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V-dac modifications - Page 3

post #31 of 196
C147, C151, C51, C47: Non-elco 3900pF (Polypropylene)
C160, C155, C55, C60: Non-elco 22pF (Polyester)
Change to styroflex ones makes the polyester a better one.
Polypropylene are the mkp`s those are good, different brend can make slidely modding the sound.

I got enormous sounds improvements
Changed ne5532 and mc33079p, the surrounding caps:
C147, C151, C51, C47: C160, C155, C55, C60: to styroflex C3-4 to Mpk 3,9uF/400v type
(They dont make small good sounding mkp caps like 63V)
And i didnt changed one of the Elko type Caps

External Powersupply.
Removing those voltage regulators LM317 78** ones.
Casing the powersupply and Dac.

Enjoying the music ;D
post #32 of 196
Thread Starter 
Dutchamps, the local electronic shop which i frequent to buy my parts does not stock the styroflex ones. I am still searching for it. But I am still happy with the polyster as it sound better than the default stock capacitor.

I actually changed the caps around the op amps based on your reports. They do make a difference and I am glad that I got good results with it also. However, you may also want to try modding other capacitors as they do make a difference also.

Is your power supply ready?It will be great if you can show some pics.
post #33 of 196
Im desining the powersupply atm
So not ready yet.
If you like those styroflex types i can order them for you if you want them.
i got paypal to pay the little bil
i think it was about 15€ for those caps in total.
You only need those 22pf in styroflex types?
so it shall be something like 7 € excl postal costs
let me know if you want them.

Some info on those styroflex ones 630 Volt Polystyrene Audiophile Capacitors - on sale

Yes i will change those caps, but i first need to get me new glasses.
I cant read the value of some components loool
post #34 of 196
Thread Starter 
Dutchamps, thanks for the kind offer. I will try to search for it some more else I will get my friend to help me bring it over when he is here next month. thanks you

By the way, how do we differentiate polyester vs Polystyrene ones? My polyester looks the same as the polystyrene ones from the pics shown on the web.
post #35 of 196
polystyrene easy to detect try to burn with a flame a little piece of the cap
If you smell those polystyrene like those tempex boxes where they pack tv sets in the white foam.
Polystyrene is far better in transfering signals
Looks allmost the same but they are realy different.
the ones from siemens have a red band around the boby Means 630V
the ones from siemens have a black band around the boby Means 1000V
I dont use polyester never did and they will not be used in the futher in my devices
post #36 of 196
Thread Starter 
I checked with my local electronics store and the polyster that I thought I was using was actually polystyrene with tolerance of 10%. Strange but the polypropylene caps at C147, C151, C51, C47 actually sounded better than the previous polystyrene caps. The polypropylene has 5% tolerance though compared to polystyrene at 10% tolerance.

Anyway I have already ordered the styroflex that Dutchamps has recommended which have 5% tolerance. I also ordered some simlic II and muse caps to further experiment and tune the vdac sound.

Except for the dc output coupling cap where I will try 47uF Muse (previously was non-Muse), some selected caps will be changed to a 'higher grade' with the same cap values. Hopefully the parts will arrive next week.

Note: I have replaced ELNA Starget 10uF to Nichicon Fine gold 10uF as Fine Gold sound more refined and with better clarity than Starget. For C27, I replaced it with ELNA Simlic of the same value while for C14, I changed it to a higher voltage rating cap.


My updated Modification Lists:
C25 : Nichicon Muse 1000uF 35V
C5,C53,C21,C44,C34,C39: SE 100uF 16V (S.E.66)
C14: Nichicon Muse 47uF 50V [Original 10uF]
C22, C52, C61: ELNA Silmic 100uF 63V
C45 : ELNA Silmic 100uF 63V in parallel with ELNA Cerafine 0.47uF 50V
C3, C4: Nichicon Muse Bipolar 100uF 16V [Original 47uF]
C43, C46: ELNA 1uF 50V
C18, C29, C36, C16, C12, C20, C58 : Nichicon Fine Gold 10uF 50V
C27: ELNA Simlic 10uF 50V
C31, C28: ELNA Cerafine 0.47uF 50V in parallel with original 104M
C30, C32: ELNA Simlic 10uF 50V
C38, C37: Nichicon Muse 47uF 50V [Original 10uF]
IC5:LME49740NA [Original MC33079]
IC7: LME49860NA [Original NE5532]
C147, C151, C51, C47: Non-elco 3900pF (Polypropylene)
C160, C155, C55, C60: Non-elco 22pF (Polystyrene )
LL
post #37 of 196
C160, C155, C55, C60: Non-elco 22pF (Polystyrene ) are good enough
10% or 5% Tolerance doesnt influence the sound transfer state.
Only the capasitor value so leave them there they are very good
post #38 of 196
Keep up with the nice work guys.
I will start my own work on a Benchmark DAC1 next week
post #39 of 196
Thread Starter 
I had actually placed an order 1st before realizing that they are in fact Polystyrene. Since I have already ordered them, no harm trying it out and see if it will be better or not.

