HD650's Are not as nearly good as i expected them to be(no bass),Do i need to upgrade source or amp? - Page 4

It sounds like there are something defective with your headphones. Everyone says the HD650's are hard to drive. OK true, but there should still be plenty of bass even driving them out of an ipod - not nearly as loud or defined as it could be, but still there. I have the HD650's and run them out of my Denon 3805 reciever with ample bass. My HD650 have much more and better quality bass than running my easy to drive HD595's out of the same reciever..........

Defective phones are a possibility certainly, but the DT990 is really boosted in the bass and highs, and if that's the reference then the HD650 is going to sound anemic in comparison. It is made to have a flatter frequency response, though it's not as flat as the HD600.

To the OP: stick with what you like. If you like the 990, then go with that and try to max it out. Get a really good outboard DAC and an amp that can drive the 990 to its potential, and don't worry about upgrading the cans until you can hear other alternatives firsthand.

Burn in exists but is overrated and it isn't going to turn the HD650 into a different set of phones. EQ is a possibility but that's band-aid fix and is not necessary when the 990 can do just fine without it.

Alternatively, you can give yourself some time for the ear to adjust to the HD650 sound signature, and see if you still feel this way after some time just listening to the HD650 exclusively. But, this once again only applies provided that there's nothing wrong with the headphones or amp.

The HD650 does need a full-size desktop amp to show its stuff, and it also does need a high-resolution source since it is a deceptively high-resolution transducer. It doesn't flaunt its detail but it does provide a very good window into the recording. In a proper rig it shouldn't sound boomy with bloated bass, rolled-off highs, and lacking dynamic range; properly driven it sounds vivid with a creamy euphonic tone, tight and punchy bass and very extended silky highs. It is colored and inaccurate compared to a really neutral headphone but it does sound very good when it's given enough power. It can also be a bass-monster with concussive, pummeling impact when the rig is powerful enough and is voiced this way.

Not necessarily.

Think about how dynamic headphones are built. There is a magnet, a coil of wire and a cone that needs to be moved back and forth.

Bass requires the biggest movement of the cone, right? Bass frequencies are low, long wavelengths, and the cone has to move a lot to make those frequencies. If you want higher frequencies from the cone, it doesn't have to move nearly as much.

Alright, if you want that coil to really move the cone, you have to apply a lot more power to the coil than you would for higher frequencies.

This is why headphones have weak bass and an emphasis on the highs when they're underpowered. Same reason you'll hea a weak amp clip - the coil needs more power than the amp can deliver, and when the amp reaches its power limit, it clips as it fails to deliver enough power.

This is why you want to run headphones like the HD-650 from a desktop amp or a receiver. Wall current is enough for a properly designed amp to power the low notes and not clip. A 9V battery cannot always give you the depth you want. Neither can a few dozen mW of power off the typical soundcard.

I know this argument gets pitched in terms of class warfare, but you need to have enough power to drive the tougher headphones. Weaker amps will make these kinds of headphones sound muddy, veiled and not nearly as good as they're capable of sounding. The good news is that there are options for every budget - from grabbing old recievers put out with the trash to amps you build yourself to anything you want to spend.

Apologies for the semi-thread hijack, but I didn't think it was worth starting another thread on, I hope I'm not frowned upon!

I'm thinking of going for some decent quality headphones (with a budget of up to £250) so the HD 650's are high up on my list. I was intending to power them through an iBasso D10 DAC/AMP but after reading through this topic I'm a little concerned that it's not going to be suitable to power the HD 650's sufficiently. Anyone have any input or thoughts on whether I could get away with this combo hooked up to my MacBook Pro playing lossless files?

Cheers,
Tom

@Suasexed: while it won't be bad to do so, HD-650s can sound a lot better when fed better that's all. If I were you I'd just go for it. That way your system can grow w/ you and your heaphone won't be your limiting factor.. (at least for a while... until you enter the >$1000 territory..)

Full sized cans need power. With so many amps trying to meet price points, many are cutting corners to make the price. When price is secondary, you can get some good amps at a decent price. If I were a teener, I wouldn't have the money for the amps that you need to get the most from theses great hps. With limited funds, get the cans now and target a quality amp for that congratulatory gift. Expect to drop $500 or more for a decent amp (used). 80% 650s are still worthy of getting.

I find HD650 is easier to drive than K702. I upgraded my setup and disposed the K702 for a HD650.

Epic bump.

 

There is something about this thread I don't get: to all those people saying: there must be something wrong with your HD650's if they're sounding lacking in bass and bright to you - what could that possibly mean?

 

You mean they're fake HD650's? That's pretty much the only thing that could be wrong with them...

 

They're obviously not broken otherwise sound would not be coming out and it would be severely distorted which the OP has not stated. They're not even being especially under-driven given he's amping with a Pro-Ject Headbox.

 

To my knowledge there is nothing that could be wrong with a headphone that would make it reproduce sound perfectly but with a slightly different sound signature?

 

Maybe the OP is just used to bass-heavy headphones and when he hears a relatively neutral headphone (yet still bass-heavy compared to some other neutral headphones) he hears it as bass-light?

I tend to agree with you cactus

I can comment on this to some degree.  The first pair of HD650s I owned was back in October of '09.  I was powering them with an Elekit TU-882 tube amp.  This was *after* trying an Audio-GD Compass (which I found to be fairly lacking).  With both amps, I was finding the HD650s to be somewhat harsh on my ears in the treble, and they seemed way too boring.  I was extremely disappointed because of all the reviews I read on the HD650s; I was expecting luxurious, warm, rich, layered sound.  Didn't happen.  I sold them.

 

Fast forward to now.  I just received another brand new pair (like the first one) of HD650s on Monday.  I'm now powering them with my PS Audio GCHA, and it sounds absolutely fantastic.  THIS is the sound I was trying to get the first time around.  Is it a matter of proper amp matching, or was there something defective with my first pair?  That I do not know.  But I did purchase from an authorized dealer both times.  So due to that fact, signs tend to point to amp mismatching.  All I can say is that right now, I am loving this combination.  So at least anyone reading this can know that the HD650s do play well with the PS Audio GCHA, should you be in the market for an amp.

Edited by jsplice - 10/27/11 at 2:29pm

Maybe at the time of your buying the first HD650 you were listening mainly to something like Audio Technica M50/Beyer DT150, you then bought an HD650 and thought it sounded harsh, and then after selling the HD650 you listened exclusively to Grado's and the K701, then you came back to the HD650 and suddenly it sounded luxurious and dark?

 

I'm kidding, I'm sure it was probably amp synergy. But audio memory is VERY easily tainted, that point stands. Audio memory is also very comparative. Sometimes I'm listening to my HD650 and think 'man, this bass is so deep, I can't imagine hearing deeper bass', and then I put on the M50, and I AM hearing much deeper bass and then the HD650 sounds a little bit tinny afterwards, for a while.

 

And seriously, do you guys really think that there are versions of the HD650 (or any high end headphone) that have nothing wrong with them technically and are not damaged in any way, but have a totally different sound-signature to the rest of the HD650's?

Edited by cactus_farmer - 10/27/11 at 3:06pm