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HifiMAN HE-6 Planar Magnetic Headphone - Page 471

post #7051 of 15369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Camper View Post

Early on in this thread, the foremembers had been recommending speaker amps for these headphones. Since Tyl's review, some new, powerful headphone amps have been introduced to squeeze the 6s. As has been mentioned, the 6s sound good on lessor gear, but not their optimum. Not even the vaunted Lyr in many estimation as seen by Schiit making more powerful amps to accomplish this goal but when that Lyr came out, it was the end all amp. But that's another story. Schiit owners sure are touchy.

I don't think there is any questions in most situations a speaker amp will yield better performance. I take no issue with that.

 

I'll take your the 6's sound good on lesser gear, but not their optimum. 

 

You could just easily say the LCD-2 reviews out there do that headphone an inustice. Why?

Because while, say, the Lyr sounds pretty good with LCD-2's, the ECBA sounds optimum.

 

So with that thinking a review written on the LCD-2's with the Lyr being the gear used would be an injustice. Which would be silly to me, anyways.


Edited by paradoxper - 10/28/12 at 9:16am
post #7052 of 15369
I was comparing it to the TH900 at the time, which also impressed. The HE-6 required considerably more gain from the Phonitor.
post #7053 of 15369

IMO you just need to know how loud you want to listen to it and parameters for HE6 how much power they need to be powered without limitation. Then ALL you need is amp quality and your personal taste. Every 5 dB more is very big step of power output needed to drive HP but I believe that at 110dB you dont need a lot of power many describe. You really listen at 120dB volumes?

Just give me any logical explanation why should I power these HP by 20, 30,50,  100 W/50Ohm.

post #7054 of 15369
para, why did you move the Lyr on and why did you try the 6s again? Was it because you found better performance with more power? If it was, won't you consider that logic beyond the realm of possibility that a speaker amp will attain another level of performance? The point of the speaker amp was the value to performance. Once delving into the speaker amp world, it opened a huge option for performance. It's been conceded that NOW, there are headphone amps that can get the level of performance once found only in speaker amps. But these new headphone amps haven't been used in reviews that carry as much weight as Tyl's earlier efforts. Honestly, I'd much rather spend less for as good or better than paying much more for as good or less. When the final analysis of the what is finally found to drive this particular headphone to it's optimum, you will find the headphone industry built a speaker amp to meet the level of performance. IMO
post #7055 of 15369
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxper View Post

Perhaps. 

 

I don't see the relevance there. The Lyr can drive ortho's which the HE-6 is, so.

 

I am not questioning whether or not a speaker amp would yield a different result. I am just wondering for a review what would be adequate

enough. ( this is where I threw the two Stax amps into the equation, the Stamp amp being lower aka the Lyr but adequate

and the speaker amp being the BHSE).

 

The HE-6 and HE-500 is a fair comparison in ideal situations. For example: Throw them both on, say, the Dark Star. 

 

The HE-6's sound good on a ton of headphone amps, which is contrary to what I seem to pickup most from this thread of recent.

 

I see you keep bringing up comparing between one another and fairness. 

i still don't understand, how it's not fair, exactly? 

 

Would you for example say both headphones on the Dark Star or EF-6 amp wouldn't be fair? Or is it only fair

when the HE-6 is compared when being driven by speaker taps?

 

 

No one ever said the Lyr can't drive the HE-6.  It can, but it's not a fair compassion if you want to get the best out the HE-6 while you may well be getting the best out the 500s on the Lyr.  I don't see how that difficult to understand.blink.gif

 

Would you want to race a fast person that's 100% with one of your legs injured and you're not at your full potential?  I wouldn't, I would want to be at 100% going into the race.

 

Stax amp and BHSE are both headphones amp = apples to apples.  Lyr is a headphone amp = apples  Speaker amps are well - speaker amps = oranges - again blink.gif

 

You must be reading the thread wrong.  Again the HE-6 can, do and will sound good on lots of headphone amps.  The point here is being able to compare the HE-6 with other headphones on the same setup and the Lyr is not up to snuff.

 

I have no idea how the HE-6 or the HE-500s sound on the DS or the EF-6 so it just might be fair.  Some one who heard both would be better at answering that.  

 

But this conversation is about Tyll comparing the HE-6 and the HE-500 on the Lyr. blink.gif

post #7056 of 15369

.

post #7057 of 15369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Camper View Post

para, why did you move the Lyr on and why did you try the 6s again? Was it because you found better performance with more power? If it was, won't you consider that logic beyond the realm of possibility that a speaker amp will attain another level of performance? The point of the speaker amp was the value to performance. Once delving into the speaker amp world, it opened a huge option for performance. It's been conceded that NOW, there are headphone amps that can get the level of performance once found only in speaker amps. But these new headphone amps haven't been used in reviews that carry as much weight as Tyl's earlier efforts. Honestly, I'd much rather spend less for as good or better than paying much more for as good or less. When the final analysis of the what is finally found to drive this particular headphone to it's optimum, you will find the headphone industry built a speaker amp to meet the level of performance. IMO

I intended to upgrade, for better performance, of course. As is likely always the case. 

 

You can argue apple to oranges, or w.e. You wouldn't call an SR-009 and Stax amp review an injustice, simply because higher levels of performance can

 be attained, would you? There are many factors to consider.

 

Speaker amps are flat out better than headphone amps with the HE-6. That doesn't make an HE-6 review done on a headphone amp

an injustice to the headphone. It is what it is. At least, IMHO.

 

 

That's a completely understandable argument. I would completely agree with this, if people did not already own headphone amps.

