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Ditto!

Next up on my wish list, could you (eventually) do a comparison of all of the available replacement cords with the HD650?

I'm not jumping on the HD650 bandwagon until I can figure out which cable to upgrade with: Cardas, Equinox, Clou, Zu, or Moon? That's a lot to choose from!

Hmm... A return to full time Sennheiser seems almost inevitable...

They've already got me, with the PX250s, and now the HD650, from these initial impressions appears to improve what I despised so much with the HD600...

Damn, who said you could ever stop?

Thanks Jude!

It seems to me that I'm one of those with gear that isn't taking full advantage of the HD-600s (by a long shot)... I think they sound great with my gear, however (subjective opinion).

This also means that I probably won't be considering the HD-650 unless/until a major source + amp upgrade.... which for sure won't be happening this year, and possibly not next year either. I guess I stick with the HD580/600s, and be happy.

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Check out MY REVIEW:
http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/showt...threadid=48094

Thanks Jude! Maybe I'll get my hands on some cheap HD600s now...

I don't really think the price drop on the HD600 will be that big, even though a lot of people expect this to happen...

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I don't think the price of new HD600s will drop much, but as far as the used market goes -- if a bunch of people buy HD-650s, the Gear FS forum here (not to mention eBay) will be flooded with people selling their HD600s to help finance the 650s... supply will exceed demand and force down prices. Can't escape basic market economics.

Excellent review jude!

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Exactly fewtch, can't excape basic market forces, just keep in mind that there'll be as many sellers trying to dump their 600s and 580s to purchase 650s, as those who're willing to buy them, because they were waiting for the HD650 to come out.

Jude,

Awesome review! I'll audition those babies as soon as I can get my hands on them.

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I find the HD 580s sound superb and hear no hint of a 'veil', though I do perceive sounds to be somewhat 'distant' compared to the Philips SBC HP 800s almost certainly due to the much wider soundstage. Although my Rega Ear amp is considered very entry level in this online community, I feel that they drive the HD 580s really well. The Rega Ear's gain is really high and I'm sure I'd blow up my can's drivers if I raised the volume beyond 12 o'clock on the volume dial. Am I missing out on something? Would a more expensive amp like, say, the Sugden Headmaster, sound better just for being a better amp in its own right, or, would it also make my cans sound better for making them reach more of their 'potential'?

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Mastergill,

I've got the HD 580's and I can confirm the fact that these clamp my head like a vise real hard. However, I'm big headed and my cans are still relatively new (under 3 months), but the clamping force is becoming gradually lighter.

Jan,
I'm also anxiouly awaiting your comparative review. Thanks!

Cheers,
Alex Altorfer

Thanks for the update. Did Jan get back to anyone if any of his HD650's are for sale?

tom,

maybe Jan will throw a HD650 sale for Head-Fi'ers, as he has done in the past. those who are even remotely thinking of purchsing these have probably already contacted Jan and have put their names on a waiting list.

[size=xx-small] Quote:




[/size]Not to my ears. I don't have a rapid-fire way to switch them here, so determining which is louder with any certainty is difficult (suggesting that they're closer in efficiency than not).[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by jpelg Heh, heh...he said "kilohertzian".

[/size]And you know I made it up when Google doesn't find a single instance of that word anywhere in the 3,307,998,701 pages of the Web it has indexed (I just looked).

[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by Rameish ....Pity you didn't have the time to do a stock to stock cable comparison. In a sense that would have answered another question about the cable that comes with the HD-650 as it does look different to the stock HD-600 cable.

[/size]Yes, I didn't have the time for this, but will at some point. It is a different cable, though--thicker, and also with larger grips on the earpiece plugs.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by jpelg Is it really different than the one on the older HD600's? I wonder who will be the first to put the new stock cable on the old HD600's ?

[/size]I did do this, and it does fit on the HD-600. I confirmed this by listening only long enough to determine that the signal was passing through to the HD-600 from the HD-650's stock cable.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by Beagle ....Just wondering, can you tell us if there are any noticable physical changes that might make a difference in the way resonances are dealt with and account for the improvement in the sound? For example, the flat foam in between the pads, that covers the drivers, is it the same material, or softer or coarser? Any damping material added anywhere? The reason for asking is that I have substituted the foam pieces for some coarser, less dense material and it affects the sound greatly. Removes some of the midbass hump but pushes out the upper mid a bit....a bit more open sounding.

[/size]The foam covering over the driver, the grille in the back, and the earpads all look and feel identical to these eyes and hands, so I don't imagine the differences in sound stem from these components.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by Jan Meier ....Same comfort level (clamping force!) as HD600....

[/size]When new, my HD-600 clamped my head hard. I stretched both sets I own until they were comfortable on my head, and, voila, no more headphone-as-head-vise.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by Jan Meier ....Treble is very recessed....

