or Connect
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Dedicated Source Components › USB to SPDIF converters shoot-out : EMU 0404 USB vs. Musiland Monitor 01 USD vs. Teralink-x vs. M2Tech hiFace
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

USB to SPDIF converters shoot-out : EMU 0404 USB vs. Musiland Monitor 01 USD vs. Teralink-x vs. M2Tech hiFace - Page 100  

post #1486 of 1712
Quote:

Originally Posted by slim.a View Post

 

this usb cable vs. digital cable is something they didn't think through enough and they didn't experiment with enough


Also, as regal pointed out, a company like m2tech is a small one and doesn't have the luxury to test every possibility. 

 

With all due respect, Slim, "usb cable vs. digital cable" does not take months to test. It only takes 30 minutes. In my opinion, if they had not done this test or had not given any thought to it, there is no excuse for it.

 

Sometimes it saddens me to think that we, as users of audiophile goods, are more meticulous about how to achieve the best sound quality than the makers of the same audiophile goods.
 

post #1487 of 1712
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ironmine View Post

 

With all due respect, Slim, "usb cable vs. digital cable" does not take months to test. It only takes 30 minutes. In my opinion, if they had not done this test or had not given any thought to it, there is no excuse for it.

 

Sometimes it saddens me to think that we, as users of audiophile goods, are more meticulous about how to achieve the best sound quality than the makers of the same audiophile goods.
 


Personally, it takes me more than 30 minutes to reliably evaluate equipment. I try to not jump too quickly into definitive conclusions because it takes a while sometimes to understand what has been added or what has been missing.

But you are right, it is a big miss if they didn't try it. I also think that audiophiles are far more meticulous about how to improve the sound than most of the makers of those goods. I think it is what separates good companies from great companies. Good companies rely either on good engineering or on careful listening. Great companies rely on both good engineering and careful listening.

 

When you think about what jkeny did to the stock hiface, you realize that it is not complicated to improve an already "good" product. What it took him, I guess, is a lot of listening time and a lot of trial and error.


Edited by slim.a - 6/10/10 at 11:11pm
post #1488 of 1712

I just got my hiface which I'm using on my macbook pro with osx leopard, I installed the latest driver from mtechs website.

 

When I go to the audio midi set-up it the only option I get is for 32 bits is that normal?  I found that I like 44.1khz the best but there is a big lag like in the audio of like 1-2seconds when Im watching any videos, the lag decreases if I move it up to 192khz but its still noticeable. Is this normal?

post #1489 of 1712

You mean audio is always behind the video, but doesn't skip around or halt? I notice that too with some software in windows with my sound cards, never found a way to fix it.

 

Imagine a hiface that could plug directly into the usb port or directly into the rca/bnc of a dac, it is liable to cause damage on the connector if too heavy or if someone accidentally hits it. You could use some sort of support underneath it, something like a screw that is directly underneath the hiface that can move horizontally in and out a few millimeters to press against the usb port or dac chassis and prevent the hiface from pulling down on the usb port or bnc/rca connector due to gravity or accidentally hitting it.. Not very clean fix, and would force people to either get a long usb cable or a long digital cable, but if they want to minimize a cable, this is one way. I also doubt it is that important so long as the usb and digital cables are of good quality.

post #1490 of 1712
Quote:
Originally Posted by ironmine View Post

 

Aren't asynchronous USB-SPDIF converters supposed to be immune to the quality of USB cables? How can an USB cable be the "worst link of the chain" compared to a digital cable?  My mind refuses to understand it.  If what Marco says is true, then it contradicts to the design concept of Halide Design S/PDIF Bridge (www.halidedesign.com/bridge/).


Hi ironmne

 

I dont' know.  Your guess is as good as mine. 

 

I asked him if he tried both variations, RCA female-USB male and RCA male and USB female, to see which sounded best. That's what he wrote back, so apparently after they tried the two combinations, they decided on the current configuration.  But Marco is pretty responsive, so why don't you write to him and ask that question. Maybe you will get a different or better answer.

 

USG

post #1491 of 1712
Quote:
Originally Posted by slim.a View Post

That is what they aimed for. It doesn't mean they spent hours in critical listening in order to see which was the better.
 

 


Come on, don't you think the HiFace is the product of someone who had a pretty good idea of what they were doing?  Of course they listened to it.... and compared it to competing devices.....
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ironmine View Post

With all due respect, Slim, "usb cable vs. digital cable" does not take months to test. It only takes 30 minutes. In my opinion, if they had not done this test or had not given any thought to it, there is no excuse for it.

 


Or less.  If it takes significant time to hear the differences, they are probably so subtle that they can be considered marginal,perhaps less than the 5V upgrade on jkeny's mod.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by haloxt View Post

You mean audio is always behind the video, but doesn't skip around or halt? I notice that too with some software in windows with my sound cards, never found a way to fix it.

 


The "Reclock" the leeperry was talking about is supposed to address that. 

 

Also IIRC there's a setting, called "Audio time shift", on MPC that can adjusts it?

 

USG


Edited by upstateguy - 6/11/10 at 10:44am
post #1492 of 1712

 

Quote:
You mean audio is always behind the video, but doesn't skip around or halt? I notice that too with some software in windows with my sound cards, never found a way to fix it.

 Yes, no it doesnt skip or halt.

 

 

Quote:


The "Reclock" the leeperry was talking about is supposed to address that. 

 

Also IIRC there's a setting, called "Audio time shift", on MPC that can adjusts it?

