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Just listened to some Fostex T50RPs today... WOW! - Page 686

post #10276 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by VinniS View Post

Hello head-fi community,

 

I am an absolute newbie when it comes to headphones and i hope i dont get linched for saying this. I am posting here hoping someone can help me and give me better recommendations. I have owned a pair of bose triport headphones for the past 7 years and been fairly happy with them. Unfortunately after long years of heavy duty use the materials have finally started to wear out and I had to replace cables and such to keep them going. So in hopes of getting a new pair of headphones I decided to buy the fostex t50rp headphones hoping i would get at least the same sound quality as my old bose and mod them to increase their performance. However after trying both of them (without any mods) i still prefer the bose over the fostexs by a large margin. How could this be?, Am i being trolled by my ears? do i need to wait till the drivers have "burned in" a bit to experience a better quality? I  want to mod the headphones using BMFs 8.1 guide but i am unsure if i should mod them or just return the headphones before i mes with them and get my money back. I am torn since i hear that these are supposed to be amazing cans after you mod them but i am unimpressed So my question is once you mod the t50rps will they sound (at least for me) just as good as the bose? also If someone has tried both these headphones please let me know whats your opinion comparing them.

 

Thank you for your help :)

 

Welcome to Head-Fi!

 

What is you like in the Bose and dislike in the Fostex?

 

Do you have a decent source and headphone amp? Without those, the T50RP will never sound good, no matter how much you mod them.

They are studio headphones after all.

post #10277 of 10599

Thank you for all the responses. Overall the bose had a bit more of overall "fullness" and "clarity" than the fostexs. the fostexs had a few more frequencies that i could hear but couldnt with the bose .Bose had better ear isolation than the fostexs but thats understandable since i can guess putting better earpads on the fostexs will make a big difference. These fostexs have low bass compared to the bose but they do sound "flatter" than the bose overall.

 

To add I do not have a headphone amp. I'm just straight up connecting them to my computer and testing and compering them. I was also looking into the audio technica m50s but i dont know how good those are and if you need an amp for these as well. What do you guys think?

 

thank you for your warm welcome .

post #10278 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by VinniS View Post

Hello head-fi community,

 

I am an absolute newbie when it comes to headphones and i hope i dont get linched for saying this. I am posting here hoping someone can help me and give me better recommendations. I have owned a pair of bose triport headphones for the past 7 years and been fairly happy with them. Unfortunately after long years of heavy duty use the materials have finally started to wear out and I had to replace cables and such to keep them going. So in hopes of getting a new pair of headphones I decided to buy the fostex t50rp headphones hoping i would get at least the same sound quality as my old bose and mod them to increase their performance. However after trying both of them (without any mods) i still prefer the bose over the fostexs by a large margin. How could this be?, Am i being trolled by my ears? do i need to wait till the drivers have "burned in" a bit to experience a better quality? I  want to mod the headphones using BMFs 8.1 guide but i am unsure if i should mod them or just return the headphones before i mes with them and get my money back. I am torn since i hear that these are supposed to be amazing cans after you mod them but i am unimpressed So my question is once you mod the t50rps will they sound (at least for me) just as good as the bose? also If someone has tried both these headphones please let me know whats your opinion comparing them.

 

Thank you for your help :)

 

My thoughts and suggestions, some of which others have already mentioned:

 

1. You're probably used to the (colored) sound of the Triports, so there will be some time needed to adjust. Even a modded T50RP will probably require some adjustment time and might not "wow" you at first.

2. The stock T50RP doesn't really sound that great. I've never found burn-in to make much of a difference on them either. Mods are more or less required if you want to get solid performance from the T50RP. I think their biggest weakness is the ear pads.

3. Try some reversible mods so that you might be able to return them or sell them for a small loss. I'd recommend starting with the 840 ear pads and placing 4-6 cotton balls in each cup (2-3 on each side of the cup...you'll understand if you mod it). Or maybe 2 very large cotton balls. Those two simple, reversible mods should make a dramatic difference and give you a good enough idea whether or not they're worth continuing to mod.

