Amp recommendations for Audeze LCD-2 - Page 103

Shame, sounded like a fun project and was right up my price range. Oh well, gotta keep my eyes open for a while yet it seems!
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Equus 

Quote:

Originally Posted by BebopMcJiggy 

http://www.bottlehead.com/smf/index.php/topic,1477.0.html

"We tried SEX with the LCD-2 and it was OK but the bass was soft."

Yup...if I remember right Doc B tried the LCD-2's on almost all of the amps he had sitting around at Bottlehead, and he didn't really care for any of them.  As he mentions in the post linked, he did like the punchiness on curbfeeler's system, which I think may be a Benchmark DAC1 PRE.  I think he listened to the Stacker and didn't find it punchy enough, but I can't remember if he listened to the with the 6CG7 tubes.  That being said, both our systems sounded to "digital" for his taste too. 

Shpondle is a good test for any rig. From world, to trance, to doof, to etc - it's a full audio workout.

Really, Currawong and Sokolov91 sum-up why Phoenix seems in a class of it's own. The only other off-the-shelf headamp that might give it a run is the Schiit Lyr when it comes out in March.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gogogasgas 

Why don't we let Kingwa tell us what the Audio GD 'Phoenix' puts out into a pair of LCD-2s?

 

I asked: "I want to use the Phoenix with a pair of Audeze LCD-2s headphones.  I think these are rated at 50 Ohms. What RMS figure per channel would the Phoenix be capable of putting into the LCD-2s?

 

Kingwa replied: At 50 ohm, it can output around 2300MW.

 

That's pretty good, and remember, those are RMS, 'Class A' figures which, from my experience with regular class 'A' stereo amps, are 'bigger' and cleaner/clearer than 'garden variety' watts.

 

Has anyone who is running the Phoenix with a pair of LCD-2s noticed it running out of puff? Any signs of compression, distortion or colourations at moderately high volumes?

 

The new Shiit Hybrid will probably put out a fair bit more into 50 ohms. It won't be offering balanced connections and lacks the overall versatility of the Phoenix, but it is many clams cheaper.

 

PS On the AMB audio site (where in the B22 is), it says to watch out for inferior Chinese clones of the B22. What amp are they referring to? Also, I can't see on the website if they offer a pre-made version of the B22 for we no-way-DIY-ers.

The Roc absolutely does not 'run out of puff' driving the LCD2's so I can not imagine the Phoenix having any problems.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwkarth 

Flac files on my MACs feeding a MH25.2 DAC with GE smoked glass 6922 feeding the Asgard, feeding the LCD-2.  The 25.2 has been tweaked a bit by me.  All connections treated with CAIG G5 and Pro Gold.  Interconnects are Outlaw UPOCC PCH 0.5m.  LCD-2 cable, cotton insulated & braided 2 x 156 strand per channel litz.
 

Thanks. Reminds me I've been meaning to get some IC treatment fluid for a while and possibly some Silclear.

Quote:

Originally Posted by epocs 

What's with all these headphone amp names these days? "Yesterday I had the greatest SEX... bottlehead experience with my cans." ; "Schiit man... that's really the stuff to compare against the Hat Peed Thingy."

 

Makes me appreciate names like Benchmark or Nuforce.

This is going in my sig.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sokolov91 

 

Shpongle and the LCD-2/Phoenix combo really are a match made in heaven. The textured work and crazy amount of layers really shine through very clearly.
 

I just watched Inception again, which was rather trippy with the detail of every noise and the fantastic soundtrack.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gogogasgas 

 

PS On the AMB audio site (where in the B22 is), it says to watch out for inferior Chinese clones of the B22. What amp are they referring to? Also, I can't see on the website if they offer a pre-made version of the B22 for we no-way-DIY-ers.

What they mean is there are some chinese pcbs that are clones of the schematic, only laid out worse than the original PCB I think.  I don't know what they would be advertised as, probably also a B22 since I suppose technically they are the same circuit.  I think he spent a lot of time on the layout of signal paths and whatnot.  I think I have seen one using almost all SMD devices instead of thru hole, which is interesting I suppose.  Perhaps it could fit into a smaller area but I couldn't really tell from the pictures that I saw.  This would not be an issue if you are paying one of their listed professional builders to make one, only if you acquired the PCBs yourself to make one from a source other than AMB.

AMB does not sell finished B22s but they do provide links to http://www.rockhopperaudio.com/ and http://www.ybmaudio.com/ if you want a professionally made B22, potentially to your own specifications.  It would probably be significantly more expensive than a phoenix for a balanced build though.

I belive the lyr stops being class A around 500mw (or so I was told), I'm not sure what the phoenix is biased to maintain class A operation to.  It's possible it covers its whole output range as 3W max is not that much.  However I have my doubts due to the fact that it doesn't look like anything is using the case as a heat sink, the heat sinks inside are not massive and there appears to be poor ventilation.  Also I can't see the purpose of people biasing it further into class A if it already covers the whole range that it can output.  I can't be certain about this you would probably be best off asking Kingwa if you care enough.

Originally Posted by nigeljames 

The Roc absolutely does not 'run out of puff' driving the LCD2's so I can not imagine the Phoenix having any problems.

Thanks, NJ. I forgot that Audio GD have a number of other models. Good to know that the Roc does well with the LCD-2s too.
 

