Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › Denon D5000, D7000 comments
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Denon D5000, D7000 comments

post #1 of 159
Thread Starter 
I've had the Denon D7000 for some time now and I had the Denon D5000 for a while before that. I thought some longer term listening impressions might help somebody who is thinking about these two cans. First I'll post my initial impressions when I got the D7000 and then I'll post my longer term impressions.

Note that the Denon series are my favorite cans up to this point so I'm reviewing from that perspective.

First impressions when I got the D7000 and compared them to the D5000 - I completely and 100% agreed with MarkL's review on Lawton Audio that these cans had a VERY similar sound signature. I found that on many songs I could not tell the difference at all. On tracks with a lot of bass and also on male voices a difference was discernible, but it wasn't huge.

The bass on the D7000 is more focused, whereas the bass on the D5000 is somewhat fat and bled into the lower midrange. This gave vocals on the D5000 more body and a more upfront presentation. In all honesty, I prefered the D5000 and had a decent amount of buyers remorse over the purchase of the D7000 at almost double the cost.

I think the graphs on headphone.com capture this well although the graph in the bass area seems a little off. **Edit on 2/3/2010. Please note that Headroom has remeasured the headphones and changed the graph. So my comment about the graph capturing this bass difference well no longer hold true - at least for me.**



Long term impressions - To try and mitigate the bias of prefering the D5000 just because they were my only can for a long while before I purchased the D7000, I put the D5000 away and listened to the D7000 exclusively for a while. Then I got out the D5000 and did a comparison again.

I'd say the headphones sound 90%(92%?) the same. They are still very close, but I think the differences I talked about are *slightly* more obvious.

Again, these differences aren't easy to pick out on every song.

The D7000 has a focused bass that hits hard and stays out of the midrange a lot more than the D5000. The benefit to this is the midrange is better differentiated and since the midrange has less of a bassy sound to it, it sounds thinner, sometimes clearer, and has a better soundstage. There is a greater sense of space between voices, instruments etc. The disadvantage is that the midrange is thinner and can sound a little distant/recessed in comparison the D5000.

The D5000 has a less focused bass. The mids seem thicker and more upfront. Unlike the D7000, the sonic presentation of the D5000 has less depth. I don't know if this is a pro or a con as that's judgement is specific to the type of mids you like.

So, the question is, which is the better can? I really don't know. Part of the problem is that I don't listen to any really bassy music like rap, hip-hop, or techno. Bassy for me is the Batman Begins/The Dark Knight soundtrack. For me bassy pop is Imogen Heap and bassy jazz is the Cello.

Maybe if I liked really bassy music I'd prefer the D7000 since the bass is more focused. But I like instruments and full voices so I miss the thicker midrange of the D5000. Beyond all that is the simple reality that the D7000 costs more and is the flagship while the D5000 is second in line. So why wouldn't I intuitively feel the D7000 is better? Marketing can perform magic after all.

Bottom line - these headphones are very close. If I had to do it again I'd probably get the D5000 and use the extra money to buy something that had an opposite character (mids focused, tons of soundstage, brighter, airer) so I have two completely different cans as opposed to two cans that sound so similar I'm sure that on many songs I would flunk a blind test. Now I just have to figure out which cans to get rid of.

Now, somebody is going to inevitably look at my sig and say I need to change my source/amp/etc. I did use different equipment to do this comparison, but I won't state what I used because I don't want to play that synergy game as I'm not convinced synergy is really an issue with these cans.

**edit**

Just another point. I listen to headphones at fairly low volumes. This presents another difference between the D5000 and the D7000. Both cans work well at low volumes. But the thicker, more forward midrange of the D5000 means that I don't have to turn up the volume of the D5000 to feel the closeness of the mids. Turning up the volume on the D7000 to brings the mids closer means the bass also becomes louder, which has disadvantages because then the bass becomes more present and I'm not always trying to listen to the bass.

Again, there is not a huge difference between the cans. I'm splitting hairs with the above point.
post #2 of 159
i have the D5000, and I can assure you that synergy is an issue with these cans.

you are running it out of an MP3 player? wow.

if that makes you happy, go with it. But the difference I heard in the D5000 going from a home receiver (Denon) to the Headroom Total Bithead was tremendous. I went from being disappointed in the sound to being overwhelmed and entranced by it.

Going from the Total Bithead to the Purity Caliente? I'll let you imagine...
post #3 of 159
Thanks, odigg.
Very useful.


PS: But these denons are huge overkill for a person who doesn't pursue audio perfection.
post #4 of 159
Quote:
But these denons are huge overkill for a person who doesn't pursue audio perfection.
There's nothing perfect in Denons, so i can't see a condradictions.
post #5 of 159
Hi odigg,
Not sure if or where I ever said the D5000 and D7000 were 95% the same. I did say on our web site that the D7000 offers that last 10% of performance we audiophiles love to chase. So maybe we could extrapolate from that I would be closer to saying they were 90% identical. In any case, that would come closer to reflecting my true feelings about them, to the degree these kinds of subjective things can even be graded in this way. Cheers.
post #6 of 159
Quote:
Originally Posted by QQQ View Post
There's nothing perfect in Denons, so i can't see a condradictions.
Nor is there in any other Headphone in existence...
post #7 of 159
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by markl View Post
Hi odigg,
Not sure if or where I ever said the D5000 and D7000 were 95% the same. I did say on our web site that the D7000 offers that last 10% of performance we audiophiles love to chase. So maybe we could extrapolate from that I would be closer to saying they were 90% identical. In any case, that would come closer to reflecting my true feelings about them, to the degree these kinds of subjective things can even be graded in this way. Cheers.
Sorry about the misread. I read your review a long time ago and only skimmed through it this morning before I posted my comments. I'll edit my original post so nobody misquotes you by what I've said.
post #8 of 159
I've never tried the 5000's, but I'm a big fan of the 7000's, and for that matter, the 2000's.

