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The Beyerdynamic DT880 Discussion thread - Page 394

post #5896 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mshenay View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundsgoodtome View Post

Neutrality and detail you say? I don't want to jump the gun here but I've had my he4 plugged in for... 45mins and that's what they are. Like a baby of a DT880 and HE400, except that treble spike and female-vocal mid dip of the two respectively canceled each other out. The bass has the same impact and depth but less in qty. EQ-ed and this thing can come close to the he400's bass. I feel the soundstage can get wider... I'll have to do the grill mod on this as well but for now I'll work em to 150hrs. Cheers!

I'm interested in getting an HE 4 my self as well, simply due to what I hear about it! 

 

With regrads to he HE 400, it is better than the dt 990, but when your running the HE 400 on sub par gear, like an oDac or an M Stage, it doesn't perform well enough imo to merit the price. So I don't recommened the HE 400 to new members seeing as for the money, the dt 990 performs a lot better with things like the E17 and the oDac more so than the HE 400. Now for some one who has something like a Schiit biFrost or an Audio GD amp, the HE 400 out of that gear is a step ahead of the DT 990

 

 

How ever, I'd really like to try the HE 4. Although I'd kinda want another Toxic Cable and J$ pad for the HE 4 same as what I used for my HE 400 

 

Off topic, but, from what I have read, to make the Hifiman Orthos perform their best, they are run directly off of speaker amp outputs, so they are power hungry.  A Bottlehead Quikie preamp, in front of the amp, has been proven to work very well.  I just question the comfort of the Hifiman products, their weight has been the subject of a lot of discussion.  I really like the fit and comfort of my DT880/DT990, and with my detachable cable options and tube amp I am well satisfied.  They sound nothing like the stock cables, but that is my opinion!

post #5897 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by cute View Post
 

 

Off topic, but, from what I have read, to make the Hifiman Orthos perform their best, they are run directly off of speaker amp outputs, so they are power hungry.  A Bottlehead Quikie preamp, in front of the amp, has been proven to work very well.  I just question the comfort of the Hifiman products, their weight has been the subject of a lot of discussion.  I really like the fit and comfort of my DT880/DT990, and with my detachable cable options and tube amp I am well satisfied.  They sound nothing like the stock cables, but that is my opinion!

Yea they do, I have a NFB 10ES2 which can push about 6w into 32ohms. Not nearly as powerful as a speaker Amp out put, but an awful lot for a headphone amp. I found the NFB 10ES2 drove my balanced HE 400 very nicely, and as far as comfort goes I found them to be more than sufficent with both stock and J$ pads 

post #5898 of 8065

I should be getting my DT880 Pro tonight..   *Starts ripping CDs to FLAC*

post #5899 of 8065

What's up guys.  I have finally decided to order the Woo Audio WA2 amp to go with the DT880s.  I will keep using the Audiolab M-DAC as DAC only.

 

Hopefully it all sounds great together.  I'm sure it will but my audio OCD is kicking in again.  haha  Anyone here have such a combo?

post #5900 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by drewTT View Post
 

Hopefully it all sounds great together.  I'm sure it will but my audio OCD is kicking in again.  haha  Anyone here have such a combo?


If you have over 200 posts on this forum, chances are you have Audio OCD. :L3000: 

post #5901 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundsgoodtome View Post

Have you auditioned the he400? Without eq, most music doesn't have earth shattering bass. Wildly exaggerated highs and lows? Nah. Poorly done tracks maybe or if you demand the bass via EQ.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pp312 View Post


Sounds lke you shouldn't make a move until you've auditioned the 880. More neutrality than the 990? Check. Good detail without wildly exaggerated bass and treble? Check. Solid bass that nevertheless doesn't hit you in the solar plexus every few seconds? Check.

 

I wasn't suggesting the he400 does any of those things, only that the 880 doesn't. No, I haven't heard the 400, but I've owned two 500s and didn't like them at all. One thing I should have added is that the 880 doesn't sit on your head like a brick, which most orthos do. Comfort is certainly as important as sound.

post #5902 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by illyria View Post
 

I should be getting my DT880 Pro tonight..   *Starts ripping CDs to FLAC*

 

Fingers crossed that you find it worth the wait. :smile:

post #5903 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by illyria View Post
 

I should be getting my DT880 Pro tonight..   *Starts ripping CDs to FLAC*

 

Or, how about ripping SACDs to DSF.  :smile:

post #5904 of 8065

Well, that is quite the improvement over my ATH-M30's..  Wow.

 

They're so comfortable, too.   

 

^ Using FiiO E7/E9 combo

 

 

Edit - And iTunes MP3s sound quite.. horrible.

 

Edit edit - I'm hearing so many different things that I had never heard before.  Woah.  


Edited by illyria - 12/19/13 at 11:56pm
post #5905 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by illyria View Post
 

Well, that is quite the improvement over my ATH-M30's..  Wow.

 

They're so comfortable, too.   

 

^ Using FiiO E7/E9 combo

 

 

Edit - And iTunes MP3s sound quite.. horrible.

 

Edit edit - I'm hearing so many different things that I had never heard before.  Woah.  

 

What bitrate are they? I'd imagine 128 kbps AAC would have noticeable artifacts, but 256 kbps AAC is usually quite good. My personal transparency point for non-VBR AAC (like you get from the iTunes Store) is 192 kbps, whereas for Lame MP3 it's V0, which is considerably higher (somewhere around ~250 kbps, IIRC).

post #5906 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by illyria View Post
 

Edit - And iTunes MP3s sound quite.. horrible.

 

Made me smile a bit too.

