Do JH13 really rival/surpass the best full-size reference headphones available?

My experience is, that the JH13 are indeed very very good IEMs. But on the other side they are still IEMs. If I compare the performance to my big cans rig, they do not surpass my O2 MkI or SR-404 Ltd. (maybe they surpass the latter). The JH13 can not substitute my big cans.

This does not mean, that the JH13 are somewhat inferior to the big cans. Their presentation is just different (imaging, soundstage, tonality). And - this is an advantage and a disadvantage at the same time - custom IEMs isolate perfectly. This might be favorable in some situations, in others this might be a no go.

Let me add here: I'm very satisfied with my JH13.

yes

Mind elaborating?

cant wait for more such similar comparison for jh16..

I will also say that the JH13 properly driven is an eqaul to the big guns just different strengths/weaknesses but that would apply also in comparing the big guys. Driven from the Protector I certainly find that they are on par with my Ed8 driven from my RPX-100 but they certainly do not sound the same just differnt flavours of very very good. They also do not replace full size for me but they certainly could if I had to make the choice and they would be the one remaining if it came down to that as I also need something that is ultra portable.

I can't comment on the JH13 specifically, but I've found that I greatly prefer the in-your-head presentation of IEMs compared to the presentation of my full-sized headphones (HD580, K701). I know not all feel this way, but YMMV.

yes, i havent tried every hi end headphone out there, but i have tried both the hd800, he-5 and the Denon 7000's, and while i liked the denon's and he-5's more than the senns, neither i felt came close to the realism of the 13's.

It is a very personal, very unfair question; the JH13Pro are certainly top of the game in terms of smoothness, extension, and in some ways, detail. But it doesn't mean they are as good or better or worse than top tier headphones. It means simply that they bloody rock. And they do.

For me, I slightly prefer JH13 to HD800 in detail, speed and imagination, on other hand, hd800 have obviously bigger soundstage, in other aspects, they are on same level.

Yes, they are on the same level as the high end cans, better, no. I love both my 13's and my 800's. I'm not going to say that one is markedly better than the other. They both have so many great qualities and so few negative, you could not go wrong with either. With all of the glowing things written about the T1 and some of the other high end cans, you probably know where I am going with this.

It just depends on the flavor you are looking for. If you want a great all rounder and need to have sound isolation for you and others get the 13's. You will not be disappointed. If you want great sound with isolation, yet still want that full size can feel and sound, buy the 13's and something else.

In my world, I really need to have both. I don't think I'd be happy with only one.

The above sums it up IMHO. I use them all the time - portably. And, with a well matched system they deliver like nothing else. I'll still prefer my electrostatics at home but, even then, sometimes it's just easier to grab the portable rig and lie down than fire up a home rig. So, yes, I think they could be an only headphone/IEM choice if that was the situation.

I've also been pondering this issue for some time. I side-stepped and got the ESW10JPN recently, cuz they're so damn beautiful! And of course they sound wonderful. Now I've tried the JH13 demo which isn't the real thing but marginally close and when comparing them both - the JH13 is technically a lot better. But the ESW10JPN offers the big natural full-sized can sound that the JH13 simply can't offer since its an IEM. But from what I recall it is probably the 'biggest' (if there's such a word) sounding IEM I've ever heard. Probably due to the excellent stereo separation and imaging.

Some of you guys have compared them to cans costing a lot more - Stax Omega etc. - as being better than the JH13.

So would it be safe to say that comparing full-sized cans of a lower price with a moderately affordable dedicated home amp say under 500 (off the top off my head say the HD600/650 out of a Gilmore Lite / K701 out of a Heed Canamp etc), the JH13 without any amp beats them by a wide margin?

I prefered Jh13 directly from iphone to AKG K701 driven by rig around 1500$. It is quite different feeling, but Jh13 just wins in details, imagination and speed and that is what I'm looking for in music. Also, I feel that JH13 for me sounds more realistic.

IEMs could never beat decent open headphones.