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REVIEW: Audio-GD Phoenix Balanced Solid-State Headphone Amplifier - Page 5

post #61 of 156
Thread Starter 
I have to finish another review first, and then I will try the Phoenix as a Pre-amp
post #62 of 156
I thoroughly enjoy my Phoenix. Concerning peoples continuing concerns regarding the unit running hot, they are a canard. I've had my Phoenix as long as anyone; since June 24th and the amp has been running 24/7 since then except for being turned off so that I could take it to the NJ meet on July 25th. That's over 2000 hours with no problems or glitches (except for a very slight noise in one channel that went away once the unit had warmed up, never to return).

As I've stated before the Phoenix is a 1st rate preamp. I'd be pleased with it's sound quality if I'd paid $3000 - $5000, so for $1300 I consider it a stone cold bargain, and as a headphone amp it doesn't suck.
post #63 of 156
Nice job man. Thanks for the effort. Now if I could just get you to send me those Franken-Darths....lol

I need a bigger amp for those anyway.

Cheers!
post #64 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by badwisdom View Post
Moonboy,

ive read that to get the most out of a Phoenix you need to connect using CAST.

Maybe the K1000 needs that config to drive your K1000 correctly ?

Ive read so much about the Phoenix's reserve power that im surprised that you had trouble with the K1000

Cheers
Xavier
It's not that the Phoenix doesn't have enough juice to power the K1000 (Plenty enough for it). The Phoenix was just outmatched in terms of synergy against the Audio Note Kit 1 that I listened to especially in terms of soundstage and imaging.
post #65 of 156
Well done Skylab, well described
Enjoy reading your review, as always.
I guess Phoenix may not good then already dark HD650 then.
post #66 of 156
It is all just a matter of preference, but I really liked Sennheiser HD600 (SE, Cardas cable) with Phoenix, very smooth and detailed sound, great music enjoyment, HD600 have a whole new life with the Phoenix for me (I used Little DOT MkV previously). So it could be potentially a good match for HD650 too, depending on your preference.

By the way, AKG K701 (SE, stock cable), my favourite headphones of the last year, is great with the Phoenix too, as I stated in another thread here.
post #67 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yikes View Post
I thoroughly enjoy my Phoenix. Concerning peoples continuing concerns regarding the unit running hot, they are a canard. I've had my Phoenix as long as anyone; since June 24th and the amp has been running 24/7 since then except for being turned off so that I could take it to the NJ meet on July 25th. That's over 2000 hours with no problems or glitches (except for a very slight noise in one channel that went away once the unit had warmed up, never to return).

As I've stated before the Phoenix is a 1st rate preamp. I'd be pleased with it's sound quality if I'd paid $3000 - $5000, so for $1300 I consider it a stone cold bargain, and as a headphone amp it doesn't suck.

Do you consider the below paste to be a DUCK.

If you want to ensure that your expensive electronic components enjoy a long and full product life cycle, you must make sure to keep them operating at a comfortable, cool temperature. The number one factor that kills electronic components is overheating. Even short of an outright meltdown, excessive heat causes electronic components to function less reliably and reduces their overall life span.

Stay below 85 Degrees F
To achieve optimum performance and optimum equipment life, it is recommended that you keep your system operating at a standard temperature below 85 degrees F. Most studies show that every 10 degree increase over 85 degrees F leads to a whopping 40% reduction in your equipment’s life span.
post #68 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by ford2 View Post
Do you consider the below paste to be a DUCK.

If you want to ensure that your expensive electronic components enjoy a long and full product life cycle, you must make sure to keep them operating at a comfortable, cool temperature. The number one factor that kills electronic components is overheating. Even short of an outright meltdown, excessive heat causes electronic components to function less reliably and reduces their overall life span.

Stay below 85 Degrees F
To achieve optimum performance and optimum equipment life, it is recommended that you keep your system operating at a standard temperature below 85 degrees F. Most studies show that every 10 degree increase over 85 degrees F leads to a whopping 40% reduction in your equipment’s life span.
No I consider it a Red Herring. Quoting a so called study without the specifics and conditions is less than useless. I've been an Audiophile for 30 years and in the Audio business for 25 years and I know that everything else being equal heat does effect equipment longevity, but everything is seldom equal. The Phoenix uses the entire aluminum chassis as a heat sink and as I have said elsewhere it should be put on an open rack or shelf where air can freely circulate around it (Not in a closed cabinet which at least one moron has done). I also discourage stacking the pieces, side by side with about 2"+ between them works well. Installed in this manner they get no warmer than either of my DVR's and are considerably cooler than my Parasound JC1 amplifiers (and I'm talking about the chassis not the heat sinks here).

There's no denying that if the Phoenix was built in two full size chassis with conventional heatsinks (or god forbid a cooling fan) it could very well run significantly cooler, and in such a case the MTBF might be higher than it is now. It might be 10 years whereas now it might be 7, who knows? At this point it is conjecture.

The other thing to consider is that since it takes about an hour of warm-up for the Phoenix to sound its best (It sounds better when it gets up to its normal operating temperature that some people are stating is too high) That if it was in a chassis that kept it running cooler it might not sound as good as it does. If it ran cooler it might never reach the temperatures at which it sounds its best.

