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Isone Pro - the best thing you could ever get for your headphones on your computer - Page 54

post #796 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by theoctavist View Post

the isone setup guide is to the point, gets the job done. dont really understand what else one needs?

posting others settings? dont see the point.  we all have different head sizes/shapes/headphones.  even using others setup as a starting point. it makes no sense.


start with all values at zero and calibrate to your specific acoustics, cans, etc.



i use it in jriver.    wont use headphones without it now.


(unless it is a recording made for cans)
Maybe because it could possibly aid others who have no idea how it is suppose to sound or what sort of effect it was intended for, or if they're even doing proper adjustments. I didn't realize it was a crime to share and compare with another user's setting that could yield a 'that setting sounds better than my current' effect?

Your post is far more 'pointless' tbh.
post #797 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarKen23 View Post


Maybe because it could possibly aid others who have no idea how it is suppose to sound or what sort of effect it was intended for, or if they're even doing proper adjustments. I didn't realize it was a crime to share and compare with another user's setting that could yield a 'that setting sounds better than my current' effect?

Your post is far more 'pointless' tbh.

I agree that Isone is not easy to set up and takes a lot of experimenting with your own ears and your own equipment. There are a lot of controls and it can easily get confusing. I've read several posts about people trying to use an equalizer with Isone. I wonder if they even realize that Isone contains an equalizer with some presets included to emulate speaker response. You can easily modify those presets and go with a flat response or adjust it to your ears and your system until you get what you want. There is even a graphic display of the speaker response simulation. I wonder how many people using Isone get that? A lot has been written about flat frequency response but the truth is no speaker in the real world plays a flat response (it would probably be very boring). That's what makes the unique character of each speaker setup. Then there is always the room interaction to consider when using speakers. Isone does a fine job of letting you emulate that with simulated room acoustics (you can choose not to use that feature).

post #798 of 925

What's particularly difficult or perhaps tedious about setting up Isone is that there are so many variables.

 

Having a lot of variables has its advantages and disadvantages. The advantages are obvious but the disadvantages maybe less so. For instance you may set A to its optimum (for you) without knowing it because you've set B to something that counters the effects of A. So you go back to A thinking its the problem and set it to a less good value because it sounds better, but not great with B set the way it is. So you go on to C to make it all great. But, without changing back A you can't get to your optimum, but of course you can't know that.

 

So, in short, I think it's good to have folks post settings that work well for them. Hey, they might work well for others, and at least they give others the chance to see what kind of settings work for some. One might even be able to spot commonalities, if enough folks post their settings.

 

Besides reading other folks input, it takes patience and luck to set up Isone ideally (and its hard to know when you've reached "ideally"). Probably a good way (if you have the patience, which I'm pretty short on) is to save a bunch of groups of settings that sound pretty good and then try to refine them saving all refined versions along the way.

 

Chris

post #799 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisnee View Post
 

What's particularly difficult or perhaps tedious about setting up Isone is that there are so many variables.

 

Having a lot of variables has its advantages and disadvantages. The advantages are obvious but the disadvantages maybe less so. For instance you may set A to its optimum (for you) without knowing it because you've set B to something that counters the effects of A. So you go back to A thinking its the problem and set it to a less good value because it sounds better, but not great with B set the way it is. So you go on to C to make it all great. But, without changing back A you can't get to your optimum, but of course you can't know that.

 

So, in short, I think it's good to have folks post settings that work well for them. Hey, they might work well for others, and at least they give others the chance to see what kind of settings work for some. One might even be able to spot commonalities, if enough folks post their settings.

 

Besides reading other folks input, it takes patience and luck to set up Isone ideally (and its hard to know when you've reached "ideally"). Probably a good way (if you have the patience, which I'm pretty short on) is to save a bunch of groups of settings that sound pretty good and then try to refine them saving all refined versions along the way.

 

Chris

It depends on your objective with Isone. You can start with just crossfeed (there are 3 presets for this) and then when you get used to what that does you can add HRTF setting which are by far the most difficult to get right. Keep the room designer off at this stage. The objective of the HRTF settings is to get the sounds positioned correctly in the soundfield as it is projected in front of you. That is why they suggest looking at an area across the room (like two speakers) so that your brain can make sense of what you are hearing. They have presets for big head/large ears, large ears/small head, average Joe,  etc. and those are helpful as a starting point. The object is to be able to best pinpoint instruments or voices in the stage as to position and tone. You are trying to get optimum position without altering the tone. After you get that to a believable setting, you can move on to trying the room settings to add realistic room acoustics. Here is where it gets tricky. There are a second set of presets for frequency response but only by way of a few examples. I found that shaping the frequency response to my headphones and my front end really locked in the entire sound stage to something totally 3D with every voice and instrument hanging in space in front of me exactly as they should be (wonderfully layered as well). The entire thing is a process and it took me months of tweeking until I felt I had completely maximized Isone for my system and my head. The end results are stunning. I think some people who have knocked Isone never got the part about the shaping of the frequency response. If you miss that step you will never get the full benefit. Of course, all of this is still limited by the overall quality of your headphones and other equipment but you can sure maximize what you have with Isone.

post #800 of 925

I don't post in here often anymore, but really, you have to have a basic understanding of psychoacoustics to use this software.

