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Westone custom tips losing their fit.

post #1 of 18
8/18/09 at 6:07pm
Thread Starter 
Hi all,

I've had a pair of Westone UM56 custom tips for about 3 years now and lately they seem to be losing their seal quite often. Do customs need to be redone every few years to keep the fit? I did lose weight since I got them, but I didn't think my head was that big to start with.

At $125 a shot, I hate to have to chuck these and get a new set of tips. Does anybody know if Westone offers a resize/refit option for custom tips, at a cheaper price?

-Jeff
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post #2 of 18
8/18/09 at 6:44pm
This is not supposed to happen within a few years, more like 10 or 20 years if at all.

How much weight did you lose actually? I heard it's quite common when you lose quit a lot like 20 kilos or more.
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post #3 of 18
8/18/09 at 6:59pm
Not true. I have read in other threads that custom tips may need to be redone every 3-4 years, depending on the individual. Just imagine paying $1000+ for customs and it happening. Maybe they provide new shells as part of the deal. But check in with the Westone rep and see what he can do. He posts in the Westone forum, of course.
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post #4 of 18
8/19/09 at 12:04am
Yes...your ear canal shape does change a little after 3-4 years...the problem is not losing weight...
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post #5 of 18
8/19/09 at 1:42am
I have came across a few hearing aid companies suggesting that 3~4 as their expected maximum shell life in general. Most of them will suggest a yearly check up with audiologist to ensure a good fit.

A study indicates that adult human ears have a roughly 7 yrs grow cycle ('circaseptennial rhythm') - meaning for every 7 yrs or so, your ears will grow 'significantly' (statistically speaking). Depends on when you made the custom mold, it could be as fast as 2~3 yrs (closer to the grow cycle) or 4~5 yrs (further from the grow cycle) before your custom eartips lose its fit. FYI, the average ear's grow for > 30 yrs-old male is ~0.22mm per year, but yhe number can fluctuate >2mm in every cycle.

Remember, since custom eartips fits so perfectly to your ear canal, a change of 2mm can ruin the seal.
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post #6 of 18
8/19/09 at 3:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tstarn06 View Post
Not true. I have read in other threads that custom tips may need to be redone every 3-4 years, depending on the individual. Just imagine paying $1000+ for customs and it happening. Maybe they provide new shells as part of the deal. But check in with the Westone rep and see what he can do. He posts in the Westone forum, of course.
Well, you read it somewhere, yes! But do you know it?

Losing weight is a big factor! But only if you lose really much. Felix from Compact Monitor says that these changes in your ear canal are not very likely to happen when you look at the time when you're grown out till maybe 50. There are a few factors which will change this:

- big loss or gain of weight
- pregnancy, due to changes in your hormone systems
- above 50 or even older, once again this is related through changes in your hormone system

Let's assume you're grown out, maybe in the middle of your twenties you'll be able to use the customs longer than you really want because a really superior product will have been released by then!
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post #7 of 18
8/19/09 at 3:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post
A study indicates that adult human ears have a roughly 7 yrs grow cycle ('circaseptennial rhythm') - meaning for every 7 yrs or so, your ears will grow 'significantly' (statistically speaking). Depends on when you made the custom mold, it could be as fast as 2~3 yrs (closer to the grow cycle) or 4~5 yrs (further from the grow cycle) before your custom eartips lose its fit. FYI, the average ear's grow for > 30 yrs-old male is ~0.22mm per year, but yhe number can fluctuate >2mm in every cycle.
Quote:
Dr Jos Verhulst of the Louis Bolk Institute in the The Netherlands and Patrick Onghena at Katholieke Universiteit Leuven in Belgium, analysed ear length values from the age of 30 to 83 and found that ear-growth velocity peaked around multiples of seven years.
Well, yes, the outer ear length might change a bit but doesn't tell you whether customs will fit or not.

Anyway, the study doesn't sound too scientific after all
How mystical seven gives a nod to big ears - News - The Independent
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post #8 of 18
8/19/09 at 5:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuglufttier View Post
Well, yes, the outer ear length might change a bit but doesn't tell you whether customs will fit or not.