I just love the sound.

But I'm posting this for another reason. Yesterday I was recording some narration tracks for a web presentation, and it took a lot longer than expected. In all, I was wearing the 7000's from 12:30pm to 6:30pm...with just a few quick breaks.

Never felt them.

Perfect comfort.

I had never had them on for such a long strech. And man, they performed.

And OP...thank you for taking the time to give us your thoughts. I appreciate it.
post #9 of 159
Thanks, odigg. Very useful for me too.
post #10 of 159
Very interesting post for someone considering the 5000/7000 as my next set. Does anyone who listens to more bass-heavy music have an opinion (bass would be the main reason I'd consider the 5000/7000 over the 650's I have now)?
post #11 of 159
Quote:
Originally Posted by AtomikPi View Post
Very interesting post for someone considering the 5000/7000 as my next set. Does anyone who listens to more bass-heavy music have an opinion (bass would be the main reason I'd consider the 5000/7000 over the 650's I have now)?
I can't speak to the 650's. But I have the 7000's and they're amazing for bass.

I like a lot of bass hit, and I like it to go low enough that I can feel and hear the subwoofer hits some artists use...yes, the 7000's go down, down, down and yet, they stay musical.

It's tight and fat bass, not big boomy bass like you find on some headphones.

My bass reference songs include 'Underneath it All' by No Doubt, 'Just The Way I Am" by Ingrid Michaelson, and even "Cha Cha Cha,' the remake by James Taylor. And for that deep sub hit, try 'Sk8r Boi' by Avril Lavigne...just before she sings the first words there's this ultra-low sub hit.

On the 7000's, all this music is magical.
post #12 of 159
A hollow midrange is what I fear the most about the D7000 along with distant vocals. I've heard mixed reports about this and there's no opportunity to test it locally here so it's quite problematic really.
post #13 of 159
I am right now listening to my D7000 powered by the Amphora SE hooked up to my Emm Labs CDSA SE via Crystal Cable Reference Interconnects.

No, there is no hollow mids, no distant vocals. [ SACD "Tony Bennett & k.d. Lang" <a wonderful world>]. Yes, both the D7000 and the Amphora SE are new (less than 100 hours) but I am so far quite pleased with what I hear. It is too early to say anything definite at this stage.

I personally do not like "in my face" presentation too much. Still the D7000 is intimate enough for me to feel the singers.

F. Lo
post #14 of 159
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by K3cT View Post
A hollow midrange is what I fear the most about the D7000 along with distant vocals. I've heard mixed reports about this and there's no opportunity to test it locally here so it's quite problematic really.
I've heard the Denons through everything ranging from a Sansa Clip to much more expensive ($1k+) tube and SS amps. The D7000 has a slightly thinner midrange than the D5000, but the difference is pretty minor.

I've never heard the D7000 vocals sound distant in the sense that people talk about on this board. However, such an evaluation depends a lot on what your reference can is. If you are comparing the D7000 to the AD2000 then yes, the D7000 vocals will sound distant with a slightly hollow sound.

Of course, the AD2000 is the most forward sounding headphone I've heard in my life!
post #15 of 159
Quote:
Originally Posted by odigg View Post
I've had the Denon D7000 for some time now and I had the Denon D5000 for a while before that. I thought some longer term listening impressions might help somebody who is thinking about these two cans. First I'll post my initial impressions when I got the D7000 and then I'll post my longer term impressions.

Note that the Denon series are my favorite cans up to this point so I'm reviewing from that perspective.

First impressions when I got the D7000 and compared them to the D5000 - I completely and 100% agreed with MarkL's review on Lawton Audio that these cans had a VERY similar sound signature. I found that on many songs I could not tell the difference at all. On tracks with a lot of bass and also on male voices a difference was discernible, but it wasn't huge.

The bass on the D7000 is more focused, whereas the bass on the D5000 is somewhat fat and bled into the lower midrange. This gave vocals on the D5000 more body and a more upfront presentation. In all honesty, I prefered the D5000 and had a decent amount of buyers remorse over the purchase of the D7000 at almost double the cost.

I think the graphs on headphone capture this well although the graph in the bass area seems a little off.



Long term impressions - To try and mitigate the bias of prefering the D5000 just because they were my only can for a long while before I purchased the D7000, I put the D5000 away and listened to the D7000 exclusively for a while. Then I got out the D5000 and did a comparison again.

I'd say the headphones sound 90%(92%?) the same. They are still very close, but I think the differences I talked about are *slightly* more obvious.

Again, these differences aren't easy to pick out on every song.

<<<SNIP SNIP>>>
Thanx a ton! You did something unheard of here. You bought something that cost more and said, it's not worth the extra coin. That's what I read. This is never done here. You would have a ball buying Grado's I think, trying to figure out which of therm sound different!

I have D5000s and love them. But I've been trying to figure out whether I should sell and "upgrade" to the D7000s. You helped me answer the question. The D5000s seem to be the sweet spot in the Denon line.

Thanx for the honest appraisal!


.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Headphones (full-size)
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › Denon D5000, D7000 comments