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My DIY electrostatic headphones - Page 75

post #1111 of 1588
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinsettawong View Post


Do you mean that the diaphragm has a small hole on it or is it the dust cover that has a hole?  It is very unlikely that the diaphragm has any hole - unless you really crank up the volume so much that the diaphragm is burnt through.  The dust cover on the other hand is very fragile.  I'm not so sure if taping up the hole can really cure the problem.  Try the headphones for a few days and let us know if the problem is really solved.

Wachara C.


Hello!

 

Small hole in defending film of stator, not in diaphragm. Well, it's still ok in sound of damaged drive. So repaire was good for it.

post #1112 of 1588
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbest View Post


Hello!

Small hole in defending film of stator, not in diaphragm. Well, it's still ok in sound of damaged drive. So repaire was good for it.

We call that a dust cover diaphragm. It's there to protect the driver against dust and humidity. It's very important that this dust cover is in good shape. Otherwise, a lot of odd things could happen. I'm glad to hear that your fix is good.

Wachara C.
post #1113 of 1588

Have any of you had problems with your diaphragms gaining a permanent charge? One channel is very close to unstable with 0V bias! This seems to have happened after I wiped down the coating with a paper towel, presumably statically charging the plastic itself.

 

It makes horrendously loud stax-fart when I compress the earcup on my ear, and slowly peels off the stator. 

 

Know a good way to discharge the mylar itself? I guess this would be the same procedure as 'breaking' electret headphones.

post #1114 of 1588
Thread Starter 

Hi dude_500,

 

I don't think that the diaphragm is permanently charged.  If you think that is the case, you can try to confirm it by playing some music through it without any bias voltage to see if you can hear music loudly.

 

I'm sure that you don't have enough tension on your diaphragm.

 

Wachara C.

post #1115 of 1588
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinsettawong View Post
 

Hi dude_500,

 

I don't think that the diaphragm is permanently charged.  If you think that is the case, you can try to confirm it by playing some music through it without any bias voltage to see if you can hear music loudly.

 

I'm sure that you don't have enough tension on your diaphragm.

 

Wachara C.

 

It made a little sound at zero bias, but not much. So you're right, no significant charge build up there.

 

Came up with an idea this afternoon, and successfully solved by re-painting my stators with flat paint instead of glossy. Now a nice quiet thud when it hits instead of a deafening scream. This makes sense, since with glossy paint, even if a plastic insulative paint, large surface contact can occur between the diaphragm and stator, making it much harder for it to peel away and also making more noise.

 

Now very stable at my max bias of 900V with no change to the diaphragms.

 

 

So moral of the story is use flat paint on stators, not glossy.

post #1116 of 1588

There shouldn't ever be contact between the stator and the diaphragm.  If that happens then the distortion shoots up by a huge margin. 

post #1117 of 1588
Thread Starter 

Findng the right tension is a very difficult task indeed. 

post #1118 of 1588
Quote:
Originally Posted by spritzer View Post
 

There shouldn't ever be contact between the stator and the diaphragm.  If that happens then the distortion shoots up by a huge margin. 

 

With the whole paint problem, I just mean when you push the headphones into your ear slamming the diaphragm out, not during normal operation. Paint doesn't matter during normal operation, only when the diaphragm is slammed into the side manually which is when I was having my troubles.

post #1119 of 1588
Thread Starter 

Hi dude_500,

 

You'll soon find out that the paint doesn't help with your problem that much.  I still think that you need to put more tension on your diaphragm in order to solve the problem once and for all.  With the right tension, you can also increase your bias voltage.  The phones will sound even livelier and more pleasant.

 

Wachara C.


Edited by chinsettawong - 11/3/13 at 8:44pm
post #1120 of 1588
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinsettawong View Post
 

Hi dude_500,

 

You'll soon find out that the paint doesn't help with your problem that much.  I still think that you need to put more tension on your diaphragm in order to solve the problem once and for all.  With the right tension, you can also increase your bias voltage.  The phones will sound even livelier and more pleasant.