Joseph, do report your modding on benchmark. it will be interesting to see how you can mod the already good benchmark to something better.
post #40 of 196
Oh, there are already many things done by others to the Benchmark...
post #41 of 196
Spore:

I must warn you , you made a mistake with C160, C155, C55, C60: 22pF

Those blue originals i still got them are NOT 22pF but 220pF
So if you have the wrong ones the 5532DD will not run good.
Thats why your output caps C3 and C4 is extreem if you need more then 4uF mkp caps.You found that 100uF was better.
If you adjust the error you made and put in the mkp 4uF back im sure those make a hudge difference.

So be short:
Remove the 22pf C160, C155, C55, C60 and replace those to 220pF
Styroflex, if you dont have it right away, test it with the original ones and the mkp 4uF output caps

I have messured the C160, C155, C55, C60 original blue ones with my multymeter (fluke) 2%
post #42 of 196
Thread Starter 
Dutchamps, thanks for warning. I have retained all my original caps just in case I need them again.

I looked at the marking on the original blue caps. It is stated as 220J which should be 22pF as the 3rd digit is the multiplier while J is 5% tolerance. I measured the capacitance using my calibrated fluke 87 multimeter and got around 0.71nF while for my 22pF polythene caps, I got about 0.51nF.

I changed the dc output caps while still having the original blue and green caps. i.e post #16. After changing all elco caps to better ones, I then started to change out the non-elco caps at the op amp side. So my observation still stands.

Looking at the vdac, i tuned the power section, dac section and output section by changing the following caps in my modification list. Even if I got the wrong cap values at C160, C155, C55, C60, I am not too worried about it as the vdac still sounds good. In fact, it sounded better after this round of modification

I still have not receieved my Muse KZ, Simlic II and Polystyrene caps yet and will report back again on once i got them. I think replacing the Simlic to Simlic II and Muse Fine Gold to Muse KZ should have some slight improvement to the tonality and details.

My updated Modification Lists:
C25 : Panasonic FC 1000uF 25V
C21,C44: SE 100uF 16V (S.E.66)
C5,C53,C34,C39: Panasonic FC 100uF 50V
C14: Nichicon Muse FX 47uF 50V [Original 10uF]
C52, C61: Panasonic FC 100uV 50V
C45, C22 : ELNA Silmic 100uF 63V
C3, C4: Nichicon Muse Bipolar 100uF 16V [Original 47uF]
C43, C46: ELNA 1uF 50V
C18, C29, C36, C16, C12, C20, C58 : Nichicon Fine Gold 10uF 50V
C27: ELNA Simlic 10uF 50V
C31, C28, C10: Non-elco 100,000pF (Polypropylene)
C30, C32: ELNA Simlic 10uF 50V
C38, C37: Nichicon Muse FX 47uF 50V [Original 10uF]
IC5:LME49740NA [Original MC33079]
IC7: LME49860NA [Original NE5532]
C147, C151, C51, C47: Non-elco 3900pF (Polypropylene)
C160, C155, C55, C60: Non-elco 22pF (Polystyrene )
C40, C57: Non-elco 100,000pF (Polypropylene)
C2, C1: Non-elco 1,000pF (Polypropylene)
LL
post #43 of 196
Thread Starter 
For those using variable regulators such as LM317T in our vdac, increasing the capacitance values of C2 to 100uf will lower the noise level and increase ripple current rejection.

Refer to website Just one thing about music - when it hits you feel no pain, 'using 3 pin regulator part 1' for the explanation.

