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post #736 of 1052
9/20/12 at 1:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by basketball View Post

The 458 is nicer than the mp4

In what way may I ask? Looks? That's all personal preferance and I respect that. But technologically, I believe the 458 is behind what the MP4-12C is capable of. For instance, the 12C hits 0-60 faster than the 458, produces more G's than the 458, has a crazy high-tech suspension setup, has one of the most capable driver aids on the planet, has more stopping power, and has both more HP and torque at their max peaks. It's foolish to compare the two because they might be similar in terms in numbers, but it's always up to the driver that determines which feels better. I am in no position to say which car feels better, but recorded numbers are facts (even though it varies by source). Personally, I'll take the Mclaren. I'm into super high-tech computerized gizmos, and maybe that's why I would rather have a Mitsubishi Evolution over a Subaru STi. But speaking of which, both the Ferrari and McLaren are astonishing cars. I always loved Ferraris (still do), but the MP4-12C is something that I would rather have than a Ferrari. In white, it looks absolutely stunning.
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post #737 of 1052
9/20/12 at 2:09pm
Why the 458 is the "better" car.

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post #738 of 1052
9/20/12 at 4:11pm

Yes if you mean prettier.  Also more fun and engaging.  The MP4 is more capable and technically competent however and rides better than a Rolls or Bentley.

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post #739 of 1052
9/20/12 at 4:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by planx View Post

In what way may I ask? Looks? That's all personal preferance and I respect that. But technologically, I believe the 458 is behind what the MP4-12C is capable of. For instance, the 12C hits 0-60 faster than the 458, produces more G's than the 458, has a crazy high-tech suspension setup, has one of the most capable driver aids on the planet, has more stopping power, and has both more HP and torque at their max peaks. It's foolish to compare the two because they might be similar in terms in numbers, but it's always up to the driver that determines which feels better. I am in no position to say which car feels better, but recorded numbers are facts (even though it varies by source). Personally, I'll take the Mclaren. I'm into super high-tech computerized gizmos, and maybe that's why I would rather have a Mitsubishi Evolution over a Subaru STi. But speaking of which, both the Ferrari and McLaren are astonishing cars. I always loved Ferraris (still do), but the MP4-12C is something that I would rather have than a Ferrari. In white, it looks absolutely stunning.

All the major magazines had tests. The 458 vs mp4. And the 458 won every time I believe.
And technology is not everything. I am a Ferrari guy and most their cars are my favorite cars
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post #740 of 1052
9/20/12 at 4:22pm
Ferrari guy biggrin.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by basketball View Post

All the major magazines had tests. The 458 vs mp4. And the 458 won every time I believe.
And technology is not everything. I am a Ferrari guy and most their cars are my favorite cars
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post #741 of 1052
9/20/12 at 4:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by basketball View Post

All the major magazines had tests. The 458 vs mp4. And the 458 won every time I believe.
And technology is not everything. I am a Ferrari guy and most their cars are my favorite cars

 

Won at what?  Really not possible tbh.  Somebody did something wrong.  Got links?

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post #742 of 1052
9/20/12 at 4:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post

Won at what?  Really not possible tbh.  Somebody did something wrong.  Got links?

It was in 2010, so the first model 458. Yes Ferrari guy! Hopefully my first exotics will be a f430 or 599 with manual transmission!
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post #743 of 1052
9/20/12 at 4:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post

Yes if you mean prettier.  Also more fun and engaging.  The MP4 is more capable and technically competent however and rides better than a Rolls or Bentley.


That's basically it. If you want to drive a computer, the MP4 is for you. If you want the last word in "analog", seat-of-your-pants, driving, the 458 is the ticket. Which is why I'm buying one, and not getting the MP4.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post

Won at what?  Really not possible tbh.  Somebody did something wrong.  Got links?


I have no doubt the McLaren thrashes the 458, the maths all back that up. But I'm not getting it for racing, it's for fun and drop-dead looks.
Edited by Magick Man - 9/20/12 at 5:00pm
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post #744 of 1052
9/20/12 at 6:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by basketball View Post


It was in 2010, so the first model 458. Yes Ferrari guy! Hopefully my first exotics will be a f430 or 599 with manual transmission!

 

Okay, found some stuff.  Looks like quite a few writers suck at driving the car, driving in general.  MP4 is not that easy to just throw around a track due to inducing turbo lag if you mess up your lines and have to catch up.  In a way, the 458 is the easier car to drive and obviously more fun.  The Stig beat up the 458 by almost a full 3 seconds using the MP4.  IMHO, the discrepancy is user error.  Just like some issues the writers had w/ the LFA.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zsl2yplL3o

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post #745 of 1052
9/20/12 at 8:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post

 

Okay, found some stuff.  Looks like quite a few writers suck at driving the car, driving in general.  MP4 is not that easy to just throw around a track due to inducing turbo lag if you mess up your lines and have to catch up.  In a way, the 458 is the easier car to drive and obviously more fun.  The Stig beat up the 458 by almost a full 3 seconds using the MP4.  IMHO, the discrepancy is user error.  Just like some issues the writers had w/ the LFA.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zsl2yplL3o

The 458 is more car to me. Technology is fine, but not too much of it. When it takes away from the driving feel of a car its too much and not necessary. Technology belongs in hybrids not soo much exotics.

