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Audio gd Sparrow Blind Test - Page 32  

post #466 of 502

Well I think everyone here is here to enjoy the music. I think it is like drinking wine. A lot of people love the taste of wine. I don't think you should judge wine connoisseurs harshly because they love the delicate intricacies of wine and pride themselves on being able to recognize them. They enjoy the wine, but then there is the next level that they also can enjoy and appreciate. Music is similar, where everyone can love this song or that. But being able to feel like you are there because the exact reverberations of a drum beat draw in the listener that much more.

post #467 of 502


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy*Carl View Post

 

As for the auditioning you mentioned, I agree.  If i could audition DAC/AMPs, then I would never have bought them.  But the problem with this "hobby" is that you cant really audition a vast majority of the gear very easily and you do rely on others opinions alot.


Get yourself a ticket to Japan-land.

post #468 of 502

Read about 28 pages of this thread before my attention just wandered too far off to stay on topic.

 

The biggest thing I've found in determining differences in Hi-Fi gear is ear training. Musicians or those who are in constant contact (recording engineer, interested sibling, etc) with a musician have a huge advantage. The closer the person is to the core of the music the easier it will be for them to pick out differences in Hi-Fi gear. There were some mentions of this earlier, but I just wanted to further emphasize it. As a classically trained violist for approximately 12 years before even touching my first Hi-Fi gear I could tell differences right away, and since that first piece of gear my ability to do so has grown.

 

I work in a violin shop and when a family comes in to shop for a new instrument for the child, typically the player will be able to tell the differences readily, though they are usually very timid about playing in 'public'. This following bit is more stereotypical, but I find it more often truer than not: The mother/sibling will usually be able to tell a majority of the differences in instruments, while the father (unless a musician, himself) is left with the price tag as the only thing he can tell one another with. I've worked at this job for 10 years and I can't count the number of times the above is spot on.

 

Ear training is something that can be learned at any age, but the adage is always true: It's always better to learn new things at a younger age. When I listen to classical music I can pick out and follow multiple melodic and harmonic lines at a time, while my father says 'that sounds nice'.

 

Last Saturday I took my main rig up to work for a friend/co-worker to hear. His only experience with audio has been his ipod touch and a pair of lower end Bose. I had previously told him that I owned some nice gear and that I enjoyed it. I didn't tell him what to expect, I simply set it up and cued up some Bach Concertos that he is intimately familiar with (he is a violinist). He listened for a good hour or two on a sampling of discs I had brought. When he was done I asked for his opinion and he said and I quote "It sounds so big, like I'm right there with them." "It's amazing." "My Bose headphones are OK, but that is wow." He's not in a financial position to purchase anything like I have nor does he really feel the need to. He is happy with what he has, but he can also appreciate the difference. I completely respect his desire to use what he uses, but I felt it my obligation since he was interested that I show him where Hi-Fi can take him. He knows what is out there and chose to stay where he's at for now, which is the best decision.

 

Last Christmas I played an album on my gear for my sister who lives 12 hours away. She turned me on to the album a couple years prior, but when she heard a certain track she took the headphones off and said "Those are coins! I thought it was just a tambourine." She is far from a musician and is enough older than me to not experience my musical upbringing, but even the music listener with no real training can hear differences.

 

I make no argument that I do not seek a neutral sound free from color. In fact I state that I do in fact search for gear and the synergy there-in to make the music I listen fit the way I've heard instruments in real life. Instruments/voices/effects I haven't heard myself are subject to follow the trend placed by the sounds I have heard. I found the signature in gear I recognize as my ideal reproduction of real life. I do not impose this signature as the best for anyone but myself, but I will earnestly encourage trial of the gear I use complete with as fair an analysis as I can give.

 

I started with the same HD580s as the OP, bought a solid state amplifier that was well respected. I found the sound seemed less congested, but really had not changed at all. I thought head-fi was a bunch of idiots, closed my browser and only visited a few times over the next 4 years. I recently (2 yrs ago) came back armed with my HD580, but I had sold the SS amp, and bought a basic $200 tube amp thinking I'd give the other form of amp a fair try. I found the tube amp changed the sound in a way that felt more natural (not neutral) and infinitely more engaging. I had finally found what these 'fools' had been talking about. The more I listened I became convinced there was more to be had and multiplied my amp cost 3 1/2 times figuring I'd shoot the moon and give it a real go. I was rewarded immensely with the most organic natural sound I'd ever heard from any music system be it speakers or headphones. The raw power of this new amp in combination with it being balanced giving better separation presented me with a wide soundstage and the feeling of being in the music, something I'd not felt except when playing in a live orchestra.