[/size]Doing a direct A-B on the first day said to my ears that something about the treble on the 650 was toned down, less glaring. For the first couple of days, I had my first-generation Cardas Headphone Cable on the HD-650, and the current-version Cardas Headphone Cable on the HD-600. When I put the current-version Cardas on the HD-650, the treble opened up more, the HD-650 exhibiting greater sensitivity to the differences between the older and newer Cardas cable than the HD-600. To faciliate comparisons for the rest of the review period, I thereafter only used the newer Cardas Headphone Cable (of which I only have one), switching between the HD-600 and HD-650.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by Jan Meier ....Balance is not natural....

[/size]To me, the overall balance of the HD-650 is more natural than the HD-600. I know Jan and I have some very different sonic tastes (as do just about any two members 'round here), so I'm not surprised that we'd hear this one as differently as we do the Beyer DT-931.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by AdamZuf ....i think we can say that for almost every pair of good phones. it isn't new that the headphones put out what they are fed with....

[/size]I find the HD-600 to be pickier than most other headphones I've owned or used.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by AdamZuf ....but do you think that the basic sonic signature (in which each of us can see the potential, to his taste) really change that much, until it can be totaly unrecodnizble, when fed with the most hi-end gear?....

[/size]Absolutely. At a recent meet, we had a prototype Wadia CD player (one that I believe will be less expensive than the Wadia 861) feeding a HeadRoom BlockHead, which in turn was feeding the HD-600 via a balanced Cardas Headphone Cable. I don't believe there was one out of the 15 of us who wasn't floored by this setup. That was not the HD-600 most people have heard.

Also, the HD-600 and HD-650, with the newest Cardas Headphone Cable, plugged into an Antique Sound Lab Twin Head Mark II (with Sophia Electric mesh-plate 2A3 tubes), can do virtually no wrong. This setup is also absolutely world-class in the opinion of overwhelmingly most who've heard the setup (although most have not yet heard the HD-650 with the Twin Head yet). Again, absolutely not the HD-600 most people have heard.

Still, even in these setups, will everyone agree? Of course not. (But almost all I've played these setups for have agreed.)[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by AdamZuf ....i feel disappointment a bit, for the same size soundstage you mention.. you have a good rig to show differences. and if i understand, the stimulation factor ain't really different....

[/size]I'm not sure what you mean by "stimulation factor."[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by AdamZuf ....i see that Sennheiser didn't try to make a different story with the new model....

[/size]They created what is likely the best-selling audiophile headphone in the world. They must now create its successor. Should they have released something completely different? If you want something that tells a completely different story by Sennheiser, try the HD-590.

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Originally posted by AdamZuf ....but do you feel that there's a chance that people that didn't like the 600 can like the 650?

[/size]If one doesn't like the HD-600, there's a chance that he might like the HD-650. If one despises the HD-600, then he would almost certainly not find any morsel of sonic heaven in the HD-650.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by radrd ....could you (eventually) do a comparison of all of the available replacement cords with the HD650? ....Cardas, Equinox, Clou, Zu, or Moon?....

[/size]I've received this request via PM and e-mail several times now. In response, down the road a bit, I'll be using the Zu Cable Mobius and Moon Audio headphone cables with both the HD-600 (and later the HD-650), and will post another addendum to the headphone cable review I wrote almost two years ago, to keep it up-to-date.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by fewtch ....It seems to me that I'm one of those with gear that isn't taking full advantage of the HD-600s (by a long shot)....

[/size]Hey, man, read what you wrote next....[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by fewtch ....I think they sound great with my gear, however (subjective opinion)....

[/size]That's all that matters, fewtch. If it sounds great, it is great. You're the best reviewer for you, man. I'm just one guy telling you what I hear with ears that aren't yours. I'm sure you'll continue to explore other components (it's a way of life in this community), and maybe find things that make your whole setup perform better for you (tossing a few things back into the Gear For Sale/Trade Forum from time to time in the process

).[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by Alex Altorfer ....Although my Rega Ear amp is considered very entry level in this online community, I feel that they drive the HD 580s really well....

[/size]I haven't yet heard the Rega Ear, but would like to some day. I used to sell Rega turntables years ago, as a college kid working at a specialty hi-fi store, and felt their turntables were excellent values. If the Rega Ear is as good a value as their turntables, then you might very well have a fine little amp on your hands.[size=xx-small] Quote:

Originally posted by Alex Altorfer ....Am I missing out on something? Would a more expensive amp like, say, the Sugden Headmaster, sound better just for being a better amp in its own right, or, would it also make my cans sound better for making them reach more of their 'potential'?....

[/size]I haven't heard the Sugden, but maybe someone in the community who has heard both the Ear and the Headmaster will be able to offer you a detailed, more valuable opinion than I could.

Thanks, Jude! Great work! I appreciate the time it takes to write all that for us. I'm definitely looking forward to hearing the HD650 soon!

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I look forward to it. Thanks for replying!