4. Make sure you have a good DAC and amp to power the T50RP. They really need good quality components behind them to reach their potential.

post #10279 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedraCorruption View Post

Anyone taken apart their drivers before? I have a set of T50RPs with no sound off the right driver, I have checked and double checked all the connections, down to using a battery to test the driver itself and I'm getting no sound. I'm thinking of taking one of the drivers apart to check if there is anything wrong inside but I'm not sure if I'll be able to get them all back together. Do the magnets move out of alignment or anything if you take them apart? I know that the magnets heavily repel once you unscrew them, but there shouldnt be any wires inside right? 

Assuming you took the cable out and applied the battery leads directly to the solder pads...  If so, it is probably that the pad has broken away from the trace and you can't see it.  The pads are easy to pull up, and it's pretty close to impossible to repair after that.  Check the resistance between the solder and it should be 45-55 ohms.  If it's really high/infinite the pad is broken.  


There's nothing inside that can break, but if you do try to open it you'll probably break most of the locking snaps.  Yup.  Been there, done that.

post #10280 of 10599

It is very difficult to remove the drivers without breaking the locking snaps, but it's possible. Still, there are three screws that hold the drivers down which should be sufficient. 

post #10281 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrspeakers View Post

Assuming you took the cable out and applied the battery leads directly to the solder pads...  If so, it is probably that the pad has broken away from the trace and you can't see it.  The pads are easy to pull up, and it's pretty close to impossible to repair after that.  Check the resistance between the solder and it should be 45-55 ohms.  If it's really high/infinite the pad is broken.  


There's nothing inside that can break, but if you do try to open it you'll probably break most of the locking snaps.  Yup.  Been there, done that.

 

Thanks for the info. 

 

This particular pair has actually been through quite a bit of abuse, so the pads were broken many moons ago in one of my early mods, but I quickly fixed that awhile back by soldering strait onto the traces.

 

 

 

I decided to crack open a the drivers earlier today and it looks like I found the culprit. For whatever reason one of the traces on the diaphragm itself had actually been broken, I have no idea how on earth this could have happened, but so it goes. 

 

 

 

 

After a bit of steady handed work, I managed to reconnect the traces with a soldering iron. 

 

 

I made absolutely sure that none of the other traces were touching the repaired one under a microscope. 

 

 

 

And we are back in business. 

 

 

 

For anyone thinking of attempting this. I would highly suggest just getting a new pair of headphones. The macro shots I took of the diaphragm are highly deceiving, the traces look big in the pictures but in reality this is what you're dealing with.

 

Literally hairs. 

 

post #10282 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedraCorruption View Post

Anyone taken apart their drivers before? I have a set of T50RPs with no sound off the right driver, I have checked and double checked all the connections, down to using a battery to test the driver itself and I'm getting no sound. I'm thinking of taking one of the drivers apart to check if there is anything wrong inside but I'm not sure if I'll be able to get them all back together. Do the magnets move out of alignment or anything if you take them apart? I know that the magnets heavily repel once you unscrew them, but there shouldnt be any wires inside right? 

Yep, and I don't recommend it. I learned a hard lesson, way back when. "Curious George" is to blame! I tried to prize apart the 2 side snap tabs with the head of a flathead screwdriver and ended up snapping them right off. On the second one, my screwdriver slipped under pressure and poked a hole through the diaphragm and traces. I hate when that happens. frown.gif  The magnets' polarity is opposed so there is a lot of magnetic force to contend with when you try to put the drivers back together, making it very challenging....Gulp...Good Luck.

 

When I transplanted new drivers into my KODA rebuild, I figured out how to remove the drivers from a brand new set of T50RPs without damaging the 2 side snap tabs on each baffle. Although not important for the transplant, salvaging the baffles with snap tabs in place allows you to use the baffles for other projects. First, remove the 3 screws that hold the driver to the Fostex baffle. The 2 snap tabs will hold the driver firmly attached to the baffle. If you gently twist and flex the baffle, the snap tabs will disengage without breaking off. This will allow you to put the drivers back together, as designed, with the 3 screws + the 2 snap tabs that will securely hold the drivers to the baffles for a perfect seal. I found that with the 3 screws, alone, the 3 screw sockets on the driver strip the threads with *minimal* screw torquing. My super glue method works wonders for re-tapping driver socket threads (and cup threads) that are Strong and hold up to 30 or 40 modding cycles. I had to make new threads in the 3 sockets because the KODA does not have side snap tabs. The super glue threads worked like a charm for a complete seal of the new, transplanted drivers to the KODA baffles.

