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DACMagic vs. Audio-GD DAC19 DSP1 - Page 2

post #16 of 207
2/18/10 at 10:23am
I think there was a lot of hyperbole over the Benchmark DAC 1 as well, especially before they improved the internal headphone amp, which was horrid. The natural reproduction of instruments you get from the PCM1704-based DAC is what made me consider a Ref 1 in the first place. Before Audio-gd was known here, to get that you had to get a vintage DAC like a Parasound or Assemblage or whatever.
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post #17 of 207
2/18/10 at 10:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Currawong View Post
I think there was a lot of hyperbole over the Benchmark DAC 1 as well, especially before they improved the internal headphone amp, which was horrid. The natural reproduction of instruments you get from the PCM1704-based DAC is what made me consider a Ref 1 in the first place. Before Audio-gd was known here, to get that you had to get a vintage DAC like a Parasound or Assemblage or whatever.
Parasound? Aren't you confusing it with the PCM63? (Apparently a very nice DA chip too, by the way.)
Plenty of 'vintage gear' to choose from there, why not just a Mark Levinson 30.6? (Incidentally, if someone manages to get a 30.6 and Ref1/7 side by side, please report on the results! )
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post #18 of 207
2/18/10 at 11:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drosera View Post
Parasound? Aren't you confusing it with the PCM63? (Apparently a very nice DA chip too, by the way.)
Plenty of 'vintage gear' to choose from there, why not just a Mark Levinson 30.6? (Incidentally, if someone manages to get a 30.6 and Ref1/7 side by side, please report on the results! )
I thought the PCM63 was an R2R DAC as well?

There's some ML gear sitting in the local Stax dealer's shop. I had it in mind to take the Ref 1 in and compare it to some of the Esoteric DACs actually.
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post #19 of 207
2/18/10 at 11:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Currawong View Post
I thought the PCM63 was an R2R DAC as well?

.
It is.




I heard the Levinson #36 and it was very similiar to my DAC 3SE. The Levinsons were HDCD so the better comparison would be a 30.6 to the DAC9.
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post #20 of 207
2/18/10 at 11:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Currawong View Post
I thought the PCM63 was an R2R DAC as well?
It is, but I thought you were saying that Parasound used the PCM1704.

Comparison with Esoteric would be very interesting. I assume they're using sigma-delta DA these days.
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post #21 of 207
2/18/10 at 3:08pm
I've compared DAC19Mk3 (predecessor of DAC19 DSP1) to Bel Canto DAC3 which is about 5x the price of DAC19Mk3. I ended up selling DAC3.

Though the matter isn't as black and white as it might sound. DAC3 did some things better and is a true high end DAC but for my setup I preferred DAC19Mk3. Anyway my point was that it CAN beat much more expensive DACs.
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post #22 of 207
2/18/10 at 7:39pm
Thread Starter 
Thanks for all the input guys.

I'm pretty much settled on the DAC19 DF version rather than the DSP1 version I originally planned on. I decided on this as people seem to be torn as to how much of a difference it really makes and whether it's worth the extra $150.
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post #23 of 207
2/18/10 at 7:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Necrolic View Post
Thanks for all the input guys.

I'm pretty much settled on the DAC19 DF version rather than the DSP1 version I originally planned on. I decided on this as people seem to be torn as to how much of a difference it really makes and whether it's worth the extra $150.
You might want to consider upgrading your transport also. M2Tech HiFace which I'm now using just destroyed ESI Juli@ and M-Audio Audiophile 192. I used to own both of those soundcards.
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post #24 of 207
2/18/10 at 8:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Necrolic View Post
I'm debating between these two DACs for the upgrades I'm planning in the near future. The DACMagic is ~$250 cheaper than the DSP1 version of the DAC19, but I've heard it performs much better than it's price would suggest (although I've heard the same in regards to the DAC19).
Having A-GD's DAC of higher rank than DAC-19 I can not give you a direct comparison with my DacMagic. But Bostonears and Vlach can. I can say that my A-GD DAC experience is very similar to Regals views. I expect that both DF and DSP versions of DAC-19 should outperform DacMagic.