 

Wachara C.

 

 

At what point will I realize that the paint doesn't help the problem? The paint solved the problem, completely. So far confirmed with about 20 hours of listening and expecting it to remain this way for the foreseeable future!

 

Diaphragms are about the same tension as all the headphones I've made in the last two years, all worked and do work great minus the revision that had glossy paint, which has now been fixed.

 

 

If you don't believe the paint texture can matter and care enough to try, spray the stators of an old driver set with glossy paint and give them a listen. Push it towards your ear to slam the diaphragm and listen to the screams! You might want ear protection :basshead: 


Edited by dude_500 - 11/3/13 at 9:06pm
post #1121 of 1588
Thread Starter 
I was the one who advised you to always paint your stators, wasn't I? If that totally solved your problem, I'm glad for you. On my headphones, if the diaphragm ever touches the stator, it would just bounce right back. With the riight tension, even if you don't paint your stators (Stax doesn't paint its SR007 stators), the diaphragm would just bounce out after touching the stator. And that creates the famous Stax fart sound.

Comparing your new phones with your prior version, which one sounds louder?

Wachara C.
Edited by chinsettawong - 11/3/13 at 9:15pm
post #1122 of 1588
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinsettawong View Post

I was the one who advised you to always paint your stators, wasn't I? If that totally solved your problem, I'm glad for you. On my headphones, if the diaphragm ever touches the stator, it would just bounce right back. With the riight tension, even if you don't paint your stators (Stax doesn't paint its SR007 stators), the diaphragm would just bounce out after touching the stator. And that creates the famous Stax fart sound.

Comparing your new phones with your prior version, which one sounds louder?

Wachara C.

 

Last time I listened to SR007's, they did have a fair bit more noise to the slam than my headphones do with the flat paint I use (which is nearly silent), although nothing like this glossy paint. I could see the surface of typical copper clad being a lot more textured than glossy paint, especially if Stax gives it a sanded finish. Who knows, not really worth debating about. I've had mixed results with exposed copper, great results with flat paint, and disastrous results with glossy paint. Take from it what you will.

 

Indeed, thanks for the painting idea. If I'd just used the same paint as last time, I wouldn't have had these problems!

 

The new headphones at 900V bias sound about the same volume as the old headphones at their 580V bias (I don't like to drive them any higher than that, I've heard pops and crackles in the 700V range).Although I only really listen to the new ones since they sound vastly better in basically every regard. 

 

I would have expected the difference in efficiency to be (0.5/0.8)^2, but it's a little more favorable than that. Likely because of the larger driver area. 

 

 

Should have everything at the NY meet on Saturday.


Edited by dude_500 - 11/3/13 at 9:45pm
post #1123 of 1588
Thread Starter 
The larger diaphragm area does indeed make a difference.

Have fun at the NY meet and let us know how other people like your headphones. smily_headphones1.gif

Wachara C.
post #1124 of 1588
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinsettawong View Post
 

Findng the right tension is a very difficult task indeed. 

 

It is indeed and Stax managing to maintain it for hundreds and hundreds of units is just nuts. 

post #1125 of 1588

Hello everyone,

my name is Federico and that's my first post here (actually i registered because of this thread :D).

 

1- Wachara your diy headphones seems fantastic, thank you for sharing your designs.

 

2- After some research i won an auction for a basic 2050 stax set because this thread urged me to build some diy esl headphones and i needed an amp.... i'll wait for the set, listen to it and in the meantime start designing something buildable :jecklinsmile:.

 

3- i have a little question for the gurus: is there a reason if nobody attempted to clone Stax sigmas using Wachara ideas?

I was thinking that a 3d printer could replicate the peculiar sigmas case in a cheap and effective manner.

I'll probably build something easier first like one of Wachara's round designs then move on the "Sigma clone" so i have plenty of time for research and design. 

 

Thank you everyone for your time and sorry for my bad english.

Federico

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