Originally Posted by BebopMcJiggy 

I belive the lyr stops being class A around 500mw (or so I was told), I'm not sure what the phoenix is biased to maintain class A operation to.  It's possible it covers its whole output range as 3W max is not that much.  However I have my doubts due to the fact that it doesn't look like anything is using the case as a heat sink, the heat sinks inside are not massive and there appears to be poor ventilation.  Also I can't see the purpose of people biasing it further into class A if it already covers the whole range that it can output.  I can't be certain about this you would probably be best off asking Kingwa if you care enough.

I think that you are right about the B22 being less of a good deal if you pay someone else to build it, especially in comparison to the GD Audio offerings. Shame, by all reports, its a great headphone amp.

As for when the Phoenix would stop being Class A, I don't know. Might ask Kingwa.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Currawong 
snip

Quote:

Originally Posted by sokolov91 

 

Shpongle and the LCD-2/Phoenix combo really are a match made in heaven. The textured work and crazy amount of layers really shine through very clearly.
 

I just watched Inception again, which was rather trippy with the detail of every noise and the fantastic soundtrack.

Inception is one of the (very) few blu-rays I own and I was blown away too.

Why was the dude they were attempting to perform inception on still young when they found him on the balcony?!  This has always bothered me.  He died way before the asian guy :O

Quote:

Originally Posted by BebopMcJiggy 

Why was the dude they were attempting to perform inception on still young when they found him on the balcony?!  This has always bothered me.  He died way before the asian guy :O

If you see the movie detailing every part of the story there are many parts that seem incongruent, like the part you mentioned, but what can you expect from a movie about getting into someone's dreams. Perhaps you can find some info here.

I tried a Doge 6210 valve amp to see how if it could drive the Audeze lcd2.

It is a stock unit taken from storage, the tubes have been rolled for Siemens matched pairs.

It is basically an el84 output transformer coupled amp.

Signal coming from a Ref 1 dspv5 via Xindac FA gold rca interconnect.

Stock se cable to the Audeze. 

I was surprised how well it did compared to the Phoenix all balanced setup and Zeus 22g furutec balanced cable .

The sound was wide open with superb PRAT . Bass had slam and treble great.

The soundstage was wide and inner detail very clear.

Price wise it has no right to sound this good. It is easily as good as the Phoenix but without the black background. 

Set to 30 Ohm output I can dial up to 9 o'clock to get pretty loud enough. 

I am stumped as to why so good , maybe the Audeze is just that good, well I speculate. 

Low level clarity and punch make for effortless listening .

I think this one goes to the bedroom rig. 

I haven't heard of the 'Doge' before so I checked it out - click HERE.

Interesting. I like it has pre out.

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Originally Posted by Skylab 

That amp was super-popular in some circles several years ago around here. Unfortunately it had a super-aggressive poster who was constantly hyping it, but had some ties to the importer, IIRC. But that doesn't mean it isn't a good amp

Right you are Skylab, read and lived through that saga and nearly turned me away from Headfi . Still bought one to experiment though, and love it with the Beyer T1. The parent company makes reasonable stuff, I enjoyed your comments on the tube rolling for the doge 6 preamp and tried it , spot on. Somehow tubes died for me but this synergy sparks a thought. 

Maybe I should give tubes another chance but it is a TABOO subject in our 44 degree heat.

There is some talk about using this cheap amp as a platform to mod , change the 12ax7 and other bits and pieces . Still there is great tone and energy in the music despite being dirt cheap and getting past prejudice. 

Another Amp I tried for the hell of it is the BADA PH12 hybrid using Sylvania 6sn7 wgt / Sylvania 6sn7 gt X2  with the the Audeze.  More than enough power and unbearably loud at 9o'clock but no finesse, narrow soundstage and smudgy image. No comparison to the Doge re musicality and expansive stage.

Dont know how others feel but it seems to me that if you have a quality source and good recordings, getting great sound from the Audeze does not have to be too dear.

FYI - I have a Doge 6210SE (it was my 1st tube amp & I had it for a couple of years before I ever discovered HeadFi). I love it. I use it as a pre on my office/shop system & it is a beautiful match for both my HE5LE & the LCD-2. I prefer it with both to my maxxed Woo6 'cause it sounds just as good & has more features, more power & headroom + it is a preamp too. Very warm tone (a big plus to my ear) with the LCD-2 using my Marantz DV9500 as a source playing some SACDs the sound is about as good as it gets!  No rolled off lows or highs like I've noticed with some of my other tube amps. Once I get a balanced SAA cable for my LCD-2, I may find the Phoenix preferable, but right now when I want to relax & really enjoy a favorite CD, I go to the Doge.  Still I do a lot of my listening with my new DACmini, & it too is an excellent match with the LCD-2 & is my preferred ss amp now with all my harder to drive headphones. I find it sounds pretty tube-like too, but more like some high end hybrid amps I've heard.

One thing I really like about the Doge is that you can use it with both headphones & speakers at the same time if you choose.  Most of my other headphone amps cut out the speakers if a headphone is attached. I fined that very useful since I work on broken/damaged speakers & can use my headphones to help me compare speakers I'm working on.

I read some of the stuff that went on back in the day (after the fact) concerning the Bada & Doge amp recommendations & hope one bad apple won't keep someone from trying out what I've found to be a very nice sounding tube amp & one that will drive my 600 ohm Beyer 880 headphones nicely as well as both my Orthos. Given some of the low prices I've seen the Doge 6210 & 6210SE sell for on AudiogoN, they may be one of the best used buys I've seen recently.  2 big thumbs up!