woo competition? - Page 5

So, is that mean all of us using balanced source and amp are simply idiotic on spending much more money.

Well when you actually look at amp manufacturers, all the larger established brands never come out with balanced headphone sockets.  Look at Audio Technica ATH-HA5000, PS Audio GCHA, Lehmann BCL, SPL Phonitor, Luxman P1, Leben 300x, etc, etc...  Headphone are also never designed with balanced drive in mind which is why you never can buy them terminated other than single ended.  I feel that the only manufacturers of balanced drive headphones are the smaller DIY market as well as the small amp manufacturers that cater to the Head-Fi crowd mostly.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by upstateguy 

I think it was very telling that the Luxman P1 didn't come out in balanced.

Yes that is what my findings are also. But in all fairness we both are basing are opinion when comparing the WA5 to a balanced amp. That said when I compared the RSA B-52, Ray's B-52 and his source player and bal HD-800 and then my source player and SE HD-800 to my WA6SE I did hear a small difference but I was comparing a $1050 amp to a $5300 amp. The difference in my case for what I want out of my audio was not worth all the expense that going with a balanced system would cost. And that is one of the main reasons why I went with the WA5LE. IMO the WA5LE is the best of both worlds for what I want.

Also what I found was when using a balanced system but using the SE phone jack in that system there was a bigger difference , so i came to the conclusion that if you go balanced go all the way.

ss
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by monsieurguzel 

I feel that amps that might be a little on the underpowered side would benefit from having balanced output, due to the increased current.  An amp like Woo Audio 5 has so much power on tap that I'm always stuck in the lower ranges of my volume control (9-10 o'clock).  I guess that this is due to using 300B tubes and being capable of driving large speakers also.

 

On my Stax 717 / 007 combo I actually did a test with simultaneously attaching RCA and Balanced to my Perfectwave DAC.  When switching back and forth (with mono switches) the only change I could detect was mainly an increase in volume, and not in other aspects of the sound.  I know balanced is technically better, but even on a very revealing headphone and DAC that I used, the differences where almost too insignificant to tell.

I found this last argument thread quite informative. 

If you dig deep enough, you will find that the SE version of an amp can in comparison, have slightly lower channel separation and higher distortion, but the differences are usually minute. A balanced output is definitely louder however and that probably accounts for most of the 'better' sound. Volume match the two and it may be harder to understand the differences. 

I've tried to illustrate that in my Einar VC-01i review.

Balanced is used to get rid of common line noise over long distances.

Back on topic.  When I had my CSP-2, I think it sounded better than my WA-6.  With the Pseudo dual power supply and Sophia Princess the WA-6 is close in price to the CSP-2.  I think the WA-6 is better built, but that could be because the case is aluminum on the WA-6.  When I get my CSP-2 back, I'll try to do a better comparison.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pyramid6 

Balanced is used to get rid of common line noise over long distances.

 

Back on topic.  When I had my CSP-2, I think it sounded better than my WA-6.  With the Pseudo dual power supply and Sophia Princess the WA-6 is close in price to the CSP-2.  I think the WA-6 is better built, but that could be because the case is aluminum on the WA-6.  When I get my CSP-2 back, I'll try to do a better comparison.

 

 

What happened to your CSP-2?

USG
 

Wayne Wanaanen at Bolder Cable is building 6SN7-based tube amp in the Singlepower Extreme chassis. The Bolder-rebuilt Extreme is an exceptionally enveloping amp that is totally addictive, better than the Extreme ever sounded, which in its heyday was regarded as a great sounding amp. (It is verboten to say that these days...but Skylab's reviews of amps a few years ago always suggested that the stock Extreme was hard to beat.) 

So Bolder is definitely a competitor to Woo if you are willing to buy a used Extreme, which can be done very cheaply, and ship it to Bolder Cable.  Patience is required but the end result is simply stunning. 

I am going to write a longer review of the rebuilt Extreme, comparing it to the DNA Sonett and the Blue Circle HPT.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sillysally 

Ya I would say over 2x the price. It seems that you are paying over $5000.00 for the BA and you still will need tubes.

 

Balancing Act:
 --Tube compliment: One 6SN7 and two Tesla 300B outputs or you may substitute
       KR-PX-4 tubes for an additional $600.

   --Output transformer option: Partial silver EI core add $200.

  Price $3500.00

Not even 2X the price with tubes and the optional transformer..

I got the KR-PX-4 tube option and the crazy expensive volume control and I am still under $5000.00, and the cool thing is I only need 1  6SN7 for the gain stage,,so the  $425.00 Tung-Sol tubes start to look like a bargain. $425. is way more do-able, than $850.00.. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by minimus 

Wayne Wanaanen at Bolder Cable is building 6SN7-based tube amp in the Singlepower Extreme chassis. The Bolder-rebuilt Extreme is an exceptionally enveloping amp that is totally addictive, better than the Extreme ever sounded, which in its heyday was regarded as a great sounding amp. (It is verboten to say that these days...but Skylab's reviews of amps a few years ago always suggested that the stock Extreme was hard to beat.) 

 

So Bolder is definitely a competitor to Woo if you are willing to buy a used Extreme, which can be done very cheaply, and ship it to Bolder Cable.  Patience is required but the end result is simply stunning. 

 

I am going to write a longer review of the rebuilt Extreme, comparing it to the DNA Sonett and the Blue Circle HPT.

That just does not make sense, The only thing that is even remotely usable is the case,, 2 pieces of sheet metal stamped with a break press some automotive paint 12 small screws. Stepped Attenuator (if you got an extreme with that option), Mine did have Black gate output caps. what else does Wayne use out of the old Extreme?? O yea yards of hardware store,,wire

I sent my amp to?,, well some one here who wrote the Singlepower amp..rebuild for safety book,, and he made my amp safe and it does sound better for sure but my Woo WA22 sounds better in every way..It's brand new built like a tank dead quiet and has got to be cheaper than rebuilding a Balanced Extreme which are very very rare,

PS, I love my Singlepower Balanced Extreme,,amp,  But it is just sitting here collecting dust since I got the Wa22. hint hint!!
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by markmaxx 

 

 

Balancing Act:
 --Tube compliment: One 6SN7 and two Tesla 300B outputs or you may substitute
       KR-PX-4 tubes for an additional $600.

   --Output transformer option: Partial silver EI core add $200.

  Price $3500.00

Not even 2X the price with tubes and the optional transformer..

 

I got the KR-PX-4 tube option and the crazy expensive volume control and I am still under $5000.00, and the cool thing is I only need 1  6SN7 for the gain stage,,so the  $425.00 Tung-Sol tubes start to look like a bargain. $425. is way more do-able, than $850.00.. 
 

Ok let me rephrase almost 2x. I was just going off of a post that someone was going to takeover someones BA that has not shipped yet.

And yes the Alps RK50 at about $500 is less than I paid.

btw, I think your high on the price for the Tung-Sol round plate. Unless I drove up the price buying two matched pairs and I am still breaking-in the first pair.

My Sound Quest SQ84-V2 is a big step up across the board from my Woo 6. 

Better sound, no buzzing transformer, two inputs, remote control, 15wpc integrated speaker outputs...like I said, a big step up.

http://www.questforsound.com/amps/amps_sq84-V2.htm