 

In other news, I was informed by dBel84 that the solder joints on the drivers are made with regular tin + lead solder, not aluminum solder as stated elsewhere within this thread. I have re-soldered several driver wires to the T50RP series drivers with no trouble at all. I use Kester eutectic solder, a little flux applied with a tooth pick, tape down the wire on either side of the solder tab, set my iron to 500 degrees F, and pre-tin the iron. The pre-tinned iron and less than 2 seconds In-and-Out gets the job done without having to add more solder. More heating time than that? You risk burning through the diaphragm solder joints and film.

 

Hope this helps.

post #10283 of 10599

Mr speakers put a square of felt

 

haft the size of the driver

positioned on the back of the driver.. 

 

Anybody could point me to the reason of this mod? 

 

Also.. why everybody is saying the magni is a good match for the t50rp.. 

 

I just have it while the sound is neutral and okay, I think it's missing some juice in the lower volume and miss some clarity..

 

for example, if i lower the volume of my soundcard and put the volume to mostly max.. the t50rp start to be clearer and alive..

 

maybe if i bypass the volume control and use a passive volume stepped volume before??

 

anyway.. 

 

The koss esp-950 is similar.. need lots of e90 amp juice to become alive.. 

 

Wish i could compare to good amps at the moment like magni/mrspeakers and ESP-950 e90 vs both headphone but with best woo audio amps?? anybody did the comparison?

 

I guess isodynamics, electrostatics, planar all those need strong amp and good volume control (preamp or passive on input with good range)

 

am I wrong?

 

maybe it would be nice to be able to have a switch for 30ohm/80ohm/250ohm/600ohm so that most headphone are covered and keep volume range is adequate for precise adjustment.

 

Since bitdepth is lost from most soundcard and most 700$ dac volume control

 

if one use a passive volume before the amp too then would be nice to have a switch that bypass headphone amp volume control directly .. 


Edited by Audiolic - 7/10/13 at 4:05pm
post #10284 of 10599

WOW! I am impressed by your steady hands, eagle eyes, and soldering skill! That's great!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedraCorruption View Post

 

Thanks for the info. 

 

This particular pair has actually been through quite a bit of abuse, so the pads were broken many moons ago in one of my early mods, but I quickly fixed that awhile back by soldering strait onto the traces.

 

 

 

 

I decided to crack open a the drivers earlier today and it looks like I found the culprit. For whatever reason one of the traces on the diaphragm itself had actually been broken, I have no idea how on earth this could have happened, but so it goes. 

 

 

 

 

After a bit of steady handed work, I managed to reconnect the traces with a soldering iron. 

 

 

I made absolutely sure that none of the other traces were touching the repaired one under a microscope. 

 

 

 

And we are back in business. 

 

 

 

For anyone thinking of attempting this. I would highly suggest just getting a new pair of headphones. The macro shots I took of the diaphragm are highly deceiving, the traces look big in the pictures but in reality this is what you're dealing with.

 

Literally hairs. 

 

post #10285 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluemonkeyflyer View Post

WOW! I am impressed by your steady hands, eagle eyes, and soldering skill! That's great!

 

 

I'm amazed he didn't melt the diaphragm material. For something that delicate, I'd just shell out the bucks for a silver tracer pen. 


Edited by Armaegis - 7/10/13 at 4:09pm
post #10286 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by Armaegis View Post

 

I'm amazed he didn't melt the diaphragm material. For something that delicate, I'd just shell out the bucks for a silver tracer pen. 

 

I knew a tracer pen was definitely out of the question as soon as I saw the hairline traces even a super fine pen would be unusable. I have bottle of copper tracer paint used to repair this kind of stuff. I tried it a few times and had to wipe it off cause I could not keep it off the other traces when I tried applying it.

post #10287 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedraCorruption View Post

 

Thanks for the info. 

 

This particular pair has actually been through quite a bit of abuse, so the pads were broken many moons ago in one of my early mods, but I quickly fixed that awhile back by soldering strait onto the traces.