So according to the study that you quote if the Phoenix operates at 115 degrees F it should never work (3 x 40% = 120% hence it's lifespan would be - 20%). The quoted study doesn't pertain to Headphone amplifiers so it's BS as far as this discussion goes.
post #69 of 156
Man, sad to see the temperature rise (and I do not mean the amp's temperature). By all accounts this is a very nice unit and I would love to listen to one some day but do we need to be so aggressive in our comments? It is after all a hobby and it is done for entertainment value. Cheers.
post #70 of 156

About the heat generated by Phoenix:

Some users worry about the heat generated by Phoenix, the reason behind this maybe they are aware that caps working at high temperature results in shorter life than working on low temperature. That is true.

But there is no need to worry, I am the designer of Phoenix and an owner myself, I want our products to be of high quality and at the same time having many years lifespan, if the gears I produce are of bad quality, no anyone will buy our products which will only result in the downfall of my company soon, so in my design, I make sure to keep the quality of the gear as the foremost priority.

I also know that caps life is connected to temperature, which is why I design most products having working temperature below 55°C at the chassis in Summer , since the caps working temperature is around 45°C or below , the working temperature in winter will be much lower. In the past I have checked some gears like KRELL and Music Fidelity etc, they sell some Class A amp, where the working temperature in some are higher than 65°C .

A lot of gears have iron chassis, even though the chassis don’t feel very hot, the inside temperature will be around 45°C. Phoenix on the other hand uses the chassis as a heat sink, so the chassis temperature is higher than the inside temperature.

How to calculate the caps life? See below.

<See the pix 1>

L2 is the accounted lifespan (hours) , L1 is the caps test life ( for example , 105°C caps life at 105°C working temperature , our NOVER caps have more than 1500 hours. I will use 1500 hours for account). T2 is the caps design temperature, and T1 is the caps working temperature.

<see the pix 2>

This demonstrates that lifespan of the caps in Phoenix is around 96000 hours.

If Phoenix is operational 8 hours every day, it can have a lifespan of 96000/8/365=32.8 years.

If Phoenix is operational for 24 hours every day, it can have a lifespan of 96000/24/365=10.95 years.
LL
LL
post #71 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by audio-gd View Post
Some users worry about the heat generated by Phoenix, the reason behind this maybe they are aware that caps working at high temperature results in shorter life than working on low temperature. That is true.

But there is no need to worry, I am the designer of Phoenix and an owner myself, I want our products to be of high quality and at the same time having many years lifespan, if the gears I produce are of bad quality, no anyone will buy our products which will only result in the downfall of my company soon, so in my design, I make sure to keep the quality of the gear as the foremost priority.

I also know that caps life is connected to temperature, which is why I design most products having working temperature below 55°C at the chassis in Summer , since the caps working temperature is around 45°C or below , the working temperature in winter will be much lower. In the past I have checked some gears like KRELL and Music Fidelity etc, they sell some Class A amp, where the working temperature in some are higher than 65°C .

A lot of gears have iron chassis, even though the chassis don’t feel very hot, the inside temperature will be around 45°C. Phoenix on the other hand uses the chassis as a heat sink, so the chassis temperature is higher than the inside temperature.

How to calculate the caps life? See below.

<See the pix 1>

L2 is the accounted lifespan (hours) , L1 is the caps test life ( for example , 105°C caps life at 105°C working temperature , our NOVER caps have more than 1500 hours. I will use 1500 hours for account). T2 is the caps design temperature, and T1 is the caps working temperature.

<see the pix 2>

This demonstrates that lifespan of the caps in Phoenix is around 96000 hours.

If Phoenix is operational 8 hours every day, it can have a lifespan of 96000/8/365=32.8 years.

If Phoenix is operational for 24 hours every day, it can have a lifespan of 96000/24/365=10.95 years.
Finally Audio-gd here to explain.
post #72 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yikes View Post
The Phoenix uses the entire aluminum chassis as a heat sink and as I have said elsewhere it should be put on an open rack or shelf where air can freely circulate around it (Not in a closed cabinet which at least one moron has done). I also discourage stacking the pieces, side by side with about 2"+ between them works well.
Can't help myself for laughing at this "( )" statement. By the way, how you know that the cabinet not made of aluminum as a bigger heatsink? lol
I believe it still need to open the cabinet to listen, if not how to plug in the jack.

I also do not stack the pieces, put side by side and put additional padding to higher the foot allow more air flow below.
post #73 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedBull View Post
Well done Skylab, well described
Enjoy reading your review, as always.
I guess Phoenix may not good then already dark HD650 then.
I have the HD650 balanced with Double Helix Nuceotide cable and I have to say that it is a good match with the Phoenix and it doesn't sound too dark. Soundstage has widened a lot and instrument seperation is incredible.
I previously was using the HD650 (stock cable) with the Compass and that was a terrific match also, but with decreased soundstage and poor instrument seperation.
The music feels less upfront with the Phoenix and I feel actually being in the recording studio with this amp. 3D sound imaging is defenitely there.
post #74 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by audio-gd View Post

This demonstrates that lifespan of the caps in Phoenix is around 96000 hours.

If Phoenix is operational 8 hours every day, it can have a lifespan of 96000/8/365=32.8 years.

If Phoenix is operational for 24 hours every day, it can have a lifespan of 96000/24/365=10.95 years.
Damn, I'll only be 74 when it dies on me.
You know, if someone actually had a AGD product that had caps go bad earlier than they should due to excessive heat, I could understand all the great concern over the heat "issue".
post #75 of 156
My thoughts are, if the chassis is hot, then it's doing its job dispersing heat. Also, from having compared other audio gear recently, I think it's that a lot of stuff is bright, rather than Audio-gd being dark, that is, if the Phoenix etc measure flat.
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