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The Beyerdynamic DT880 Discussion thread - Page 493

post #7381 of 10426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooko View Post
 

 

Can you clarify a little?  If you are talking one device - and you're either going line-out or headphone out, then both are using the same DAC - the difference is in the amp.  The line-out will be a constant signal which may be bypassing the internal amp.

 

If you can clarify the question - I'm sure someone can help.

 

I am talking about the Apogee Duet 2. It is  a DAC used for recording and mattering albums. This is high quality for a small unit powered by the USB connection (it does have an optional external power supply)/ . I am thinking of using it for my headphone DAC.  According to a representative from Apogee Digital, the headphones have its own DAC. According to them, what you get out of the headphone jack is "pretty close" to what you get on the line outs.

 

Bob

post #7382 of 10426
Reading the specs for the Duet 2 from Apogee's website shows that it only contains a single dac chipset so it shouldn't differ dac wise going from line out vs headphone out. The primary difference would be that the HP out has an amp in the chain while the line out doesn't. I think that's what the rep meant when they said that the HP out is close to the line out, they might've picked an amp that introduces very little colorization/distortion.
post #7383 of 10426

Hi Bob

 

I'm confused.  I just looked up the Apogee Duet 2 - and it looks pretty much like an AD/DA converter with two analogue inputs and 4 analogue outputs.  It doesn't say anywhere that any of them are fixed line-outs, and they're all using the same ESS Sabre32 DAC for conversion.

post #7384 of 10426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooko View Post

Hi Bob

I'm confused.  I just looked up the Apogee Duet 2 - and it looks pretty much like an AD/DA converter with two analogue inputs and 4 analogue outputs.  It doesn't say anywhere that any of them are fixed line-outs, and they're all using the same ESS Sabre32 DAC for conversion.

Thanks for the clarification. I must of picked up that erroneous comment on the same thread at Gears****.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrEleventy View Post

Reading the specs for the Duet 2 from Apogee's website shows that it only contains a single dac chipset so it shouldn't differ dac wise going from line out vs headphone out. The primary difference would be that the HP out has an amp in the chain while the line out doesn't. I think that's what the rep meant when they said that the HP out is close to the line out, they might've picked an amp that introduces very little colorization/distortion.

Yes, that makes sense. So I would have to use headphone out for my DT880s. I understand the Apogee Duet 2 is suppose to be a very good DAC. I assume the amp part for the headphones is up to spec too. But then maybe not.

What do you guys think? Is it worth a try?

Here is another high impedance DAC/amp. The Cambridge Audio DACMagic Plus has 50 ohm output. Do I need 600 ohm phones for this?

Bob

PS: I would have to thaw my credit card out from the block of ice it is in. LOL
Edited by r010159 - 5/18/14 at 7:17pm
post #7385 of 10426

Are you mixing and mastering?  If not - then it would seem to me that the features being offered are superfluous to your needs.  If all you're looking for is a good desktop dac/amp - then personally I'd look at:

 

Audio-gd NFB 15.32 - http://www.audio-gd.com/Pro/Headphoneamp/NFB1532/NFB15.32EN.htm

Dual Wolfson WM8741 - detailed but with full, rich tonality (ie slightly on the warm side of neutral - typical WM8741 signature)

 

or

Audio-gd NFB 11(2014) - http://www.audio-gd.com/Pro/Headphoneamp/NFB112014/NFB112014EN.htm

Uses the Sabre ES9018 and now does DSD/DXD over USB (not sure if it is native or converted onboard to PCM)

Supposed to be highly detailed

 

Both units have very powerful amps and will drive most headphones.  I even use my NFB-12 (older model dual WM8741) to power passive speakers as well.  They match with the DT880 really well. 

post #7386 of 10426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooko View Post

Are you mixing and mastering?  If not - then it would seem to me that the features being offered are superfluous to your needs.  If all you're looking for is a good desktop dac/amp - then personally I'd look at:

[deleted]

I have several very good synthesizers that I want to record to a DAW. This has been a plan a decade in the making. So there are future benefits.