 

 

 

 

I made absolutely sure that none of the other traces were touching the repaired one under a microscope. 

 

 

Well, now I know where to send dead drivers.  I must drink too much caffeine.

 

Well done!

post #10288 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedraCorruption View Post

 

I knew a tracer pen was definitely out of the question as soon as I saw the hairline traces even a super fine pen would be unusable. I have bottle of copper tracer paint used to repair this kind of stuff. I tried it a few times and had to wipe it off cause I could not keep it off the other traces when I tried applying it.


Another completely heat free method to fix this sort of thing without risk to the diaphragm is Silver Conductive Epoxy ( I use MG Chemicals one ). It has the same effect as solder. If you mix a bit up and draw a small thin strand off carefully then precisely dab it to the trace it should work ( or use a pin tip or something very tiny under a microscope ) Have to get it right the first time though so sliding a small pin-tip's worth a few times would be best.

And one thing also the epoxy does not have to be thick to do the trick

I know for sure it works well and it even states the application for circuit trace repair i think. I  fixed a set of very rare drivers that otherwise would have to been thrown out, as well as dealt with that horrible aluminum solder issue using this stuff also. Sticks to aluminum also of course (also repaired some aluminum stators' wire attachment points in a near unobtainium electret).

 

It costs a bit at first maybe ~$45 or so but very excellent to have on hand

 

thought I would at least throw this out there as a safer option

 

 

it's sure a great feeling to get issues like this fixed. especially DIY beerchug.gif

Boy that took some skill using solder. Nice work.


Edited by nick n - 7/10/13 at 6:20pm
post #10289 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedraCorruption View Post

 

I knew a tracer pen was definitely out of the question as soon as I saw the hairline traces even a super fine pen would be unusable. I have bottle of copper tracer paint used to repair this kind of stuff. I tried it a few times and had to wipe it off cause I could not keep it off the other traces when I tried applying it.

 

So the pen tips weren't fine enough, but a soldering iron was? blink.gif

 

...and seriously, how did the film not melt under that heat? Did you have a metal pad underneath it or something?

post #10290 of 10599
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick n View Post


Another completely heat free method to fix this sort of thing without risk to the diaphragm is Silver Conductive Epoxy ( I use MG Chemicals one ). It has the same effect as solder. If you mix a bit up and draw a small thin strand off carefully then precisely dab it to the trace it should work ( or use a pin tip or something very tiny under a microscope ) Have to get it right the first time though so sliding a small pin-tip's worth a few times would be best.

And one thing also the epoxy does not have to be thick to do the trick

I know for sure it works well and it even states the application for circuit trace repair i think. I  fixed a set of very rare drivers that otherwise would have to been thrown out, as well as dealt with that horrible aluminum solder issue using this stuff also. Sticks to aluminum also of course (also repaired some aluminum stators' wire attachment points in a near unobtainium electret).

 

It costs a bit at first maybe ~$45 or so but very excellent to have on hand

 

thought I would at least throw this out there as a safer option

 

 

it's sure a great feeling to get issues like this fixed. especially DIY beerchug.gif

Boy that took some skill using solder. Nice work.

 

Hey thanks for the tip. I never heard of this stuff before but I'll be sure to add it to the shopping list. 

 

I can see how something like this would work very well for regular traces, but one problem I can see with doing something like this on a pair of orthos is when the music has big bass punch, the drivers may flex. I'm not sure how this particular epoxy acts under strain, but typically glue does not fair well when stressed. Especially repeated vibrational stress over prolonged periods day after day. 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Armaegis View Post

 

So the pen tips weren't fine enough, but a soldering iron was? blink.gif

 

...and seriously, how did the film not melt under that heat? Did you have a metal pad underneath it or something?

 

Well all the conductive pens I have seen are either ballpoint or just a tube that squirts out conductive ink like this:

 

 

The soldering tip I used looks like this:

 

 

 

 

I never even considered the diaphragm as something that would melt. Is that a common problem other people are having? I just went ahead and did it on a wooden desk, nothing behind the driver. 


Edited by PhaedraCorruption - 7/10/13 at 6:35pm
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