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Audeze LCD2 vs Sennheiser HD800?? - Page 8  

post #106 of 1379
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakeride74 View Post

I've been debating between the HD800 and T1... thought I was sold on the HD800 given what I love about the k702 and what it does better that I don't like about the K702. Now I find this... thanks alot.

 

wrong.jpg

I love it!  Very apropos!
 

post #107 of 1379

The only thing stopping me from placing an order is that my landlord has the unit I am renting up for sale and my future residence is not clear.  Last thing I want is for these babies to be delivered to somewhere I am not.  When that is absolved I will definitely place an order.  I just can't ignore the science behind these cans.

post #108 of 1379

screw the science, they sound great :p

post #109 of 1379


Quote:

Originally Posted by smeggy View Post

screw the science, they sound great :p

 


science.jpg

post #110 of 1379

it must be true, her chest says so

 

science_square_4.jpg

post #111 of 1379

It must be true! :)

 

To be slightly on topic: I wish I could have gone to canjam to give the LCD2's a listen :( They look like very nice cans.

post #112 of 1379
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebby View Post

It must be true! :)

 

To be slightly on topic: I wish I could have gone to canjam to give the LCD2's a listen :( They look like very nice cans.


Where's the damn loaner program already!

post #113 of 1379

Jail bait!

post #114 of 1379
gominch, kwkarth, TheJudge, and everyone else who has participated in this forum -- a big thank you for a fab read! It's been a while since I've read such an entertaining and informative thread in Head-Fi.
 
kwkarth, your views, prose, style, and humor all add up to "gentleman."
 
The humor and wit throughout has been outstanding.
 
Once again, thanks, and please keep the talk coming!
post #115 of 1379

kwkarth certainly does know his stuff. I agree with his earlier reply that one can argue the pitch and toss until the cows come home. Be my guest to make sense of that mixed metaphor.

 

I do feel compelled to repeat that I respect his knowledge of this subject, grace and seemingly infinite patience. I almost feel guilty for implying that he is a know-it-all. I withdraw that implication forthwith, and look forward to engaging him in further pointless debate.  

post #116 of 1379

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheJudge View Post

kwkarth certainly does know his stuff. I agree with his earlier reply that one can argue the pitch and toss until the cows come home. Be my guest to make sense of that mixed metaphor.

 

I do feel compelled to repeat that I respect his knowledge of this subject, grace and seemingly infinite patience. I almost feel guilty for implying that he is a know-it-all. I withdraw that implication forthwith, and look forward to engaging him in further pointless debate.  


Not to worry.  Your difference of opinion and misunderstandings were entirely justified and normal.  I found it VERY easy to take on both your points of view and I applaud your courage for having expressed yours.  Being able to air differences of opinion and clearing them up in this way, is what useful discussion is about.  I thank you and Beagle for your wonderful input.  Without it, there would have been inadequate balance, making the thread much less of the satisfying read than it currently is.

 

One day I may well hear the LCD-2.  However, I'm already losing my latest and greatest enthusiasm.  It's just too much and too fast for me .... and I'm only 42yrs old!!  Add to my having tried a few high end cans and coming away appreciating differences and unique strengths, but no particular superiority to motivate continuing to try them despite all the praise and adulation that comes.  The HD800's are now my favourites.  They've grown on me.  But interestingly, I still wouldn't want to use them alone.  I still love my Ed8's and HD650's.  The three of them make for a very satisfying collection at this time. 

 

I suspect the HE-5LE and HE-6's will be orphaned by the arrival of the LCD-2's.  Head-fi can certainly be the source of tremendous success for some cans and the unjustified flop of others.  

post #117 of 1379
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwkarth View Post



Yes, the measurements are repeatable, and in fact, were repeated a number of times to verify results.

 

I guess one can "debate" anything one wants to debate.

 

I suspect the HD-800s, like the LCD-2s are made with great care and precision with constant parameter and performance validation taking place at all critical steps during manufacture.  Variations from unit to unit, if any, should be too minute to be audible.

 

As we discussed before, once all the objective performance criteria are accounted for, the differences between one headphone and another, and their ability to reproduce a "real life experience" come down how closely the designer's HRTF happens to match your own, which as I said before, is neither good, nor bad, neither right nor wrong.

 

Just to clinch the nail, if a given headphones objective performance is up to snuff, then the rest is up to you.  There are very, very, very few headphones on the planet whose objective performance measures as good as the two we're discussing in this thread.

 

Not that I attach any credibility to these measurements whatsoever kwkarth, but in an attempt to at least appear open minded about this, have you seen any comparative measurements between these two phones and the T1?  If so, how does the T1 stack up?

 

You will need to interpret the results for me again because I have no understanding of such things. 
 

post #118 of 1379
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheJudge View Post

Not that I attach any credibility to these measurements whatsoever kwkarth, but in an attempt to at least appear open minded about this, have you seen any comparative measurements between these two phones and the T1?  If so, how does the T1 stack up?

 

You will need to interpret the results for me again because I have no understanding of such things. 
 

As a matter of fact, I have no recollection of having seen measurements from CanJam for the T1s.  I realized this the other day and started looking for them.  I like the sound of the T1 too....  Next best thing, I pulled the data from Headroom's test data;  Remember, this data was obtained from different test equipment, in a different test environment, at a different time, using different test frequencies and calibrations.   I've added the Sennheiser HD-800 data from their same databank for reference.

 

These FR graphs show the "normalized" or "corrected" data only, not the raw data.  Tracking is pretty close to the HD-800.

 

When I listen to the 800 vs the T1, I hear a broad and shallow rise (bump) between about 4kHz and 8kHz.  I do not hear that same bump on the T1, but rather a taller, more narrow bump around 8 or 10kHz.  These "bumps" would be more obvious if we were looking at "raw" rather than "corrected" data.

tifr.jpg

 

As you can see, the THD measurement data shown here is quite different from the data that was captured at CanJam, so we have to rely on the direct comparison to the HD-800.  The big spike on the chart around 500Hz is the initial pulse, but distortion products look to be 30-40dB less on this system than what we saw at the CJ.

T1thd.jpg

 

The impedance curve for the 800 looks very similar to the data Tyle captured at CJ, the curve for the T1 looks either out of range of bogus, so there's no usable data here.

T1imp.jpg

 

Very close tracking here between the Senn and the T1.  Both cans are very fast (agile), exhibit some overshoot, and a fundamental loss of pressure gradient.  Translation; Neither if these cans produce huge amounts of impact, and the T1 looks to be ever so slightly better and shows slightly tighter bass, which differences are probably not audible.

T150hz.jpg

 

500Hz square wave tracking is very close.  This is midband response.  You can expect better than average midband detail from both cans, but neither is as clean as the LCD-2s in that area.  As ragged as this plot looks, it's better than most cans, but significantly not as good as the LCD-2.

T1500hz.jpg

 

Bottom line?  I would expect from these graphs that the T1 and the HD-800 sound somewhat similar to one another.  Guess what?  To my ear, they do have definite similarities.  The broad bump just above the midband on the HD-800 really sticks out to my ear, and the smaller, narrower bump on the T1 is not so bothersome to me, but I could easily get used to listening to either can.  There are far worse things one could listen to.  


 

post #119 of 1379

BTW, thanks for the kind comments guys.

post #120 of 1379

Thank you for doing that kwkarth; most interesting. I'd love to be able to compare these cans for myself. Alas, I think that is unlikely.

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