Anyway, the study doesn't sound too scientific after all
How mystical seven gives a nod to big ears - News - The Independent
Instead of reading it from a newspaper like the Independent with a colorful writing touch up, why not read it from the source? It is available at British Medical Journal, and the registration is totally free. While you at it, do read up the counter opinion from one of the editor and how the authors defend their finding (all in the citing).

While no study has yet to focus solely on the change of the ear canal diameter, it is premature to rule out the ear grow as a factor that affects ear canal diameter, especially on the opening of the ear canal where it could affect the seal of an IEM the most.
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post #9 of 18
8/19/09 at 5:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post
Instead of reading it from a newspaper like the Independent with a colorful writing touch up, why not read it from the source? It is available at British Medical Journal, and the registration is totally free. While you at it, do read up the counter opinion from one of the editor and how the authors defend their finding (all in the citing).

While no study has yet to focus solely on the change of the ear canal diameter, it is premature to rule out the ear grow as a factor that affects ear canal diameter, especially on the opening of the ear canal where it could affect the seal of an IEM the most.
You got me! In your post you wrote "A study indicates" which lead to me thinking you were not really informed and just referred to something somebody wrote somewhere which is often the case in here... Sorry for that! In this case, I didn't read enough

While the study may be interesting, I guess it is even more important to hear from someone who has experience with custom inears. While it is very tempting to believe that a company like Compact Monitors say custom iems will fit for a very long time, just to sell their product, you'd have to think twice because they're going to lose their clients in the end if it's obvious they were lying before the buy.

I think Jerry Harvey also says that ciems will fit for a longer period than three or four years.
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post #10 of 18
8/19/09 at 8:33am
Thread Starter 
Thanks for all the info guys. I'll contact Westone and see if there is option besides just starting over. Since they are just the tips, I'm guessing not, but it's still worth a shot.

As for weight I lost about 55 pounds (25 Kilos or so). So with both changes I'm guessing there must have been enough to throw the seal off.

It seals part of the time, if I get it "just right" but if I move much, it breaks again.

thanks,
-Jeff
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post #11 of 18
8/19/09 at 10:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffS View Post
Thanks for all the info guys. I'll contact Westone and see if there is option besides just starting over. Since they are just the tips, I'm guessing not, but it's still worth a shot.

As for weight I lost about 55 pounds (25 Kilos or so). So with both changes I'm guessing there must have been enough to throw the seal off.

It seals part of the time, if I get it "just right" but if I move much, it breaks again.

thanks,
-Jeff
I just had impressions taken yesterday for a UM56. The audiologist recommended OtoBlast over Vinyl. One reason she gave was that the Vinyl shrinks in a few years.

I think that reaching out to a Westone Dispenser audiologist and asking about the materials would probably be the best way to get accurate information.
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post #12 of 18
8/19/09 at 10:46am
oh man... i got mine less than a week. um56(vinyl)
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post #13 of 18
8/19/09 at 11:05am
I'm not sure how they make the things, but if it's anything like how we do it in dentistry, there is a cast somewhere of your ear canal from which they made the tips. If they still have it, they shouldn't charge you to make it again unless your ear canal has increased in diameter (obviously you'd need a new cast). Ask them about your casts.
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post #14 of 18
8/19/09 at 11:30am
Thread Starter 
I think I remember from another discussion on this forum, that they only keep impressions on file for 6 months. I might be mixing that up with UE, but I think it was Westone. I'm going to make some calls this afternoon and see what I can find out. I'll report back if I get any news that clears things up.

-Jeff
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post #15 of 18
8/19/09 at 11:57am
The human ear grows our entire lives, and yes weight loss/gain can have a HUGE impact on the fit. Funny thing is we're talking millimeters or less, that's how sensitive our ear canals are. Vinyl also has a tendency to harden a shrink over time. This can speed up or slow down based upon each persons body chemistry.
Your statement of 55lbs, yeah, that would have an impact, hands down.
As for the impressions, we keep them for 90 days on earpieces and 1 year on full custom monitors. Reason for this is something happens say 2+ years down the road, chances are your ears have changed and we want the most current "version" of your ear canal to give you the best fit and comfort.
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