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Long awaited Smyth SVS Realiser NOW AVAILABLE FOR PURCHASE - Page 166

post #2476 of 2687
I will add that, in the end, if it doesn't matter what you record in the PRIR above 20kHz but you just want to get the anti-aliasing ( A/D stage ) and reconstruction (D/A stage) brickwall filters well outside the audio range, then the 4 points I list above are moot points. In that case, yes, let's just ask for 192kHz PRIRs and have the convolution process be performed at native sample rate...

For the reasons mentionned by Daryl such as horsepower and latency, I can imagine smyh guys pulling their hairs on this though wink.gif. I was surprised once when the realiser came out so, I expect to be surprised again though smily_headphones1.gif.
post #2477 of 2687

I would like to see segmentation.
 

For instance, an stereo version, digital i/o only. They keep their revenue with the multichannel product and create another niche.
 

I guess they fear that stereo processing is not so compelling.
 

On the other hand, multichannel content usually go along with video, that increase the 3D perception, mainly the in front localization.

 

Nevertheless, I can’t buy the A8, considering its price and importation taxes.
 

But I would buy a USD500 stereo unit (without headphones and amplifier), even if the in front localization is not perfect.
 

At such price level, chances are that your potential costumer does not have experience to understand the requirements for best perception.
 

So I guess in their view, it is better to keep it restricted to a very few experienced and satisfied costumers than frustrating a vast public.
I thought Yamaha would license their algorithm to do such stereo unit, but I guess they also fear losing hi-fi equipment sales.
 

I am just resigned it will not happen any time soon...
 


Edited by jgazal - 9/4/13 at 4:55pm
post #2478 of 2687

Well I guess DTS Headphone-X is coming to consumers, so why try to compete on a "generic-prir" market, with the little resources Smyth seems to have (atleast I get that impression, small niche market, few employees, zero marketing)? And there's already Dolby Headphone etc if you really don't care about quality. Either go full-on or go home. :D

 

For 500USD you can build a massive PC anyway and use heaps of hrtf and crossfeed stuff etc. Even the PRIR's that people have shared.

 

Or if you reaally need a "box", you could try DSpeaker Headspeaker. Well the hardware is what it is, youget what you pay..


Edited by hekeli - 9/5/13 at 12:37am
post #2479 of 2687
Those are completely different products though. There are plenty of options for simulating surround sound on headphones using surround sources like movies and games, but for re-creating two-channel music through headphones that sounds like it's coming from speakers, the Smyth Realiser is pretty much the only game in town.
post #2480 of 2687
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post

Well I guess DTS Headphone-X is coming to consumers, so why try to compete on a "generic-prir" market, with the little resources Smyth seems to have (atleast I get that impression, small niche market, few employees, zero marketing)? And there's already Dolby Headphone etc if you really don't care about quality. Either go full-on or go home. " src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies/biggrin.gif" />



 



For 500USD you can build a massive PC anyway and use heaps of hrtf and crossfeed stuff etc. Even the PRIR's that people have shared.



 



Or if you reaally need a "box", you could try DSpeaker Headspeaker. Well the hardware is what it is, youget what you pay..


 



I would like idiosyncratic HRTF with head tracking. The products you have mentioned have a generic HRTF.

Well, what would be cool is a 3D scanner so you do not need to measure your own HRTF with microphones. But then one would need to scientifically understand how the characteristics of body, skin, fat percentage bone structure and even hair influence the volume of different frequencies. Then you could just upload generic room measurements and voilà!

Smyth Research could release an A8S with a 3d scanner for USD4000 and then sell the A8 for USD500. :-)
post #2481 of 2687
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueangel2323 View Post

Those are completely different products though. There are plenty of options for simulating surround sound on headphones using surround sources like movies and games, but for re-creating two-channel music through headphones that sounds like it's coming from speakers, the Smyth Realiser is pretty much the only game in town.

 

Crossfeed? There's also a large thread on Head-Fi about custom using Dolby Headphone for listening.

 

But let's face it, the mics alone were quoted to be worth 200USD or so. A stereo version would also probably need most if not all electronics that are already in the full version. How are you going to make any sensible profit from designing and supporting a new unit for 500USD that would sell most likely even more marginally? I'd rather see a new improved unit selling for ~2000USD or so. Though i'd hate to see my old version go worthless..


Edited by hekeli - 9/5/13 at 10:12pm
post #2482 of 2687

I have been drooling for one ever since they came out.

Playing call of duty with them was a memorable experience.

Only thing holding me back is the price.

post #2483 of 2687

Hello,

 

I need the HDMI configuration for an Oppo 93EU, I'm not able to setup the system with me Realiser. Any Help?

 

Regards

 

Renato

post #2484 of 2687
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post
 

 

Crossfeed? There's also a large thread on Head-Fi about custom using Dolby Headphone for listening.

 

But let's face it, the mics alone were quoted to be worth 200USD or so. A stereo version would also probably need most if not all electronics that are already in the full version. How are you going to make any sensible profit from designing and supporting a new unit for 500USD that would sell most likely even more marginally? I'd rather see a new improved unit selling for ~2000USD or so. Though i'd hate to see my old version go worthless..