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post #746 of 1052
9/20/12 at 9:11pm

Man basketball your comments are always funny in this thread. 

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post #747 of 1052
9/20/12 at 9:18pm

Lol, do you realize how much technology is in the 458?  You wouldn't be able to drive it w/o all the electronics (e-diff, etc).  If you just want pure car, get a Noble or Ariel Atom.  

 

I'm not really happy w/ the turbo V8 decision in the McLaren tbh.  But that's the car I'd pick if I wanted to drive across country in a supercar.  

 

I like the 458, 512TR and a few others but I'm not a Ferrari fan.  I think Enzo Ferrari was an a-hole and hated the pompous, narrow minded ******.  Every Ferrari crash I've seen winds up w/ the car split in half and driver vaporized if the car doesn't burn them alive first.  I think a Fiat 500 is probably safer.  The 458 was my favorite new supercar until I saw an Aventador next to it.  That made the 458 look like a bloated chick car.  458 still has my number one favorite drivers cockpit though.  

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post #748 of 1052
9/20/12 at 10:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by basketball View Post


All the major magazines had tests. The 458 vs mp4. And the 458 won every time I believe.
And technology is not everything. I am a Ferrari guy and most their cars are my favorite cars

 

From the major articles I read, both magazine and online, I found the 458 to be the one with more "soul" and "character", but that's obvious... It's a flipping Ferrari duh! Of course I absolutely LOVE Ferraris (308 GTB *cough cough*) and even though I haven't driven one yet, watching videos of Ferraris really gives me the goosebumps. BUT, the 458 vs the MP4-12C... These cars are both DESIGNED to go on a track and go crazy, but both are road legal. I really want the best of both worlds if you ask me. Looks wise, I prefer the MP4 honestly. A lot of people say the 458 looks better, but I just cannot get enough of the McLaren. A design like this is an once in a lifetime find for me. Everything looks so right. And speaking of the track, I remember my articles saying the MP4-12C was faster in a straight line, cornered faster, braked harder, and achieved consecutively faster times than the 458. So as a track car, the MP4-12C is just better, proven by Top Gear like someone mentioned and other tests. Also, these articles (please don't ask me which ones because I really don't want to go digging for articles I read before) said the MP4 was a better road car as well. Shockingly comfortable, more space in the boot, and the gearbox worked better in stop-go traffic better than Ferrari's. I like Ferraris, especially the classics, but I sort of lost interest after the 360 and 430 came about... I transitioned to Porsche and other unheard companies like Gumpert, Ascari, Pagani, and many more. Maybe it was Enzo's touch that inspired me with the older Ferarris?

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post #749 of 1052
9/28/12 at 6:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post

 

Okay, found some stuff.  Looks like quite a few writers suck at driving the car, driving in general.  MP4 is not that easy to just throw around a track due to inducing turbo lag if you mess up your lines and have to catch up.  In a way, the 458 is the easier car to drive and obviously more fun.  The Stig beat up the 458 by almost a full 3 seconds using the MP4.  IMHO, the discrepancy is user error.  Just like some issues the writers had w/ the LFA.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zsl2yplL3o


It's not surprising that the MP4-12C beats the 458 by such a large margin on the Top Gear test track because the MP4-12C was developed on the Top Gear test track. That being said, the MP4 will probably beat the 458 on virtually any track but maybe not by such a large margin. But yeah, I like the MP4-12C more than the 458, but then again I haven't driven either so my opinion may or may not change if I'm ever privileged enough to drive them.


Edited by blackmarket - 9/29/12 at 11:20am
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post #750 of 1052
10/1/12 at 1:15pm

Regarding the 458 and the MP4-12C, I have to say it probably doesn't matter which one is faster because both of them are likely too much car for even the above average driver to handle. I drove the 458 at the track and it was capable of far more than my skills were capable of serving up. It is a very fun car and I would totally buy one if money wasn't an issue. I also drove a Gallardo LP560-4 and R8 that day. The Gallardo was absolutely horrible to drive, but the R8 was quite well-balanced, though obviously not even close to the 458 in terms of performance potential. I'd say the R8 is a great car for the average car enthusiast to get into and have some fun trying to extract its potential.

 

As far as the 458 not being as technically advanced as the McLaren, I just have to say that it has an incredible amount of tech which was able to keep me from slamming into the wall of a large oval track (while transitioning from the infield to the oval) at about 100 mph while spinning the tires. However, these safeguards can be turned off and then I agree, the 458 can be a pretty raw machine. I am not a big fan of the engine note however.

 

My personal project car is an old Audi... probably weird to most here, but it is currently getting dry sump, and all the custom work needed to make 800 awhp and rev to 11k RPM from a turbocharged 5 cylinder engine similar to what was found in the group B rally legends of the 80s. If anyone is interested, I'll post some pictures as it comes along.

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