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First PCB project, Bantam or Alien?

post #1 of 17
3/3/10 at 1:05am
Thread Starter 
Okay I have made several cables but when it comes to soldering to a PCB I have no experience. So since I am without a DAC I have decided to make one my first project. Since it will be my first I am wanting to keep it really cheap. I am going to do a kit as well, just to make it easier for me to buy. I am either going to do a Bantam DAC or Alien DAC. Which is better as far as audio. The Bantam is cheaper so that sounds better to me but if there is a difference in quality and ease to build, then I will go with the winner of that. Thanks.
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post #2 of 17
3/3/10 at 1:21am
I would go with the Bantam first. It's so cheap that even if you build it and for whatever reason don't like it, then just go ahead and build the Alien too. One thing to consider... these kits are very small and won't give you much soldering experience. Also, they have SMD components which is a bit different from through hole soldering. (I'm not very good at it myself.) I guess my only point is, be prepared to pick another project pronto as you may finish either of these projects in a matter of minutes.

One final thought... if you really want to practice PCB soldering (and maybe desoldering) you might look for a discarded piece of electronic equipment from a junkpile or good will or craigslist or something. then you can practice all you want and not worry about the cost or the result.
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post #3 of 17
3/3/10 at 3:06am
SMD soldering is a bad place to start. You'll only be frustrated. Start with something through-hole.
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post #4 of 17
3/3/10 at 3:17am
BantamDAC as parts and PCBs are easier to source. Of course the "true" start should be with a CMOY.
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post #5 of 17
3/3/10 at 5:30am
couldnt agree more. Either in my opinion are asking for trouble as a first project on pcb.
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post #6 of 17
3/3/10 at 5:47am
I agree with the comments about SMD. I've been soldering as a hobby for years and years and didn't do too well with the DAC chip on the Bantam when I tried
A nice through hole project is where you should start.
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post #7 of 17
3/3/10 at 6:03am
I built an Alien DAC during the PCB group buy. It is a huge improvment over the sound coming out of most motherboards. Worth doing once you know how to solder.


This absolutly is NOT a beginner DIY. The PCM2702 DAC chip is in a SSOP28 package. Lead spacing is .025"

Not a PCM2702, but this gives an idea of size:

SparkFun Electronics - 16 Channel Multiplexer

These can be done at home, but I find it difficult. SSOP is right at the limit of what I can do sucessfully. Magnifying glass, good soldering iron, flux paste, solder wick and a steady hand.
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post #8 of 17
3/3/10 at 9:17am
I agree with all that's been said about first projects and SMD - not a good combination.

As for Bantam vs Alien, it's essentially a choice about flexibility. The Alien offers more options because it's a bigger board - separate power supply, on/off switch pads, and option of being powered by an amp's supply with the BUF634. On the other hand, the Bantam is small enough to be built as a CableDAC and may have a better online support website (OK, that's self-serving, I know - but I put a lot of work into those movies. )

Both use capacitor-coupled outputs directly from the PCM2702 DAC chip, so you'd be hard-pressed to find any difference in sound as long as both were built with 3.3V and 4.75V regulation.
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post #9 of 17
3/3/10 at 9:18am
I would not go for the kit form of either - order parts directly from Mouser/Digikey/etc. The reason I say that is that you very likely will flip a resistor or capacitor across the room and not find it. You want to order extras of both types of parts as the kits come with exact counts.

The hardest part of soldering the SSOP28 chip is that it will want to move if you touch it. A small plastic elastic hairband across the board and then put the chip underneath it will help like a third hand. I've done this on the Bantam and most of the grubDACs I've built and it works very well on that size board.

You will need magnification to work under. I work under a ring magnifier light for soldering and then I have a 8x loupe for checking my work.
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post #10 of 17
3/3/10 at 9:10pm
Thread Starter 
Well I wanted to do the DAC over the CMOY as I have really no need for the CMOY and I could use a DAC. But I have read that SMD soldering can be horrifying to a beginner so I was going to have Glass Jar Audio do it for me. They offer it when you buy the kit. I will probably be building a Millet Minimax later I just wanted something like this for a starter.

I will most definitely be looking for some old hardware to practice on. But I would do a Y2 but I can't find a kit.

Is it still a good idea to do this or skip both? Or what? Thanks for all of the reply's.
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post #11 of 17
3/3/10 at 10:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by unl3a5h3d View Post
But I have read that SMD soldering can be horrifying to a beginner so I was going to have Glass Jar Audio do it for me.
Good move.

I don't think soldering that 2702 DAC chip is a good starting project. I'm really interested in building the y2 but those smd chips keep me away
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post #12 of 17
3/3/10 at 10:28pm
The BantamDAC was my very first build. I was so depressed when I couldn't get rid of those solder bridges. It's been over a year and I have yet to have a functional BantamDAC. I figured three hours poking the PCM2702 with a 25W iron wasn't too healthy for it, but I am about to purchase more parts for two Bantams and start populating that board. If my very first board works, I'll be so damn happy...
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post #13 of 17
3/4/10 at 12:16am
If you want to do the Alien DAC and get the DAC chip pre-soldered, then it shouldn't be so bad. The SMD caps and resistors can be fiddly (especially the resistors, and if you haven't much soldering experience), but they are doable.
It's good to make something that's useful, gives a good sense of satisfaction.
Good luck with whichever project you decide on.
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post #14 of 17
3/5/10 at 8:51pm
Can't believe it guys, my first Bantam works! that is, until one of the conductors (white) on the USB cable decided to snap. Hopefully this is the reason why my computer won't find my Bantam.

Oh man, working with that damn USB cable (for a cable DAC) is so frustrating... The green and white wire is 28 guage, and it was really hard trying to strip it. Any attempt to strip it would make it lose strands, and you absolutely must not lose any strands on those two wires! In the end I said to hell with the cable and took a lighter to it. Worked pretty well actually, but I fear that it might break again.

I advise the OP to keep things simple and get the USB connector and a premade USB cable.
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post #15 of 17
3/5/10 at 11:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinyFalcon View Post
Can't believe it guys, my first Bantam works! that is, until one of the conductors (white) on the USB cable decided to snap. Hopefully this is the reason why my computer won't find my Bantam.

Oh man, working with that damn USB cable (for a cable DAC) is so frustrating... The green and white wire is 28 guage, and it was really hard trying to strip it. Any attempt to strip it would make it lose strands, and you absolutely must not lose any strands on those two wires! In the end I said to hell with the cable and took a lighter to it. Worked pretty well actually, but I fear that it might break again.

I advise the OP to keep things simple and get the USB connector and a premade USB cable.
Sorry, but I don't understand this at all.

The pigtail USB cable sold at Mouser and Beezar are already stripped and tinned. I've done many and never, ever had to strip anything - just poked it in the holes and soldered. Nothing could be simpler or easier, IMHO. No work, no fuss - plug and chug.
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