 

Please tell me where Smyth Research source the A8 microphone.


The value is not in the circuit/chips, but in the code/algorithm.


Are you based on a market research predicting it will sell more marginally or it just your intuition?


How many units worldwide do you think Pioneer sells of a product like a SE-DIR800C (http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Portable/Headphones/SE-DIR800C) or Sony of a MDR-DS6500 (http://store.sony.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921666290086)?


One would have to ask why Pioneer or Sony license Dolby code rather than the SVS code. And I bet it is not the cost of implementation (the hardware cost, microphones, chips etc.) or the royalties Smyth Research wants. Or people just want plug and play surround or the SVS technology is so compelling that they are afraid loosing home theater equipment sales, which seems silly for a get together entertainment.


Anyway, I would pay more than USD500 for a personal license to use SVS code even if it’s confined to a hardware unit.


Edited by jgazal - 9/6/13 at 4:15pm
post #2485 of 2687

I'm not really sure where we are getting at. There's no secret in what the "code" behind SVS is - it's basic convolution processing. They just packaged it very nicely and effectively.

 

Pioneer/Sony/Dolby etc are brands selling at every corner store. It's just my opinion, being realist, for me it's simple - I really doubt there's any mass market appeal in something that requires inserting microphones in your ears, requiring speakers and other technical holahoops that come with it. Imagine also the hassle for user support etc. And we already know that most people do not care that much about sound quality - nevermind specifically wanting a speaker soundstage if they happen to be using headphones. Even most audiophiles are not looking for it (judging from this forum), they just like to spend the $3k on amps and dacs.

 

I just don't see a reason for half-assed cheap implementation - you could go generic HRTF then which is everywhere. A8 is targeted for 100% emulation of a certain system and that niche is willing to pay for it. Most likely Yamaha came to the same conclusion or something. :D


Edited by hekeli - 9/6/13 at 4:54pm
post #2486 of 2687
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post
 

I just don't see a reason for half-assed cheap implementation - you could go generic HRTF then which is everywhere. A8 is targeted for 100% emulation of a certain system and that niche is willing to pay for it. Most likely Yamaha came to the same conclusion or something. :D

 

Someone should tell DTS that no one is going to care about Headphone X.

post #2487 of 2687
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post
 

I'm not really sure where we are getting at. There's no secret in what the "code" behind SVS is - it's basic convolution processing. They just packaged it very nicely and effectively.

 

Pioneer/Sony/Dolby etc are brands selling at every corner store. It's just my opinion, being realist, for me it's simple - I really doubt there's any mass market appeal in something that requires inserting microphones in your ears, requiring speakers and other technical holahoops that come with it. Imagine also the hassle for user support etc. And we already know that most people do not care that much about sound quality - nevermind specifically wanting a speaker soundstage if they happen to be using headphones. Even most audiophiles are not looking for it (judging from this forum), they just like to spend the $3k on amps and dacs.

 

I just don't see a reason for half-assed cheap implementation - you could go generic HRTF then which is everywhere. A8 is targeted for 100% emulation of a certain system and that niche is willing to pay for it. Most likely Yamaha came to the same conclusion or something. :D

 

 

Now I see your point and could not agree more with you. Hassle free surround for mass market that, well, does not care for sound quality. And emunation to a niche willing to spend the time for HRTF personalization and willing to pay the premium price.

 

It's just sad that I cannot afford the premium price. :(  Yet. :bigsmile_face:

 

Rectifying what I said, I am resigned that the “handicapped” stereo unit won’t happen any time soon... :biggrin:

post #2488 of 2687

Here is an interesting research about acquiring individualized HRTF without acoustic measurement with a 3D scanner. The model is based on only in the geometrical shape of head and pinna. Not a trivial task tough...

 

http://resource.isvr.soton.ac.uk/FDAG/VAP/pdf/nmh_ppt.pdf

post #2489 of 2687
Quote:
Originally Posted by darinf View Post
 

 

Someone should tell DTS that no one is going to care about Headphone X.

 

Not sure if this was sarcasm or what? Atleast they are going to make profiles for headphones etc, so I guess atleast it might be a bit better than Dolby etc. But marking it as mobile is pretty wacky IMO..

 

Atleast DSpeaker Headspeaker has it right providing heaps of different HRTF profiles so you can atleast try to match a decend pair of ears. I don't get why this is so hard for everyone else to provide. They just go the easy route with a single "proven" profile that still doesn't work for many people.

post #2490 of 2687
For those that are interested:
http://www.burningamp.org/2013/09/presentations-burning-amp-2013/

Jan Didden, Linear Audio, Elektor, and audioXpress magazines:
“The Smyth Realizer, Convincing Headphone Audio At Last? “

A presentation and demo on the Smyth Realiser will be an integral part of the diyaudio groups meeting this fall. If anyone attends I'd love to hear about it.
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