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My Singlepower Supra Experience - Why mine almost blew up like a Hand Grenade (and yours might too) - Page 4

post #46 of 314
7/31/09 at 12:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilS View Post
Ok,but it is fair to say that if I just remove the outside case and don't touch anything inside, I should be fine right? Since it's been working fine for 5 years, I'd prefer not to have to send it to someone who can look at it, or throw it in the trash as the other option.
Unless you know how to safely discharge caps, I wouldn't risk it. They can hold a charge for some time. Don't mess with them unless you know what you're doing.

Also, everyone should not panic over point-to-point wiring with a star ground. A star ground uses individual wires to connect ground to a particular ground point. It results in extra wires, however, it is not inherently unsafe. I'm not excusing Mikhail's work, but do not equate wires running around with poor build quality. The opposite can be true with a carefully constructed amp. Personally, I think that star grounds are a great way to build an amp and can provide a measure of safety over using an exposed ground bus. I have radios and test gear built this way that have been operating safely since the 1940s. It's a good construction technique when used properly.
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post #47 of 314
7/31/09 at 12:25am
It looks like a bird's next in there. This is the most unprofessional wiring I have ever seen. Why is there, at the very least, no electrical tape wrapped around the wires soldered to the resistors? If those touch the chassis, couldn't either the tubes, your headphones, or YOU go bye-bye?

Not only does Mikhail want to rip you off, it seems he wants to kill you as well.
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post #48 of 314
7/31/09 at 12:31am
Thread Starter 
It's even worse than you thing - most of the parts are not secured to anything at all, rather they are "floating" in the middle of the case, suspended by the stiffness of the wires running to them. Amazing that the solder joints don't crack during shipment.
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post #49 of 314
7/31/09 at 12:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by vcoheda View Post
and yet people claimed and some still claim that the SP amps are the best sounding. to say that i am having a hard time reconciling those views with the above, as well as the other recent threads on this, would be a massive understatement.
What does "best" even mean? All it does is color the sound differently and people label it "good" or "best", but it's really completely arbitrary.
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post #50 of 314
7/31/09 at 12:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyson View Post
It's even worse than you thing - most of the parts are not secured to anything at all, rather they are "floating" in the middle of the case, suspended by the stiffness of the wires running to them. Amazing that the solder joints don't crack during shipment.
Yes. Components should never "float" inside a chassis. Every component should be secured on both ends. Tie each end to a tube socket, tie point or terminal strip. Larger components, like big capacitors, should be further secured with a capacitor clamp bolted to the chassis. Bare leads are also a bad idea. While it may be overkill, I put spaghetti on every lead for every component.

The "problem," however, is that building this way will result in a lot of wires running around. That can look like a bird's nest, but it will be safe and functional. What you really have to look for is that each component is secured. If you have that, then the construction can be sound.

There's a lot more to this, but I don't want people to freak out just because they see wires. There are some exceptional amps built using point-to-point that, to an uneducated eye, might appear "dangerous" when the fact is that they're extremely well built.

And no, I don't think this example is well built.
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post #51 of 314
7/31/09 at 12:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speederlander View Post
What does "best" even mean? All it does is color the sound differently and people label it "good" or "best", but it's really completely arbitrary.
Oh, come on. Let's stick to the topic, please. Every thread that deals with a specific issue relating to SP amps gets sidetracked and has to be cleaned up by the mods. Let's not go there for once. Please.
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post #52 of 314
7/31/09 at 12:49am
This make me sad. I had no known issuses with my SDS that I've been using for last 6 years. Unfortunately, after some minor but extreme upgraded by Mikhail...I eventually ran into some serious issues. Thanks to a local tech., my amp now has bleeder resistors and is much safer to operate.
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post #53 of 314
7/31/09 at 12:58am
I've ran mine hard (weeks at a stretch which won't happen again) with nary an issue. I have taken it apart and did a through inspection after a couple threads about trouble. I also took it apart at our last meet and had a couple DIY guys look it over. Nothing visually evident like discoloration or malformed components. Mine is a Platinum w/pc board PPX rev.A.

As to the comments about the credibility of anyone saying a SP amp sounds good, that's just beyond comprehension. Hey Boom, you don't know what your talking about with that SP amp of yours.
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post #54 of 314
7/31/09 at 1:01am
Quote:
Originally Posted by vcoheda View Post
and yet people claimed and some still claim that the SP amps are the best sounding. to say that i am having a hard time reconciling those views with the above, as well as the other recent threads on this, would be a massive understatement.
Please stop trolling. People who talk about how their amp sound don't contradict what has been done inside their amps. It's comments like these that muddy the waters and make these issues contentious.
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post #55 of 314
7/31/09 at 1:03am
Thread Starter 
Unkle Erik,
You are right, point to point wiring is not a bad thing, and star grounding is an excellent way to keep hum/noise down. I have tube amps for my speakers that use star grounding and they are very well built.

One thing to note, many people seem to indicate that Single Power's workmanship "went bad" over the past couple of years. But, my amp was one of the very first Supras ever built, which indicates that it did not "go bad", but in fact was never very good in the first place.
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post #56 of 314
7/31/09 at 1:11am
Can someone comment, without hyperbole, regarding the extent of the danger? If the amp has a problem, and "blows up," what is likely to happen? For example, when we talk about the amp blowing up "like a hand grenade," are we talking about the suddenness of the event, with damage being confined to the amp case, or is it really the case that my amp, which is inside a cabinet, is going to blow up my cabinet, blow a hole in the wall, and kill everybody in the room?
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post #57 of 314
7/31/09 at 1:19am
PhilS, the problem is that no one can know as each amp may or may not be different inside. I have a SP Extreme Platinum, which sounds different than other Extreme Platinums I've heard (and yes, it sounds great with my chosen headphones), so I'm betting right off the bat that what's inside mine is different than in others. What may or may not be problematic and/or hazardous in mine, may or may not exist in the next amp. What a freaking mess. My amp is also the preamp for my speaker rig, which I use often, so I'm doubly concerned.
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post #58 of 314
7/31/09 at 1:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by boomana View Post
PhilS, the problem is that no one can know as each amp may or may not be different inside. I have a SP Extreme Platinum, which sounds different than other Extreme Platinums I've heard (and yes, it sounds great with my chosen headphones), so I'm betting right off the bat that what's inside mine is different than in others. What may or may not be problematic and/or hazardous in mine, may or may not exist in the next amp. What a freaking mess. My amp is also the preamp for my speaker rig, which I use often, so I'm doubly concerned.
No, I understand that they may all be different, and this may be an ignorant question, but isn't it possible to say something about the range of likely damage, given the likely range in the size of the caps in these amps?

I asking this, not only for myself, but for others who find this thread, and to put this in context. I mean, the title of this thread, and the first post, talks about an explosion like a "hand grenade." We all know what a hand grenade explosion looks like from watching war movies. Is there a legitimate basis to say that this could indeed be the magnitude (as opposed to the suddenness) of the explosion? If not, and we really don't know what the likely magnitude should be, maybe the title of the thread, and the first post should be qualified or changed.
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post #59 of 314
7/31/09 at 1:34am
What does trolling mean? Is that anything like living under a bridge and asking people for money?

If Singlepower was on the stock market, I bet it would be doing a nose dive about now.

I feel sorry for the guys who bought like ten of them and kept telling people how great they were.
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post #60 of 314
7/31/09 at 1:36am
trolling is intentionally making things more divisive than they need to be. Like calling people out for liking how something sounds because it turns out there were problems with the safety. Or calling people out for how something sounds because you support a different builder.
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