Bob

PS: I am just going by Ken Rockwell's review. I agree with much of what he says in his other opinions and recommendations.
post #7387 of 10426

Ah - OK.  For recording - it does seem to be reasonably well recommended.  Unfortunately that's beyond my scope - so I won't have any further recommendations.  I'm guessing you're using your Mac Mini - so it does look to be a perfect fit :smile:.

post #7388 of 10426
Ahhhh Nooooo not that Ken Rockwell name again... biggrin.gifrolleyes.gif
post #7389 of 10426
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrollDragon View Post

Ahhhh Nooooo not that Ken Rockwell name again... biggrin.gifrolleyes.gif

 

Please elucidate! What is the scoop on this guy Ken Rockwell? He is of course not the only source of my information, but I am beginning to respect the guy. 

post #7390 of 10426
The DT880's sound much better than the HD800's, and when compared to the SR-007 he forgets which headphone he has on...

Also those Stax need a plug in the wall bias source. Where the DT880's offer a beautiful electrostatic sound without all the extra stuff...

Really? Someone should inform the Stax Mafia that all they need are DT880's...

His buy through me links and the begging for money at the bottom of every page really grates on me.
post #7391 of 10426

Well, before you knock on the guy, his review of the HD800 is actually quite spot on.

 

The HD800 is very very very VERY source-picky. If you are lucky enough, you get an amp pairing that it likes (and that has to include the source material, the DAC, and heck, probably the cable as well!), and then the soundstage opens up just enough for it to sound like how it should.

 

But in general, I find the DT880 quite competent and far easier to pair with than the HD800.

 

And IMO, DT880 with good amp beats HD800 with a mismatched amp any day. That's not to mention the rest of the chain.

 

By no means is the DT880 such a monstrous headphone that it can compete with Stax... but I can believe that well-burned pair would have enough physical changes (such as the wear on the ear pads, and also how the headband has been stretched over the years), that it would sound decent enough to compete against upper tier gears. Plus if you're listening mostly to stuffs recorded before 2000 or watching mostly Youtube and the likes, then the improvement with upper tier gears would be minuscule at best.

 

So the DT880 still has its place... and that's even considering that I wouldn't consider owning another DT880 unless I know how to deal with that sibilance the best way.

post #7392 of 10426

Hi Folks,

 

my mid 80's DT880's (Revox 3200)  have started losing a channel after my 1 year old discovered "magic curly cable" (toddler crack a friend called it!)....

 

I have been really happy with these HP's for years - and like the original curly cable, but have no idea where I could souce a replacement cable given their vintage....

 

Any suggestions?

 

thanks

 

David

post #7393 of 10426

Here is where I got the info that there are separate DACs for the headphones and the line outs with the Apogee Duet 2.

 

Ken Rockwell's review of the Apogee:

 

"It has four channels of digital-to-analog converter (DAC) so that the speaker (monitor) outputs and headphone outputs can be playing completely different things at different levels — or running main and subwoofer outputs from software like Pure Music."

 

Another OOPs from Ken?

 

Bob Graham

post #7394 of 10426

I think you are misreading his sentence.

 

The DAC in the Apogee Duet 2 is just a single chip but it can handle 4 separate channels, so that you can play back different things on your headphone/speakers simultaneously, but all of them are still going through the same DAC chip.

 

Someone please correct me on this, but it seems the Duet 2 has the ES9018 DAC chip inside, which can decode 8 separate channels all at once. The implementation in the Duet 2 seems to have muted or disconnected the other 4 channels, but technically the DAC can still decode 4 separate channels all at once.

 

In which case, going through line-out or headphone out is still going through the same DAC chip. There is no "better DAC" in the line-out.

post #7395 of 10426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill-P View Post
 

I think you are misreading his sentence.

 

The DAC in the Apogee Duet 2 is just a single chip but it can handle 4 separate channels, so that you can play back different things on your headphone/speakers simultaneously, but all of them are still going through the same DAC chip.

 

Someone please correct me on this, but it seems the Duet 2 has the ES9018 DAC chip inside, which can decode 8 separate channels all at once. The implementation in the Duet 2 seems to have muted or disconnected the other 4 channels, but technically the DAC can still decode 4 separate channels all at once.

 

In which case, going through line-out or headphone out is still going through the same DAC chip. There is no "better DAC" in the line-out.

 

Sorry. I am distracted by life's wonderful challenges. I am trying to decide between this and the Cambridge DACMagic Plus. These are the two I have narrowed my search down to. I think since the Duet 2 is semi-pro recording quality, and I can later use it for actual recording, then this may be my choice.

 

I wonder if the Cambridge is on par with the Duet? I may have to search head-fi for this answer. I hate to order them both and send one back. But if I have to, I will.

 

Bob Graham

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