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Senn HD600/650 fans on the HD800 - owners only! - Page 5

post #61 of 87

Re: vcoheda review

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/sen...ml#post5763376

Firstly, thanks for the review.

Maybe this is where I expect too much but I expect an upgrade (which is clearly Sennheiser's intention) and especially a new flagship model to improve markedly in all areas. Even more so given the price premium. While the HD800 is receiving much praise, it's disappointing to read that in a lot of aspects it is only 'slightly' better than its predecessors.
post #62 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by anoobis View Post
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/sen...ml#post5763376

Maybe this is where I expect too much but I expect an upgrade (which is clearly Sennheiser's intention) and especially a new flagship model to improve markedly in all areas. Even more so given the price premium. While the HD800 is receiving much praise, it's disappointing to read that in a lot of aspects it is only 'slightly' better than its predecessors.
Once you hone in on audiophilia, "slightly" takes on a whole new meaning. This may be true for comparisons of anything at the highest level. Among the best of the best, my guess is that the difference is very slight among the top 10. In this rarified atmosphere, connoisseurs expect the differences to be slight, but this slight variation makes all the difference in the world. I guess it's like wine tasting. The average Joe wouldn't be able to detect the nuances among different wines, but the experts would.

Head-fiers are audio connoiseurs, and they discriminate at levels that would be considered minuscule or even ridiculous by non-head-fiers.

Is the HD800 premium worth the "slight" improvement over the HD6XX or other reference cans? We could ask the same question of other types of comparisons. In sports, is the one-point victory in an NBA, MLB, NFL, or NHL final worth the additional millions that was invested? In the 100-meter finals of an Olympic event, is the 1/100th of a second difference between the gold and the silver worth four years of sacrifice and intensive training?
post #63 of 87
^ nice.
Excellent example. As a non-head fier (and as generally quickly satisfied guy), I finally understand the drive. This thread is awesome btw, thanks for those participating.
post #64 of 87
To me, the hd800 lived up to the hype and is worth the money. I have not picked up my hd650 in two weeks and have just been enjoying the music (is that not what this is all about?), whether good or bad recording -- I can hear exactly what is on the CD.

Now, to those who like the hd650 more - go for it! Don't trust anyone else's ears but your own.

Like other's have said, it is easy to have a new headphone completely outpace your old reference if it's that good. Of course my hd650 was my reference until I heard the hd800. It's like going from a ferrari f430 to an enzo. The f430 would be your reference until you tried something greater (unless you did not feel the enzo was 'greater'). Remember to trust your own ears.
post #65 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by feifan View Post
We could ask the same question of other types of comparisons. In sports, is the one-point victory in an NBA, MLB, NFL, or NHL final worth the additional millions that was invested? In the 100-meter finals of an Olympic event, is the 1/100th of a second difference between the gold and the silver worth four years of sacrifice and intensive training?
Impressed! May I take these words to convince those who are still looking for a good reason to get their own HD800s?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianS View Post
Now, to those who like the hd650 more - go for it! Don't trust anyone else's ears but your own.
There will be certain group of head-fiers who perfer to live with HD650s, not just because of the price different. There will be so many of us who will keep both cans in the collection. Your ears will tell you.
post #66 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by pabbi1 View Post
I also agree that the amp will really need to be matched to the hd800 for us to really know what it can do. Again, my pipeline will give me several options over the next 6 months or so, depending on parts, but one new option will be available (again)within a few weeks, so, I still have some questions regarding what is best.
You can't leave it hanging without at least a bit more info on the "options" you consider interesting.

I've been listening to my HD800's since their arrival yesterday on a two board output from my four board β22. I tried a brief listen on a Bijou and a CTH, but went back pretty quick to the β22. So far my impression is that these need a very good solid state drive stage to be at their best. I'm not hearing much in the HD800 that is asking for tube "coloring" of the sound. Right now, I'm wondering what a Stacker or balanced EHHA would do with these. Or finding the parts for a Dynahi. As much as I like blowing money on amp projects, I'm wondering if there is much benefit above my β22 for driving the HD800. So what are you thinking about as likely "options" ?

The strongest positive impression I have of the HD800 so far (6 hours head time) is of their 'stat like clarity and amazing sound stage. The sound stage seems dimensionally larger than any cans I've heard and nearly as crisp as a K1000 (my winner for crisp sound staging). They seem to have a very neutral frequency response and only slightly resemble the HD6xx in that regard. I can't find much of the Senn signature hump anywhere in the lower half of the register although the bass is prominent enough and definitely extends lower than the HD6xx. My early impressions are that the HD800 is asking for plenty of flat, transparent power which equates to solid state IMO. One downside I see in the HD800 already is that less expensive OTL tube amps probably won't be "good enough" to match with the HD800. Chasing the ultimate tube match for these could get really expensive and time consuming. Generally I find revealing dynamic cans to not play well with any tube muddiness and "romantic" coloration and veil.

I'm mulling over taking a knife to the stock cord and balancing it. I was committed to leaving the included cord unmolested and making up a homebrew balanced wire but now I'm not sure I want to wait for connectors to make up a new cable.