 

@ illyria - if you get the chance, try testing yourself.  Here : http://www.head-fi.org/t/655879/setting-up-an-abx-test-simple-guide-to-ripping-tagging-transcoding

 

It's a couple of posts I wrote a while ago on how to set up a blind abx.  All the software is free, and all it takes is time.  Whilst there may be a rare few that can tell the difference between aac256 and lossless - most can't (when blind tested).  If you fail - don't worry - it just means you have normal hearing like the rest of us.

 

When doing the test - make sure you use the same mastering (ie take a CD, rip it to lossless, then copy/convert the same lossless file to aac).  Actually knowing your limitations is real power - plus it lets you store a lot more files on your DAP :) 

post #5907 of 8065
Congratulations Brooko on being Featured on the front page.
beerchug.gif
post #5908 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooko View Post
 

 

Made me smile a bit too.

 

@ illyria - if you get the chance, try testing yourself.  Here : http://www.head-fi.org/t/655879/setting-up-an-abx-test-simple-guide-to-ripping-tagging-transcoding

 

It's a couple of posts I wrote a while ago on how to set up a blind abx.  All the software is free, and all it takes is time.  Whilst there may be a rare few that can tell the difference between aac256 and lossless - most can't (when blind tested).  If you fail - don't worry - it just means you have normal hearing like the rest of us.

 

When doing the test - make sure you use the same mastering (ie take a CD, rip it to lossless, then copy/convert the same lossless file to aac).  Actually knowing your limitations is real power - plus it lets you store a lot more files on your DAP :) 

 

I couldn't say any of this better myself. The main reason I tested was because I wanted to see how small I could get my music files. I was getting tired of lugging around my 60 GB iPod, which I was tied to because the flash-based players (e.g. Sansa Clip) have tiny capacities compared to the old HDD-based behemoths of yesteryear, and at the time I was insisting on uncompressed and lossless files. In addition, the iPod UI was very slow with uncompressed/lossless files because the player had to pre-buffer each file every time I skipped or selected a track. It was noticeably faster (and consumed less battery spinning up the disk) when I switched to compressed files.

 

Currently I'm getting by with a 4 GB Clip Zip with a 16 GB microSD card expansion. There's no way I could fit all my music on there if I didn't use some kind of lossy compression.

 

Illyria, if you're hearing some of your files as sounding poor, assuming they're not old 128 kbps ones from the early days of iTunes (or sourced from elsewhere), it's likely that the DT880 is simply showing you flaws in the mastering that you never picked up on before. They're probably not the most merciless headphones out there, but they certainly won't cover up a bad mix/brickwall job.

 

Also, seconded on the congratulations, Brooko. I'm going to read your review right now. :smile:

post #5909 of 8065
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooko View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by illyria View Post
 

Edit - And iTunes MP3s sound quite.. horrible.

 

Made me smile a bit too.

 

 

 

I was going to comment but feared setting off the dreaded 'how well can you hear?' debate. But you know, what really makes me smile is when someone offers an MP3-320 download on one of those sites which shall remain nameless--let's say of some film score recorded in the 50s--and someone asks if it can be re-uploaded in flac! Wow, ignorance ahoy! No accounting for the quality of the original; as long as you download in flac it will sound just fine, whereas if you download in MP3-320 it will sound horrible. There really should be a site for Merry Olde Audio Myths, and if there was here's a few I'd like to start with:

 

1. All integrated amps and receivers have 5c op-amps behind their headphone sockets,

 

2. The more you pay for a headphone amp the better it will sound no matter how easily driven your headphones are,

 

3. If a headphone sounds distinctly dull to you, the fix is probably a very expensive silver cable,

 

4. A $300 headphone cannot possibly sound as good as a $1200 one because that would upset the balance of the headphone universe, not to mention contradict all logic.

 

5. Swapping a more expensive op-amp into a HP amp will automatically result in a huge improvement in sound even if you alter nothing else about the circuit.

 

6. If you don't like a popular headphone, it's almost certainly because your source isn't good enough. And if your source is good enough, it's definitely your amp. And if it's not either of those things, you must have tin ears.

 

Of course, such a list is potentially endless.

post #5910 of 8065

You forgot 7. MOAR POWAH! Now, in the case of headphones that actually need the power in order to reach volume, or else in order to give the amp some headroom so it's not going full blast just to make the headphone audible, this isn't exactly a myth. I would say it's an over-applied maxim.

 

I actually have a hypothesis as to why this is such a widespread, universal belief. As we all know, human hearing is not linear. We have a big presence boost around 3 kHz or so, and our response trails off below 100 Hz and above 10 kHz. However, what a lot of people don't know is that the balance of these three rough areas (corresponding to midrange, bass, and treble, respectively) is not constant. It changes with amplitude. At higher amplitudes, we perceive more bass and treble than we do at lower volumes. This is what the "Loudness" function on stereo receivers and integrated amps does--it simulates this phenomenon at lower listening levels.

 

What I think is happening is people find they can't reach satisfactory volume with their current amp, or when they do it can't quite handle the load and produces distortion and/or clipping, so they upgrade. Now all of a sudden they can reach higher volumes cleanly, so they listen in this amplitude range more often than they did before. Of course, the louder you go, the more bass and treble you get; this corresponds neatly to the usual accounts of "fuller sound" (more bass) and "greater detail" (more treble) associated with an amp upgrade. And once you buy into the idea that the amp is what is causing this, it's easy enough to convince yourself that an even more expensive upgrade will add/has added an additional level of improvement.*

 

Paradoxically, this vindicates somewhat the idea that more power can result in perceptively better sound, but I would amend the statement to "enough power", since all you've done is ensured you have usable performance at higher volumes. The amp didn't improve the balance of its own accord; it just let you reach a level at which your own hearing did that.

 

*Note that none of this takes into account intrinsic signature differences between different amps, since that would be a separate issue entirely.

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