many different options is however due to the fact that ipods are extremely popular making up probably 85% if not more of the dap market (that is a total guess number..nothing official) which I guess is one of the good things about it being popular.

Might I just add, that when using foobar with foo_dop, all you have to do is right click the song(s) in your playlist, and press "Send to ipod" and its instantly transferred to your ipod/iphone. Installing foobar is much, MUCH quicker than an itunes install!

Be wary of the term "Audiophile" its a term that rubs really badly against me. Its the sort of term that to me describes the sort of person that is likely to chuckle at your average teenager that is using an ipod on the bus, thinking to themselves "They will never realise that it sounds horrid because my ears are golden!"

I know "audiophiles" that will honestly say that ANY digitized music sounds "like trash" and will only listen to tape reels and vinyls.

My point is, certain players might sound better than the ipod (and obviously depending on what model it is makes a large difference) but to say that they "ALL SOUND LIKE TRASH" is a really, really tall statement. 

+1 for the post by Uncle Erik. Summed it up nicely.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Erik 

iPods are wonderful. Seriously. They store lots of music, are intuitive to use, are reliable and well made, and sound very good with a pair of IEMs. No, it's not the same as running 180g vinyl or SACD through glorious vaccum tubes and into full-sized electrostatic speakers. However, something does not need to sound like that to be enjoyable. A lot of snobbery gets kicked around here, especially towards well-known consumer gear. If the iPod was handmade by one guy with a six month waiting list, cost $900, and none of your non-audiophile friends had ever heard of it, it would be regarded as a pinnacle of audiophilia. But because your old aunt knows what an iPod is and might have one, it gets downgraded to "crap" because of the super-secret, elite knowledge gained at an audio message board. While an iPod might not be the best, it's plenty good enough to be enjoyable. In the same sense, a couple of Dodger Dogs and a draft Budweiser makes me plenty happy when I go to the ballpark. Sure, I could get fussy and snippy about them, but the truth is that they're good enough to enjoy and if I get hung up on snobbery instead of fun, then I'm just being a jerkoff. Enjoy an iPod for what it is.

Oh my, are you me? I could not agree more even if I wanted to.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hero Kid 

The way I see it many people try and avoid iPods either because of a personal vendetta against Apple, they are using windows and being chained to iTunes isn't pleasant, they want more control over their players (eg, EQ, better file support), they have the highest focus on SQ.

I humbly concede that point and gladly acknowledge you are talking about someone like me.  I could add another list of 'good' reasons but that would be irrelevant to the topic at hand.  Based on some trusted reviewers alone and knowledge of the OS 4 EQ fix and cirrus logic chip I don't doubt it sounds better than a non box'd or LOD'd Sansa.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jensy 

 

I know "audiophiles" that will honestly say that ANY digitized music sounds "like trash" and will only listen to tape reels and vinyls.

 

While the word trash is harsh, it is true no amount of digital sampling can ever match the resolution of a true analog source.  Although that comes with obvious drawbacks associated w/ analog media.  Its human nature to take sides and believe your side is right or better than the other.

I can say that i used to be an Anti Apple person , i had a Zune 30, then a Zune hd and was very happy with it until it got stolen ,....... somehow i managed to grab a very sweet deal on an ipod Touch and to my surprise it sounded very nicen with my portapros ......and this is coming from a person that always tought that Ipods suck....... i can say with confidence that i am very happy with my ipod touch , and i am just talking about music ....of course i am also happy that i can play Resident Evil 4 and street fighter 4 on it but the sound quality is nothing like i expected .....and ive heard Sony A818 , Sansa Clip (i actually own one) , Zune 30, Zune HD, and i can say that the only one of these that truly sounds better than the Touch (better  to me means that you can actually tell the difference hearing side by side) is the Sansa CLIP

To summerize .... i am not an Apple lover , on the contrary i think their Computers are overpriced , but i have to admit that the Ipod Touch is a very good device 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anaxilus 

While the word trash is harsh, it is true no amount of digital sampling can ever match the resolution of a true analog source. 

Of course, but I dislike the "golden ear" principle that makes people swear that they can hear a massive difference between the sources. IMHO, the difference between an analogue source and a high bitrate digitized file is arguable, and that alone means the difference is not massive. Of course its all subjective, however. 

I love the launch day queues, they are full of people who love a product enough to make the extra effort to get it (and others who just want to hawk it on eBay for profit). Long live Infinite Loop.

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebags 

It's a stupid question and sorry for asking, but from all the pictures I see posted, no one uses an iPod. Is it poor sound quality and lack of Rockbox support for newer models?

A lot of people use them and IMO they have good sound quality but for most of us here, when you want the BEST sound quality you can get in a portable setup, there are other DAPs out there that beat the iPods. They are great if you want to do other things (mainly talking about the Touch here) such as watching video, surfing the net, playing games, etc. but if you want a player for pure SQ there are "better" options out there.

Personally I used many iPods back last year but I recently got the T51(s:flo2 for America) and love it; it's one of the best DAPs out there concerning pure sound quality. Of course specific sound signatures that come with some devices have an impact on what some people buy as well; it all comes down to preference. 

PS: It largely depends on how good your headphones are as to you being able to hear the differences between various DAPs. Some phones with coloration aren't going to be affected as much by the various choices in DAPs but as you go up the line you may find that certain DAPs outweigh others. 

Ipod touches and iPhones are way off the mark. As an older audiophile (50s) I have to say they are among the least pleasant mass marketed audio devices I've owned. Much too far on the bright side of neutral. I think someone called them "metallic" sounding. Well, that's not a typical audiophile term, but I think the sound he means is edgy and harsh, rather than euphonic. I agree. I liked my new iPhone at first, but the brightness of the sound has driven me away from using it as an iPod. I'm planning on getting rid of it. I have warm Sennheiser headphones and use a vintage Total AIrhead (the warmest amp they ever made) and I still can't tame these newer iPod and iPhones. Just way too bright. Apple really degraded the sound in these because they were more interested in putting a boatload of "gizmos" on these devices. The older iPods had much better sound. My 2nd gen players packed a wallop. Powerful and plenty of bass. I might see about fitting a bigger harddrive in one of those, one of these days.Many people think the best sound - among the modern iPods - came to fruition during the "video iPod" line. I can attest to that and recommend you hunt down one of these used if you really care for sound quality, Gen. 5 or 5.5. I recently used my iPhone as a player for three weeks. Then I went back to the same rig with the iPod video as a source. You would not believe how much better the iPod video sounds. If you keep moving forward with the latest ipod on the market, without looking back for comparison, you'd never know the difference. But that's what audiophiles do. We WORK at finding the best sound. I would never give up using an iPod. They are just way too convenient. A great device. But lately sound has suffered seriously in the name of other features. So to answer your question. Yes, iPods are for audiophiles, but the latest ones are not.

I am using Red wine modded pod

MSB modded pod for dig out

Ipad with camera kit

Love the convenience and sound