 

My journey is proof of both sides of the story. Hi-fi truly does exist, but finding your own path is up to you. If it is important, you will persist and make your way to what you find is best, regardless of price. If it isn't important, find something else to obsess over. Life is dull without passion.

post #469 of 502

Getting a feeling of deja-vu here, like we are recycling arguments and analogies, wonder why?

post #470 of 502

It's really best if you can go to a meet and audition things first.  For example, everyone seems to think the TWAG cable is just incredible.  Personally, I have a very hard time imagining that a cable could make that much of a difference over what is already a high-quality cable for the JH13 - plus it's $200+.  I'm just going to have to wait to audition one first...

post #471 of 502

Meets are hard to make a proper evaluation in though, as they are full of noise and other distractions, and time is usually limited. There's really no solution, you either move up the chain gradually or take bigger leaps, or forgettaboutit altogether and feign satisfaction.

 

Myself, I get a new piece of gear and love the differences until I start noticing flaws once again. Then I go backwards momentarily in order to appreciate the upgrade once again, while considering my next move up the chain. Smarter people save longer and consider their options more thoroughly, and take fewer but bigger leaps with less stops in between.

 

But I am enjoying my journey

post #472 of 502
Thread Starter 

I do appreciate good sound.  I cant stand listening through bad speakers or even mid range headphones.  The difference the HD580 makes is massive.  But I do not want to "train my ears" or have to critically listen to hear a difference.  I want to enjoy clear sounding music, something a vast majority of headphones I have heard did not deliver.

 

HD580 is truly a amazing can.  Great neutral clear sound.  Great comfort. Wide open sound.

 

But stock amps/dacs are good for me.  I will stick to the headphone subforum.  Case closed.  Happy listening.


Edited by Crazy*Carl - 7/4/10 at 12:11am
post #473 of 502

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy*Carl View Post
I will stick to the headphone subforum.  Case closed.  Happy listening.


We've heard that from you before, Crazy*Carl, I'm sure you'll be back sooner than later!

post #474 of 502


Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy*Carl View Post

I do appreciate good sound.  I cant stand listening through bad speakers or even mid range headphones.  The difference the HD580 makes is massive.  But I do not want to "train my ears" or have to critically listen to hear a difference.  I want to enjoy clear sounding music, something a vast majority of headphones I have heard did not deliver.

 

HD580 is truly a amazing can.  Great neutral clear sound.  Great comfort. Wide open sound.

 

What you can't hear doesn't matter and will never matter to you personally.  What you can't hear, you can't make comments about with regard to importance for those who can hear it.  Assuming that since you can't hear something it automatically follows through that it can't be important and is self-deception on the part of those who place importance and value on it, is a massively egocentric position to take.  This has been the general slur all this thread and makes for a huge impediment to personal development and exploration of life's offerings.   I hope that it's an attitude that applies only to hifi, but I truly doubt this.
 

post #475 of 502
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by aimlink View Post


Quote:

 

What you can't hear doesn't matter and will never matter to you personally.  What you can't hear, you can't make comments about with regard to importance for those who can hear it.  Assuming that since you can't hear something it automatically follows through that it can't be important and is self-deception on the part of those who place importance and value on it, is a massively egocentric position to take.  This has been the general slur all this thread and makes for a huge impediment to personal development and exploration of life's offerings.   I hope that it's an attitude that applies only to hifi, but I truly doubt this.
 


I have a huge impediment to personal development that you doubt is only applied to head-fi.  Thats alot to say about a person over an internet forum man...  why don't you refrain from that, as i have clearly stopped my tirade against you guys.  The happy listening, the smiley face, some of you just don't get it.


Edited by Crazy*Carl - 7/4/10 at 8:36am
post #476 of 502

Carl you really should check out hydrogen audio though. You'd fit right in, not being sarcastic, and they'd like another member who agrees with testing before making claims. Not trying to kick you out, just saying that might be another good addition of a hi-fi website with a different attitude than head-fi.

post #477 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy*Carl View Post

as i have clearly stopped my tirade against you guys.


When?

post #478 of 502


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by aimlink View Post


Quote:

 

What you can't hear doesn't matter and will never matter to you personally.  What you can't hear, you can't make comments about with regard to importance for those who can hear it.  Assuming that since you can't hear something it automatically follows through that it can't be important and is self-deception on the part of those who place importance and value on it, is a massively egocentric position to take.  This has been the general slur all this thread and makes for a huge impediment to personal development and exploration of life's offerings.   I hope that it's an attitude that applies only to hifi, but I truly doubt this.
 


Bear in mind that I have linked and referred to other similar tests that back up Carl's position. Criticism dries up when faced with more evidence. It then defaults to the easy option of slagging off Carl and complaining when he slags back.

post #479 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prog Rock Man View Post

Bear in mind that I have linked and referred to other similar tests that back up Carl's position. Criticism dries up when faced with more evidence. It then defaults to the easy option of slagging off Carl and complaining when he slags back.

I don't know about the others, but I know that I'm not complaining about anything.  I'm just sharing my take on a situation.
 

post #480 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy*Carl View Post
I have a huge impediment to personal development that you doubt is only applied to head-fi.  Thats alot to say about a person over an internet forum man...  why don't you refrain from that, as i have clearly stopped my tirade against you guys.  The happy listening, the smiley face, some of you just don't get it.

 

Indeed.  I genuinely don't get it.  
 

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