 

USG

 

How do I do this on a mac? Ive contacted m2ttech on this issue but they havn't responded

 

This is really annoying because like 75% of my listening is   from youtube and movies.

 

 

Also does anyone know why I only get 32bits I thought this device could only do up to 24bits maybe this has something to do with the lag.

post #1493 of 1712

I just learned that M2TECH will release a new USB-SPDIF converter soon:

Evo USB to SPDIF Interface

feframedot.gif
A step up from the hiFace, the Evo boasts a more flexible feature set, as well as improved performance. Available in July/August 2010.

The hiFace Evo is compliant with S/PDIF and AES/EBU specifications for channel status bits. Sampling frequencies and other information are encoded. The hiFace Evo automatically recognizes the presence of a clock on the master clock input and switches to that signal whenever available. AES/EBU channel status settings can be chosen between consumer and professional by a jumper on the PCB.

t.gif
Our Price :
$365.00

1.jpg

 

2.jpg

 

3.jpg

 

www.tweekgeek.com/_e/Portable_Computer_Audio/product/Evo/Evo_USB_to_SPDIF_Interface.htm

post #1494 of 1712

I imagine the masterclock input is a wordclock?

post #1495 of 1712
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kawai_man View Post

I just got my hiface which I'm using on my macbook pro with osx leopard, I installed the latest driver from mtechs website.

 

When I go to the audio midi set-up it the only option I get is for 32 bits is that normal?  I found that I like 44.1khz the best but there is a big lag like in the audio of like 1-2seconds when Im watching any videos, the lag decreases if I move it up to 192khz but its still noticeable. Is this normal?

 

Does locking it in to 48khz make any difference? I thought that was what multi-channel a/v processing was set at as a standard.
 

post #1496 of 1712

Heres what hface said about why it only show 32bits and why theres a lag

 

yes, hiFace only works with 32 bits samples. When 24 or 16 bits files are played, the driver performs the bit stuffing with trailing zeroes to reach the 32bit depth.

the delay is inherent and it's due to the size of the buffer hiFace uses to operate. Maybe your A/V player has a setting to fix this problem, please check.

 



This is dissapointing because 75% of my listening is youtube and movies but I guess for movies its not really a big issue because you can set the video to have a delay too, though i dont know if it works for DVD's

 

 

When i change it 48 to the lag decreases only slightly it becomes less at 96 and 192 but its still noticeable, I like the sound best when it's at 44.1 with my dac's though


Edited by Kawai_man - 6/13/10 at 1:03am
post #1497 of 1712

I received my RCA/RCA male adapter made by Real Cable 141_photo_3.jpg

 

 

and tried it quickly compared to the Oyaide DR-510. I need more testing and also test with the modded HiFace as soon as I receive it from jkeny but I found the highs to be more present, thus more sibilance on the T1 on some highs, low level details to be a bit better and soundstage to be a bit bigger. But I listened and compared only for half an hour on a few songs so I need more testing, especially with the modded HiFace which may reveal changes better.

 

I ordered a USB extension cable, the shortest I could use (0.7m for me so I went with 1m), as the shortest path the supposedly better SQ, plus no need for too long cables if I don't need it.

I couldn't find any shorter than 1.8m in above crap to good quality cables, so I went with a Lindy USB extension cable, I emailed the manufacturer tech guys for the all the specs for this cable to know better what was inside.

 

"The cable is made of 4 conductors :

2x 24 AWG for + and -

2x 28 AWG for signal Data+ and Data-

cable is 4.4mm external gauge (1.73")

 

double shielding : 

Aluminium-mylar with metal strip + weaving recovering at 50%

PVC dielectric and copper conductor."

 

I'll try the new full setup asap.


Edited by Pacha - 6/14/10 at 5:30am
post #1498 of 1712


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacha View Post

I received my RCA/RCA male adapter made by Real Cable 

 

 

and tried it quickly compared to the Oyaide DR-510. I need more testing and also test with the modded HiFace as soon as I receive it from jkeny but I found the highs to be more present, thus more sibilance on the T1 on some highs, low level details to be a bit better and soundstage to be a bit bigger. But I listened and compared only for half an hour on a few songs so I need more testing, especially with the modded HiFace which may reveal changes better.


 

I'll try the new full setup asap.

This is some good news. I hope i can get similar results with BNC male to male adapters.

BTW, is that the best adapter you could get? I wonder if the build quality can affect the sound significantly.

 

Also I received an email from Macro at M2Tech commenting on the USB vs. S/PDIF cable effect on SQ and this is what he had to say:

 

Quote from Marco at M2Tech:

Anyway, USB cables are not detrimental as far as they're really short. Otherwise, high-speed operation ca be impaired. We think a good digital cable is to be preferred.

Edited by punk_guy182 - 6/14/10 at 12:03pm
post #1499 of 1712

The only good quality looking adapter I could find for RCA was the one I got. If you know any other btw I'm open to give a look at it.

 

I think the 1m USB extension along with modded HiFace and adapter may be nice and I could get rid of the Oyaide (I won't need it as a matter of filling the distance with it or other interconnects anyway).

post #1500 of 1712

I don't know any other.

The only BNC male to BNC male adapter that I could find was on ebay. They are certified for CCTV cameras but I'm not sure their build quality are very good. In fact I'm not even sure if it is worth looking for some ultra high end adapter. Can it improve SQ significantly?

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Dedicated Source Components
This thread is locked  
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Dedicated Source Components › USB to SPDIF converters shoot-out : EMU 0404 USB vs. Musiland Monitor 01 USD vs. Teralink-x vs. M2Tech hiFace