That's the truth. Not to mention good test tracks for imaging.

 

I use a third party EQ with Isone because the third party EQ gives me more control.

I will happily state that a good number don't know basic psychoacoustics in here thus don't know what the hell they're doing settings wise.

Isone is a fantastic piece of software if you know how to use it properly.
 

What Isone does not fix is the soundstage depth of the headphones.

 

Doesn't matter really (due to different HRTF), but here are my settings:

 

 

No, it's not realistic because of zero early reflection (ER) and thus no need for diffusion but it's the ideal.

87.5% is a good starting point tbh and adjust from there. As you increase the distance, you must really increase the room size.

A great underrated test track for imaging is actually Westlife's 'I Don't Wanna Fight', particularly the melodied chorus.

The only issue I have with the diffusion setting is it doesn't tell you what frequencies it affects.

5.59 cm tweeter size that's what a lot of the top studio monitors tweeter sizes are.

 

I have beyerdynamic T70's EQ'ed to the diffuse field equalisation line (because beyerdynamic screwed up badly in it, see 4000Hz peak when it should be 5000Hz peak) + O2 amp + O2 DAC.

 

Do be aware of course of other things such as the positioning of the headphone on your head affecting the frequency response, particularly in the bass frequencies. See the Innerfidelity graphs for evidence of this.


Edited by chinesekiwi - 2/7/14 at 1:09pm
post #801 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinesekiwi View Post
 

I don't post in here often anymore, but really, you have to have a basic understanding of psychoacoustics to use this software.

That's the truth. Not to mention good test tracks for imaging.

 

I use a third party EQ with Isone because the third party EQ gives me more control.

I will happily state that a good number don't know basic psychoacoustics in here thus don't know what the hell they're doing settings wise.

Isone is a fantastic piece of software if you know how to use it properly.
 

What Isone does not fix is the soundstage depth of the headphones.

 

Doesn't matter really (due to different HRTF), but here are my settings:

 

 

No, it's not realistic because of zero early reflection (ER) and thus no need for diffusion but it's the ideal.

87.5% is a good starting point tbh and adjust from there. As you increase the distance, you must really increase the room size.

A great underrated test track for imaging is actually Westlife's 'I Don't Wanna Fight', particularly the melodied chorus.

The only issue I have with the diffusion setting is it doesn't tell you what frequencies it affects.

5.59 cm tweeter size that's what a lot of the top studio monitors tweeter sizes are.

 

I have beyerdynamic T70's EQ'ed to the diffuse field equalisation line (because beyerdynamic screwed up badly in it, see 4000Hz peak when it should be 5000Hz peak) + O2 amp + O2 DAC.

 

Do be aware of course of other things such as the positioning of the headphone on your head affecting the frequency response, particularly in the bass frequencies. See the Innerfidelity graphs for evidence of this.

You have the speaker level set at 0db, Isn't that causing Isone to clip? Their default setting is -8db and I usually have mine set at -5db or I will see Isone go into clipping on many recordings. At -5 it never clips. Just curious about your setting.

post #802 of 925

Can someone tell me if this pug in works with Aurdivana or amarra?

 

Thanks.

post #803 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chodi View Post
 

You have the speaker level set at 0db, Isn't that causing Isone to clip? Their default setting is -8db and I usually have mine set at -5db or I will see Isone go into clipping on many recordings. At -5 it never clips. Just curious about your setting.

 

I have -7.9 dB preamp in my Equalizer APO settings.


Edited by chinesekiwi - 2/15/14 at 12:41am
post #804 of 925

I use this plug-in with Aurdivana plus.  I must say- this plug-in is a game changer.  It is amazing how an out of head experience to this degree is possible with headphones.   I often find that headphones that stress soundstage do so at the cost of tonal balance.   Now- I can focus on the headphones that get the tone correct and I can create a feeling of real speakers in a room with this program.   It is extremely realistic.

 

This may be ametureish but I recommend trying the presets.  Once you find the preset you like best- make small adjustments here and there until you fine tune it.