So I don't understand how it's completely meaningful.

 

For people who are interested in the HE-6, hell yea, buy a speaker amp over a headphone amp for it, if A. You don't already 

have a adequate headphone amp or B. The HE-6 will be your only headphone used.


Edited by paradoxper - 10/28/12 at 9:17am
post #7058 of 15369
Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

 

 

No one ever said the Lyr can't drive the HE-6.  It can, but it's not a fair compassion if you want to get the best out the HE-6 while you may well be getting the best out the 500s on the Lyr.  I don't see how that difficult to understand.blink.gif

 

Would you want to race a fast person that's 100% with one of your legs injured and you're not at your full potential?  I wouldn't, I would want to be at 100% going into the race.

 

Stax amp and BHSE are both headphones amp = apples to apples.  Lyr is a headphone amp = apples  Speaker amps are well - speaker amps = oranges - again blink.gif

 

You must be reading the thread wrong.  Again the HE-6 can, do and will sound good on lots of headphone amps.  The point here is being able to compare the HE-6 with other headphones on the same setup and the Lyr is not up to snuff.

 

I have no idea how the HE-6 or the HE-500s sound on the DS or the EF-6 so it just might be fair.  Some one who heard both would be better at answering that.  

 

But this conversation is about Tyll comparing the HE-6 and the HE-500 on the Lyr. blink.gif

I didn't mean that in the "Oh, you said Lyr can't drive HE-6" But more in the counter point about "A Stax amp and a BHSE amp:  Both are Stax amps and headphone amps" I ment, the Lyr was made for ortho's and the HE-6 is an ortho, so the Lyr can drive it"

Apple to apples, since you keep steady on the point of HE-6 on speaker taps.

 

How is it not up to snuff, exactly? Lyr meets requirements for HE-6. Period.

 

Now yea, in comparison of speaker taps, you're right, I agree.

 

But that's a general statement of speaker amps or bust.

post #7059 of 15369

My question remains what qualifies as adequate gear for an HE-6 review?

 

If the Dark Star, EF-6, and Lyr can all drive the HE-6, does a review of the HE-6 on either or all these amps

do the headphone injustice, simply because a speaker amp is better?


Edited by paradoxper - 10/28/12 at 9:09am
post #7060 of 15369
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxper View Post

How is it not up to snuff, exactly? Lyra meets requirements for HE-6. Period.

 

Now yea, in comparison of speaker taps, you're right, I agree.

 

But that's a general statement of speaker amps or bust.

 

Really - meets the requirement - Really??  

 

How many other headphone amps meets the requirements on paper?  Lots - right?  But how many of those meets the actual sonic requirements? - not many - including the Lyr.

 

It's not up to snuff because it's handicapping the HE-6 when it in comparisons - that's how.  Just like the race analogy.

 

You keep making these "Statements"  like speaker amps or bust.  I never heard this statement made before except from you.

post #7061 of 15369
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxper View Post

My question remains what qualifies as adequate gear for an HE-6 review?

 

If the Dark Star, EF-6, and Lyr can all drive the HE-6, does a review of the HE-6 on either or all these amps

do the headphone injustice, simply because a speaker amp is better?

 

Not review - COMPARISONS.  The point here is when in comparison.  Again we was not talking about the DS and the EF-6.  We were talking about the comparison done by Tyll on the Lyr.

 

If the DS and the EF-6 handicaps the HE-6 as the Lyr does then the answer is yes.

post #7062 of 15369

WTF is going on?  


Edited by sphinxvc - 10/28/12 at 9:13am
post #7063 of 15369
For a lot of us, we had speaker amps already because we were into speaker setups long before getting into headphones. When the 6 reviews were done by headphile, 6 moons, etc, it was known that speaker amps pushed the performance to a higher level. ASR also reviewed the 6s as less than a lot of other headphones on a headphone amp. To those wanting to know the cheapest way to get what others are were finding with these headphones, speaker amps still stands. For the numbers crowd, these reviews hold all the information to determine their view. So in this view, yes, the Lyr was not adequate and was a disservice to their numbers. The Dark Star and EF-6 weren't out yet. This is honestly a circular debate and there are so many other things to put energy into.
post #7064 of 15369
Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

 

Really - meets the requirement - Really??  

 

How many other headphone amps meets the requirements on paper?  Lots - right?  But how many of those meets the actual sonic requirements? - not many - including the Lyr.

 

It's not up to snuff because it's handicapping the HE-6 when it in comparisons - that's how.  Just like the race analogy.

 

You keep making these "Statements"  like speaker amps or bust.  I never heard this statement made before except from you.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

 

Not review - COMPARISONS.  The point here is when in comparison.  Again we was not talking about the DS and the EF-6.  We were talking about the comparison done by Tyll on the Lyr.

 

If the DS and the EF-6 handicaps the HE-6 as the Lyr does then the answer is yes.

All of this seems to be in comparison to speaker amps...

post #7065 of 15369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Camper View Post

For a lot of us, we had speaker amps already because we were into speaker setups long before getting into headphones. When the 6 reviews were done by headphile, 6 moons, etc, it was known that speaker amps pushed the performance to a higher level. ASR also reviewed the 6s as less than a lot of other headphones on a headphone amp. To those wanting to know the cheapest way to get what others are were finding with these headphones, speaker amps still stands. For the numbers crowd, these reviews hold all the information to determine their view. So in this view, yes, the Lyr was not adequate and was a disservice to their numbers. The Dark Star and EF-6 weren't out yet. This is honestly a circular debate and there are so many other things to put energy into.

So again this is all in comparison to speaker amps.

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