Based on the article, I changed C10 to 100uF and got a blacker background with reduced background noise level. Background music is clearer and well defined. More background details can be heard because of the reduced noise level. The background details are previously there but obscured by the noise and cannot be clearly defined and make out. This is a must try modification!

I did not install protection diode D2 for the LM317T as the output voltage of LM317T is about 1.8VDC and I dont think it is necessary. I have been running and switching off the vdac several times without issue. But try it at your own risk

P.S Do not use Low ESR cap for C10.

My updated Modification Lists:
C25 : Panasonic FC 1000uF 25V
C21,C44: SE 100uF 16V (S.E.66)
C5,C53,C34,C39: Panasonic FC 100uF 50V
C14: Nichicon Muse FX 47uF 50V [Original 10uF]
C52, C61: Panasonic FC 100uV 50V
C45, C22 : ELNA Silmic 100uF 63V
C3, C4: Nichicon Muse Bipolar 100uF 16V [Original 47uF]
C43, C46: ELNA 1uF 50V
C18, C29, C36, C16, C12, C20, C58 : Nichicon Fine Gold 10uF 50V
C27: ELNA Simlic 10uF 50V
C31, C28: Non-elco 100,000pF (Polypropylene) [Original 104M]
C10: Cerafine 100uF 25V [Original 104M]
C30, C32: ELNA Simlic 10uF 50V
C38, C37: Nichicon Muse FX 47uF 50V [Original 10uF]
IC5:LME49740NA [Original MC33079]
IC7: LME49860NA [Original NE5532]
C147, C151, C51, C47: Non-elco 3900pF (Polypropylene)
C160, C155, C55, C60: Non-elco 22pF 630V (Polystyrene )
C40, C57: Non-elco 100,000pF (Polypropylene) [Original 104M]
C2, C1: Non-elco 1,000pF (Polypropylene)
LL
post #44 of 196
why do you try to flat more the current, course the regulator is so bad to be able to do it in the first place.
I will try to avoid them by making a powersupply without those.
powersupply isnt ready ..yet
post #45 of 196
Thread Starter 
I have replaced the caps to Silmic II and Nichicon Muse KZ. After burn in for several hours, I played back various songs. Certain tracks sound very good but certain tracks just does not sound right. In the end, I went back to almost the original values for all caps as it seemed to me the original configuration gives the most 'balanced' sound across different types of music.

However I made some changes as follows. For the output dc coupling bipolar capacitor, I have replaced them with normal capacitor with the negative terminal facing the signal output. This gives me more choices for capacitor rather than limited to bipolar ones. So far, after burning in for several hours, there are no damage to the capacitors or the vdac. But as always, try at your own risk.

C25 : Panasonic FC 1000uF 25V
C21,C44: SE 100uF 16V (S.E.66)
C5,C53,C34,C39: Panasonic FC 100uF 50V
C14: ELNA Simlic II 10uF 50V
C52, C61: Panasonic FC 100uV 50V
C45, C22 : ELNA Silmic II 100uF 63V
C3, C4: ELNA Silmic II 10uF 50V parallel with Nichicon Kz 10uF 50V [Original 47uF]
C43, C46: ELNA Simlic II 1uF 50V
C20, C58 : ELNA Simlic II 10uF 50V
C16, C12, C29, C36,C18: Nichicon KZ 10uF 50V
C27: ELNA Simlic II 10uF 50V
C31, C28: Non-elco 100,000pF (Polypropylene) [Original 104M]
C10: Panasonic FC 100uF 50V [Original 104M]
C30, C32: ELNA Simlic II 10uF 50V
C38, C37: Nichicon Muse KZ 10uF 50V
IC5:LME49740NA [Original MC33079]
IC7: LME49860NA [Original NE5532]
C147, C151, C51, C47: Non-elco 3900pF 630V (Polypropylene)
C160, C155, C55, C60: Non-elco 22pF 630V (Polystyrene )
C40, C57: Non-elco 100,000pF (Polypropylene) [Original 104M]
C2, C1: Non-elco 1,000pF (Polypropylene)
C11, C24, C26, C23: Non-elco 100,000pF (Polypropylene) [Original 104M]
C49: Non-elco 1,000pF (Polypropylene) [Original 104M]
LL
LL
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