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Are Martin Logans underpowered by SET amps? - Page 2

post #16 of 30
4/13/09 at 6:40pm
Logans tend to be tough on amps. Most Electrostatic speakers are difficult loads and therefore unsuitable for low power SET amplifiers. In the 90's I had a set of CLS-IIz along with a set of Kinergetics SW-800's (The mini-Statement system) and I tried running it with a Krell KSA-300 on the SW-800's and several different Push Pull tube amps driving the CLSes above 80Hz (CJ MV 75, Sonic Frontiers Power Two) and none of them excelled at the job. What ultimately worked was using a Krell FPB-600 to drive the CLS-IIz's, it was magical! The Krell on the SW-800's was overkill, I ended up driving the SW-800's with a pair of B&K Mono-Blocks. That system absolutely KILLED!

For the life of me I can't remember why I sold it. It was fantastic.
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post #17 of 30
4/13/09 at 7:05pm
Stats need power.. nuff said.
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post #18 of 30
4/13/09 at 8:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeymad View Post
That is a pretty good idea Spareribs.. (congrats on the 2000 posts)....

I read a review once.. can't seem to find it right now... about a 'step up amp' or a 'booster amp', from one of the major producers.. I can't even remember that ... dang...

But anyway it was a SS amp (mono) that you placed in-line with your flee power amp. So it would go from the SET amp to the SS amp to the Speakers. The SS amp was just there to boost the power to be able to get the Tube sound, but have enough power to push the low efficiency speakers. The review was pretty good, the booster amp was very neutral so most of the Tube sounds was there.

Cheers,
That would be this...
MUSICDIRECT - MUSICAL FIDELITY - 550K SUPERCHARGER (EA)

They did get some really good reviews, but I'm not sure how well they're selling, as every place that sells them (that I know of, at least) has cut the price in half over the last few months.
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post #19 of 30
4/14/09 at 1:53am
good job earwicker7... must be them.. reviewed by Michael....

At the price I would not mind giving them a try pushing my B&W 802's with my WA5 with a pair in between (with return policy in hand)

Cheers,
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post #20 of 30
4/15/09 at 12:10pm
I've owned two ML speakers, the CLSIIz and the Vantage, and while the newer hybrids are easier to drive I would not recommend anything under 75-100 watts of well-regulated tube power. My Vantages functioned with a Cary SLi-80 but they only really came alive with more powerful amplification (CJ, McIntosh, ARC). If you're looking to go the tube pre/ SS power route, you might look at the Quad 909, which is cheap and terrific with the Logan ESLs.

best,

o
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post #21 of 30
4/16/09 at 3:00pm
Thread Starter 

Rogue monos

How about these?

ROGUE MONO BLOCKS - Canuck Audio Mart

From the looks, it is the M-120 older model.
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post #22 of 30
4/17/09 at 12:59am
Thread Starter 

rotel / adcom

I'm actually thinking about re-arranging my setup.... I've put my speakers and amp for sale. I really want to go into the SS / Estats route, since I really like the sound of my open baffles but would definately like a more stable sound. Open baffles are so picky with placements that it takes me 15 minutes at the beginning of every listening session to set my head position (since they are in corners, and have to be place in front of wardrobes, I move them about twice a day), and the tubes also need extra care...

I'm also thinking about putting more budget on the speakers this time : my amp is worth 4500CDN new, and my speakers around 900... With a cheaper but more powerful amplifier I could have a lot more options for speakers, including MLs, and could use the spare cash to get some good quality ones (Clarity, Ascent).

As for the amp, I've seen a rotel rb-1050 for 250$, Adcom 5400 for 300$, Carver M500t for 450$, Tandberg TPA-3006A for 350$, all in canadian dollars. Man, I'm excited! Just need to sell those amp and speakers...

Which one of these would be best suited for powering a pair of ascents?
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post #23 of 30
4/23/09 at 3:46pm
I've had good luck with Rotel or B & K monoblocks. The monoblocks let you run a minimum of speaker wire. Cheaper to bi-wire this way and you do want to bi-wire. Get 200w, 8 ohm to make them sing. My Rotels sit behind the panels and on top of the woofer boxes.

I've blown 100w Carver amps with MLs and only got so-so results with a 50w NAD. You'll also want to get a music sub to integrate a seemless low end impact. A sub designed for HT usually overtakes the stat sound.
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post #24 of 30
4/23/09 at 10:38pm
Thread Starter 

less wire

Actually, my wire setup is less than optimal : my speakers stand on both sides of a door, and my parents don't want to hear about wires just being on the ground, so I have to add about 10 feet of wire on both speakers so that I can hook it by the ceiling:

(this is with my precious speakers, monitor audio rs-5).

I just pulled the trigger on the ADCOM, and should be able to pick it up by tomorrow. If I find it not powerful enough (although, I listen to music with volumes set at very low levels, I just hate when I lose detail and texture, even for dynamics), I will try to get something else for by-wiring. Again, the ADCOM is 125W into 8ohms and 200W into 4 ohms.
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post #25 of 30
4/23/09 at 10:46pm
Thread Starter 

15'x12'x9'

By the way, which models would be good and which ones would be overkill for the size of my room? Is it 15' long, 12' wide, 9' ceiling with two virtual spaces behind the speakers (so I don't have to put the really far from the back wall, there is an additional 3' at the back of the speakers before the concrete wall), as you can see in the picture.

I'm thinking about ascent more specifically.
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post #26 of 30
4/24/09 at 12:40am
I'd stay away from MLs for that room. Placement and reflection is important and your room will make them sound hard and diffused. Stats are not good nearfield speakers.
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post #27 of 30
4/24/09 at 1:06am
Need power? Get a cheap pro audio amp like I did. 300wpc @ 4ohm goodness.
They do a good job with my maggies.
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post #28 of 30
4/24/09 at 1:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Camper View Post
I'd stay away from MLs for that room. Placement and reflection is important and your room will make them sound hard and diffused. Stats are not good nearfield speakers.
What do you suggest for nearfield listening?
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post #29 of 30
4/24/09 at 2:04am
I'd step out of that recommendation as I don't have experience with that type speaker.

I know trying to listen to stats that aren't set up per ML's recommended method just don't sound right. Two feet off the rear and side walls.
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post #30 of 30
4/24/09 at 2:40pm
Thread Starter 

not nearfield

Actually, there is a 5' space between the speakers and the concrete wall (at the back), and about 2' at the sides. Would that still be not enough for MLs?
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