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Amp recommendations for Audeze LCD-2 - Page 66

post #976 of 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by blargman View Post

Funny guy " class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//smily_headphones1.gif" title=":)" width="" /> , So this is like the overall impedance of the entire circuit? I'm more trying to clear up noob ideas of EE theory.

 

What do you think of that amp for the LCD-2? Specwise at least if you haven't heard it.  I just have a want to try a Mapletree amp, for no particular reason.


Its the impedance as seen by the output.  Think of it as a series resistor with the headphone.  Dampening factor is simple the can impendance over the output impendance.  So 50/1.3 ~38 which is fine.  Power wise its probably fine depending on how loud you listen.  Won't push 120dB but 80dB shouldn't be a problem.  At that price the WA6SE might be a safer choice.

post #977 of 7519

Thanks for the info. If you don't mind endulging me a bit more. How did you calculate the 80dB number?

post #978 of 7519

Didn't just pulled it as a fairly easy goal to reach for pretty much any amp.

post #979 of 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cya|\| View Post

So my decision to drop the audio gd fun with discrete opamp is final.

I've already paid for a BCL clone (not the m-stage, but one with better components).

Now i'm undecided for the dac. I found a chinese dac on ebay, wich fully assembled costs 250$ shipping included. Decware copied the design, so you can see how the circit looks, on decware dac site. It's a opamp based design, but the seller provides good opa627. And that's for a fraction of the price.

But i've also just found a pcm1794 based dac, this one is fully discrete, and the SE edition costs 350$ shipping included.

I really dunno wich one to get . I'm a starving student (though i got some money left from summer work). I wonder if the fully discrete pcm1794 dac is really worth the extra money for me, who don't have much money.

In that price range, it is very, very, hard to beat the PopPulse PCM 1796 MkII which in Portland sells for $259.00  That's a very well designed and built DAC for the dinero.
 

post #980 of 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by oqvist View Post



 

Thanks. The KingRex is smoother I take it but is it at the same time more dynamic then the Burson? It sounded like it handles crescendos really well " class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//smily_headphones1.gif" title=":)" width="" />

Will see if I can get a chance to audition it.

Yeah, I haven't heard the KingRex fall apart yet.  The Burson reminds me a bit of my SAC K1000 amp.  It's a balanced BJT based amp, which for its time, was state of the art, but now shows its age when compared to newer class A MosFET based designs like the KingRex and Asgard.  YMMV.  The SAC has tons of punch and drive, but it is not as fast and resolving with the micro details and minutiae of a recording.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the KingRex is any sort of a benchmark here, but it does work well to drive the Audeze, and compared to the Burson, it strikes me as being faster with better inner detail. 
 

post #981 of 7519

I've been thinking, for me at least, between the the Phoenix and Stacker II that I have here, I prefer the former because (after a positive bias adjustment) it's more aggressive, which, being that I generally don't like the HD-650 school of frequency response in my headphones, is a better match for me with the LCD-2s.  The Stacker is very sweet (it sounds like the tubes, which in the case of the 6GQ7s in it now, means like a Stax amp) and pairs beautifully with my Symphones Magnums, which have a more common brighter treble. It still sounds very good with the LCD-2s though.

post #982 of 7519

What DAC do you run with your Phoenix Currawong?

post #983 of 7519


Glad to hear you are enjoying the Stacker II, I do miss it from time to time :P.  I never compared the Phoenix to the Stacker II, but I did compare it to the Roc.  After doing my bias adjustments on the Roc to absolutely the best I could (hours of time spent) I was able to get it close to the Stacker II, but it always had this sense of dryness.  The Roc did however have amazing speed/dynamics/detail with the LCD-2's.  But, basically to me the Stacker II was able to give you that tube sound and very lifelike natural tones with the LCD-2's, along with some pretty sweet dynamics.  In my current rig I am trying to get as close neutral as I possibly can, to my ears.  I also have great resources to compare my rig against (friends with decked out studios, other audiophile friends with some very nice rigs).

 

Do you feel the Phoenix has its own character it gives to the music, or does it seem like a "wire with gain" type?  

Quote:
Originally Posted by Currawong View Post

I've been thinking, for me at least, between the the Phoenix and Stacker II that I have here, I prefer the former because (after a positive bias adjustment) it's more aggressive, which, being that I generally don't like the HD-650 school of frequency response in my headphones, is a better match for me with the LCD-2s.  The Stacker is very sweet (it sounds like the tubes, which in the case of the 6GQ7s in it now, means like a Stax amp) and pairs beautifully with my Symphones Magnums, which have a more common brighter treble. It still sounds very good with the LCD-2s though.

post #984 of 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylab View Post

Interesting and good info, Kevin, thanks..  So the fact that a OTL amp would likely have an output impedance higher than the LCD-2's impedance doesn't really matter due to it being planar?  I did not realize that.  This is due to the fact that the movement of the diaphragm is different?

 

Also sounds like I need to try my WA2 with the LCD-2...I had stayed away from that combo.  That would be cool if they work together as the WA2 is indeed spectacular with the T1.