Even though their price might be similar, the DACs we try to compare here are not even the same concept: on the one side we have a good and relatively cheap commercial product and on the other good and absolutely cheap audiophile product. Guess which is what.
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post #25 of 207
2/18/10 at 8:56pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patu View Post
You might want to consider upgrading your transport also. M2Tech HiFace which I'm now using just destroyed ESI Juli@ and M-Audio Audiophile 192. I used to own both of those soundcards.
I've actually considered picking the M2Tech up.

I know that the hiFace's drivers allow it to output in bit-perfect with Foobar2000 instead of using ASIO for bit-perfect. Is there any additional setup required to output bit-perfect from Foobar with it other than plugging it in and installing it's drivers, like there is for ASIO (where you have to install the proper Foobar plugin)?

If so could somebody put a link up or give instructions?

Also, where can it be bought from that will ship to Canada, as it seems to be hard to find.
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post #26 of 207
2/18/10 at 9:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Necrolic View Post
Is there any additional setup required to output bit-perfect from Foobar with it other than plugging it in and installing it's drivers, like there is for ASIO (where you have to install the proper Foobar plugin)?
Yes:
  1. Download and unpack Kernel Streaming plugin (XP) or WASAPI plugin (Vista, 7) into foobar's components directory.
  2. (Re)Start foobar and in preferences dialog (ctrl-P) go to Playback->Output and select KS:HIFACE or WASAPI:HIFACE as output device.
As for buying one: look for nearest distributor on M2Tech's homepage or order one directly.
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post #27 of 207
2/18/10 at 10:16pm
Is it just me reading those jitter measurements of the USB to SPDIF converters incorrectly or do all of them have really high jitter measurements (They all have jitters close to 1 nanosecond)?

In contrast, the Apple Airport Express which streams music over wifi is measured at 258 picosecond.

Now for reference, 1 nanosecond = 1000 picosecond. So that means the M2Tech HiFace (970 PS of jitters) has close to 4 times as much jitters as the Airport Express (258 PS of jitters).
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post #28 of 207
2/18/10 at 10:42pm
moonboy, i would assume that the measurements were done by different parties? im sure thats jsut methodology.

and to the op, i have the dac19, and am also planning on getting the hiface, once my tax return gets here
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post #29 of 207
2/19/10 at 12:17am

The problem with some on Head-fi...

Quote:
Originally Posted by shampoosuicide View Post
Do a search in the DAC-19MK3 thread. At least three members have compared both DACs, and IIRC all thought the DAC-19MK3 was much better.
...is that they often use other people's impressions instead of just listening. I have heard both and stand by my previous comments that for only a small (5 maybe 10% incremental improvement), I thought the DAC-19MK3 was not worth it.

I don't care about what others thought...it's my ears and my money. Have you heard them both? Maybe you should give them both a critical listen first?

Sorry, but sheeesh, more listening people and less reading.

I might down the road go with the PS Audio DAC instead, but really once you get to this type of league, there is no "much" better dac until you're in for thousands of dollars. Your money is almost always better spent on headphones and amps.

DACs are not supposed to really add anything, just reveal what the recording has. Cheap DACs don't reveal everything, and more $$$ DACs do.
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post #30 of 207
2/19/10 at 1:04am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacedonianHero View Post
...is that they often use other people's impressions instead of just listening. I have heard both and stand by my previous comments that for only a small (5 maybe 10% incremental improvement), I thought the DAC-19MK3 was not worth it.

I don't care about what others thought...it's my ears and my money. Have you heard them both? Maybe you should give them both a critical listen first?

Sorry, but sheeesh, more listening people and less reading.

I might down the road go with the PS Audio DAC instead, but really once you get to this type of league, there is no "much" better dac until you're in for thousands of dollars. Your money is almost always better spent on headphones and amps.

DACs are not supposed to really add anything, just reveal what the recording has. Cheap DACs don't reveal everything, and more $$$ DACs do.
Wait I'm confused, your previous post makes it sound like you're saying the PS Audio is only 5% better ("for $300 more not worth it"), yet this post is saying it's the DAC19MK3.

The DAC19 DF is only $80 more than the DACMagic if you get the non-DSP1 version, and it's supposedly better than the MK3, so 5-10% improvement seems reasonable at that price, and it's possibly more with the new version.
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