Quote:
Originally Posted by smart View Post
There will be certain group of head-fiers who perfer to live with HD650s, not just because of the price different. There will be so many of us who will keep both cans in the collection. Your ears will tell you.
So far, my ears are telling me that my beloved HD650's are going into the closet or more likely onto Ebay. I was trying to hold the line this year on no more dynamic can purchases, but the HD800 hype and the HF2 hype totally broke(pun) my resolve. I rationalized that I wouldn't be increasing my can numbers because I'd sell off the HD650 after a comparison with the HD800 and the HF2 was destined for a deathmatch with my RS1 for residence. My HD650 seems nearly certain to be looking for a new home soon. The upcoming HF2 vs RS1 match is probably going to be a more fair fight.

If you want to happily live with HD650's, I'd recommend not doing any extended listening to HD800's. I haven't heard anything yet that makes the HD650 a useful contrasting can to the HD800. The HD800 is better in all respects and in some aspects is a lot better. I loved my balanced HD650's for the 4 or so years I've had them. I don't see much headtime with them if the HD800 is around though.
post #67 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by vcoheda View Post
is it possible that the HD800 will make other headphones obsolete.
i starting to think that it is not really a matter of preference. the 800 really just seems to be much better than all my other dynamics. i expect they will all be for sale soon (except for the 650).
post #68 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by feifan View Post
Once you hone in on audiophilia, "slightly" takes on a whole new meaning...
That's fair enough. I suppose in the back of my mind, I was also considering 'upgrades' where some aspects improve but others are actually worse. That's a different issue though.
post #69 of 87
bottom line....the 600 / 650 series is never going to equal the 800's no matter what you do to them. The 800 direct from a Marantz cdp5001 will still sound better than a "balanced" set of 600 or 650's running off a great tube amp.....thats just the way it is.
post #70 of 87
I have zero regrets selling the HD-600 and HD-650 in favor of the HD-800. The HD-600 and HD-650 are excellent, wonderful headphones. I had many hours of happy listening to both of them. But neither has that magical transparency that I put up there with neutrality. The HD-600 has the neutrality, but it isn't transparent like a HD-800.

I knew I'd buy one while in HeadRoom's room at CanJam. I was able to switch up between a HD-800 and a HD-650 and the transparency was there. Later, I found the transparency was still there when I borrowed a HD-800 and compared them against my HD-600 and HD-650 on my own rig. Until I heard that, I didn't think the price was worth it.

So, after giving it a couple weeks of thought, I realized that I'd be happier if I sold a bunch of headphones and replaced them with one HD-800. So far, it seems to have worked out that way.

The HD-800 isn't just a subtle improvement over the HD-650. It's large and noticeable because of the transparency. I get that from very few other headphones - the K-1000, HP-2, MDR-SA5000, and DT48 also do it for me. Electrostats are also transparent, so I'm planning to pick up an Omega2 shortly. Those are the headphones I plan to keep in the long run - they give me the most enjoyment. I'm glad Sennheiser developed the HD-800 and glad I ordered one.
post #71 of 87
For people with sensetivity to edge and treble beak are the HD800's a problem?
post #72 of 87
^Mine has changed considerably with burn-in. At first, I thought they were a bit stiff and edgy sounding with emphazis on treble. Hours of burn in with pink noise on high volume made them settle down and soften up a lot.

The HD800 really needs some serious burn in.

Either that, or my hearing is not what it was one week ago
post #73 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by nor_spoon View Post
^Mine has changed considerably with burn-in. At first, I thought they were a bit stiff and edgy sounding with emphazis on treble. Hours of burn in with pink noise on high volume made them settle down and soften up a lot.

The HD800 really needs some serious burn in.

Either that, or my hearing is not what it was one week ago
did you listen to them many hours during this week?Is there a possibility that you damaged your ears because of the peaky treble,so now you think it's softer?

Anyway,when i tried the hd 800 out of the x can v8,it wasn't harsh or sibilant,(i own the hd 600),although it had some hours of burn in because the local dealer had sent this pair to some audio related magazines for testing.
post #74 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by john53 View Post
did you listen to them many hours during this week?Is there a possibility that you damaged your ears because of the peaky treble,so now you think it's softer?
I listen at fairly low volumes (I check with a SPL), so no. It seemed to be the last 5-6 hours when I cranked the volume that I really noticed a big change, NOT listening of course. The SPL meter showed a little over 100dBA, (volume on Zana little less than two o'clock). I listen between 9-10 o'clock usually, which is on the safe side.

[Edit] I would not recommend anyone to do this though, as I do not know how much the drivers are able to handle. I had the same experience with the RS-1 too. It could be my brain getting used to them, or a combination of both, but the change where immediate, and very noticeable.
post #75 of 87
Maybe it's all about burning in.When i go back to athens after the summer,i'm gonna try to audition a second hd 800,but a totally new pair this time,just out of curiosity to see if it's sibilant/harsh.
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