 

And lastly, I hope your comment about the KingRex HeadQuarter means they have come out with an improved version, as the one I was sent to review really did not sound all that great, IMO.


Yes, the diaphragm movement / suspension / damping is different from a conventional cone type driver.

 

Here's the deal...Any planar magnetic driver is driven uniformly from its entire diaphragm, not just from the center like a conventional cone type dynamic driver.  A conventional cone driver is a spring loaded mass suspended by the annulus around the cone.  As any device with a suspended mass, it will have a resonant frequency based upon the compliance of the suspension vs. the mass that is suspended.  As a cone resonates, it drags the voice coil through the fixed magnetic field.  This coil cutting the magnetic field generates electricity.  This is how a dynamic microphone works.  In a speaker, when you short out the current generated by the moving coil, it dampens the motion of the diaphragm resonance.  This works just like the electric brake on an electric drill motor.  Remove your finger from the trigger and the drill stops turning instantly.  Doing so simply shorts the motor windings, effectively damping the motor.  So it is, with damping factors and driver cone resonance in a conventional headphone or loudspeaker driver.

 

With a planar magnetic driver, the diaphragm motion is excited by passing current through a wire attached across the face of the diaphragm and not controlled by passing a coil of wire through a focused magnetic field, diaphragm resonance is damped mechanically & pneumatically rather than electrically in a planar driver.  So, while a high damping factor/very low impedance output has little effect on planar driver damping, it does affect the amplifier's ability to deliver current into the load.  The higher the output impedance of an amplifier, the more energy (power)  is lost in IR (current times resistance) losses due to internal resistance, rather than that energy being delivered to the load.

post #985 of 7519
Thanks Kevin, that was very helpful. I've owned Magnepan planar magnetic speakers for years, and understood well how the driver works to make sound, but didn't get the part about damping. Appreciate the explanation.
post #986 of 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by blargman View Post

Funny guy " class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//smily_headphones1.gif" title=":)" width="" /> , So this is like the overall impedance of the entire circuit? I'm more trying to clear up noob ideas of EE theory.

 

What do you think of that amp for the LCD-2? Specwise at least if you haven't heard it.  I just have a want to try a Mapletree amp, for no particular reason.


I can confirm that my MAD tube amp runs the LCD-2s very well. Although, I think I prefer the Concerto (disclaimer: subject to change with some more listening time and tube rolling).

post #987 of 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by blargman View Post

What DAC do you run with your Phoenix Currawong?


Audio-gd Reference 1.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TigzStudio View Post


Glad to hear you are enjoying the Stacker II, I do miss it from time to time :P.  I never compared the Phoenix to the Stacker II, but I did compare it to the Roc.  After doing my bias adjustments on the Roc to absolutely the best I could (hours of time spent) I was able to get it close to the Stacker II, but it always had this sense of dryness.  The Roc did however have amazing speed/dynamics/detail with the LCD-2's.  But, basically to me the Stacker II was able to give you that tube sound and very lifelike natural tones with the LCD-2's, along with some pretty sweet dynamics.  In my current rig I am trying to get as close neutral as I possibly can, to my ears.  I also have great resources to compare my rig against (friends with decked out studios, other audiophile friends with some very nice rigs).

 

Do you feel the Phoenix has its own character it gives to the music, or does it seem like a "wire with gain" type?  


 

 

The Phoenix is designed to be "wire with gain", same as the Roc.  I like it this way.  The penalty is, however, changing anything in your system at all is noticeable, no matter how small.
 

post #988 of 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by milford30 View Post

Thank You for your responce, i didn't explain myself clearly either i was under the assumption that anything less than $700 is probably not worth forking out the extra money for.... it is annoying how so many reviews are different, i.e the LCD-2 does better with a solid state amp... while other comments on tube amp sounds better at lower volumes.....

sorry for bouncing around between tube and solid state.... for the forseeable future ($$$ restrictions) i will not be upgrading... i reckon i can spend a bit more on the amp.... will the WA6SE (not maxxed) be a nice investment? or other amps (tube near/under the $1000 mark) should also be considered?

also i assume stock WA6 would probably not be powerful for the LCD-2 correct?

 

Your responces will be much appriciated...


I haven't heard the WA6SE, but everything I've read says it's better (even non-maxed) than my maxed WA6.  My WA6 has enough power for the LCD-2, but I don't normally listen at ear splitting levels.

post #989 of 7519

Just bought a second hand LCD-2.

Should receive it early next week.

Will report back on how it sounds with my Woo6se/Roc.

post #990 of 7519
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwkarth View Post



In that price range, it is very, very, hard to beat the PopPulse PCM 1796 MkII which in Portland sells for $259.00  That's a very well designed and built DAC for the dinero.
 

Thx a lot! I've just seen it's pictures, and the build quality seems impressive. Also, it does have the r core, wich is the kind of transformer i prefer the most.

I'll definitly look into it, and i may drop the idea to get the gigawork.
 

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