Edited by rsbrsvp - 2/17/14 at 11:14am
post #805 of 925
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rsbrsvp View Post
 

This may be ametureish but I recommend trying the presets.  Once you find the preset you like best- make small adjustments here and there until you fine tune it.

I think it's perfectly fine to go through the presets, and if there's one that happens to match your physiology, then no need to spend the extra time tweaking. :) Another good thing about going through the presets, is you get acquainted to the range of possibilities the software is capable of, and like you said, once you home in on a preference, the minor additional tweaking you need to do would be fairly quick.

post #806 of 925

Is it suggested that I produce with this in addition to whatever I currently have?

post #807 of 925

Just a heads up for Isone fans. I finally found a vst eq that works with foobar and  with Isone and does not degrade the sound in any way.  In fact, I was able to easily make small adjustments that really improved things in my system. This also has a great user interface and its FREE. Be careful it was designed for professional mastering so there are settings that you may want to just ignore   ( unless you are a recording engineer). Here is the link to CS12M EQ:

 

http://www.terrywest.nl/equalizers.html

 

You will note he has other equalizers available but I did not try them. The CS12M just goes into your vst folder and then install it in foobar. Works like a champ. I have tried several other equalizers but never got satisfactory results. This one really works without degrading the sound in any way as far as I can tell.

post #808 of 925

Has anyone listened pink noise through TB Isone on/off ? 

 

It does change tonal balance significantly regardless of the near infinite setup options available, to my ears, through my setup(s). 

 

And I have concluded that this change in tonal balance or frequency response is independent of listening material. I' am not saying it shouldn't change freq resp, but it appears to be too much for me most of the time.

 

My recent best setup.

 

post #809 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by Priidik View Post
 

Has anyone listened pink noise through TB Isone on/off ? 

 

It does change tonal balance significantly regardless of the near infinite setup options available, to my ears, through my setup(s). 

 

And I have concluded that this change in tonal balance or frequency response is independent of listening material. I' am not saying it shouldn't change freq resp, but it appears to be too much for me most of the time.

 

My recent best setup.

 

Under Preset you have the choice of flat response. I have found that the CSC setting does change the tonal balance and not to my liking (so I do not use it). I use the eq vst plugin I listed just before your post to restore the tonal balance to a very natural sound for my system and headphones. I was using a different eq before with less desirable results. Adjusting the tweeter size below 1cm or above 3cm  would certainly cause unnatural results. I actually do not know how you got that setting at 0.010m? I have what I believe is the latest version of Isone and I cannot duplicate what I see as your tweeter setting. If you were to use the Room settings that also would certainly change the tonal balance (I see that you are not using that). Setting the distance beyond 1m will start to effect the tonal balance some. I find that up to 1m it has little to no effect on the overall tonal balance. Any dsp intended to simulate speakers (out of head experience) is going to add some flavor of it's own. You can easily use a separate eq to compensate for that. At least that has been my experience.

 

I should have mentioned that I also find I require different settings for different headphones. The HD800 is so holographic in itself that I only require minimal crossfeed setting to get great results. Using my T1's I use the HRTF control to dial in similar soundstage effect to what I get with my HD800 (3D soundstage). 


Edited by Chodi - 2/21/14 at 2:23am
post #810 of 925

I should have added that this setup i got is a result of scoping pink noise with freq-domain analyzer with Isone enabled and adjusting frequency curve to best fit original pink noise. (i know it doesn't say so in the manual :tongue:)

 

 

The linear result:

 

 

Manual's suggestion to me:

 

Same as above, but with CSC enabled:

 

Manual's suggested setup + CSC to me:

 

The EQ-band on ~2.4kHz  is the only way i could get rid of this ugly peak at this frequency while at the most linear setup i got. And CSC enabled seemed to be a must in this regard aswell.

 

I can't say that i hear these drop outs or peaks while listening to my high-end studio monitors in a well treated room, and  i don't mean dead room. (without any cross-feed ofcourse)

I think the frequency response get to much impact with Isone, whether or not is it related directly to phase alterations through out stereo material.

That is why i did this 'linearizing' with the freq analyzer. 

 

I did the tweaking without listening, at first. And listening confirmed that this was the best setup i had heared thus far. 

 

All this complaining is just over a tiny proportion of my music, for which i can turn of Isone. And everything else is just better by a mile.

 

*About the tweeter size: I figured that the smaller the radiator the more even spherical wavefront it would emit. I guess there can be more variables in it than that, but i couldn't hear any significant differences in changing it anyways.

 

Maybe my findings are useful to someone else aswell.

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