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Long awaited Smyth SVS Realiser NOW AVAILABLE FOR PURCHASE - Page 150

post #2236 of 2628
Quote:
Originally Posted by darinf View Post


Aston,

 

If you download a copy of the A8 manual from the Smyth website, check the "Delay" section on page 56 of the manual and page 57 about "Proximity".

 

Here's what Lorr wrote about the subject:

 

 

That doesn't seem to make sense to me because you could certainly be measuring a room where all the speakers are not equidistant from your listening position. I always thought that the Realiser would replicate the exact distance of each speaker, but apparently not.

 

Fortunately you can adjust the distance of each speaker by adjusting the Delay on each channel independently on each preset. I have not tried it, but in theory you could "move" the speakers to match closer to your room size.

 

I need to correct the information I posted before. I was actually mistaken about when the Realiser adjusts the delays to put all the speakers equidistant from the listening/measurement position. I had quoted Lorr out of context too.

 

Here's what Lorr had to say about it:

 

Quote:
The Realiser measures and re-creates whatever it finds regarding level and delay with no changes whatever.  This is quite necessary since many setups do not intend for distances to be equal, for example movie theatres and dubbing stages.  If equidistance is intended, it should be verified and corrected physically before the measurement, or level and delay can be manually adjusted afterwards.

The only time the Realiser normalizes the delays and levels is when you are assembling a multichannel virtual system from two speakers.  In this case it is often necessary, having turned around, to move closer to the surrounds and/or side speakers in order to get the angles correct.  Here the Realiser assumes that the intention is for equidistance in the virtual world so the Realiser makes that adjustment.  It is essential to get the angles correct for the correct pinna filters, which cannot be corrected, whereas level and delay can be normalized.

That all makes a lot more sense to me now. Sorry about the misinformation before.

post #2237 of 2628
Quote:

 

It's a shame SACD's and other multichannel is pretty much done for.

 

Hopefully Blu-Ray will pick up more multichannel music.  I know AIX Records does a few.

I keep thinking that SACD and multichannel are done for, but then, fortunately, I discover more and more material produced by boutique recording companies, such as AIX, 2L, Pentatone, etc.  True, there is not as much material out there as one would like.  But there is still quite a bit of great music to listen to.  I am listening to the emulation of an Acoustic Zen Crescendo 5.1 system mostly, via the Realiser and STAX 407s.  The experience is terrific.

post #2238 of 2628
I'm curious if anyone has tried stax sr-001, 002, 003 or even the new 003 mark II with the Realiser. Over at the dedicated thread, some initial impressions are that the SQ of the sr-003 mark II approaches that of the sr-009! At a fraction of the price and with custom molds for added comfort and a good fit, the 003 mark II sound good in theory but in practice?

My main use is for watching movies. Would 003 mark II work for this, along with a Crowson or an Earthquake for deep bass?
post #2239 of 2628

Every time I see this thread I wonder how well the realizer would work with a pair of Stax in Call of Duty.

 

Best gaming headset ever?

 

I want one just for that reason. 

post #2240 of 2628
Quote:
Originally Posted by darinf View Post


Hi Statfi,

 

I think what you really want are well made binaural recordings. This would recreate the sound of the actual venue where the performance was recorded and be reproduced very accurately on your Stax 009's.  No speakers can do that as well as a high end pair of headphones.

 

....

To me, headphone listening on well recorded music can deliver detail and accuracy, but it can't even come close to reproducing the sound that one would have heard if you were listening to the performance live. Why? Because the imaging on headphones with standard stereo recordings stays completely within my head between my ears. To me, the is very unnatural sounding. Sure you can hear lots of detail and great speed and frequency response, but the sound is all in my head. (I don't really understand when people talk about how well a pair of headphones images. I guess it works for some people.)

 

So, with speakers, at least you can get the sound coming from in front of you rather than in your head. To me, that sounds closer to a live performance. Sure, it's not perfect, but on a very high end system set up well in a great room, the sound can seem much more like a live performance than headphones could ever give me.

 

The Realiser when done properly will VERY accurately reproduce the sound of a speaker system and room. It's not "matching" anything or synthesizing anything. It's taking the measured speaker sound and room acoustics and applying that to the sound source. So, with a good measurement and a pair of Stax 009, you would probably find it hard to tell the difference between sound being played back from the speakers vs. the sound from the Realiser and headphones. "What You Heard is What You Get" in terms of sound. (except for bass energy)

 

So, if you don't like the sound of the speakers measured, then you won't like it through the Realiser either since they will be the same. However, if you think the Wilson Alexandria XLF's come close to the sound you're looking for, then you can measure a pair of XLF's and then you would "have" the sound of the XLF's without buying a pair. (At $250,000 a pair though, the owner/store may charge you a lot to "steal" the sound of their speakers!)

 

If you are so satisfied with the sound from your Stax, then why any interest in the Realiser? I think even for people who love headphone listening, after hearing the Realiser, they are really interested in getting the sound out of their head and out in front of them.

 

For me I never really liked headphone listening, but loved the convenience and flexibility of headphones. The Realiser has given me the best of both worlds.

Darin,

 

Thanks for the response!

 

Yeah.  I have not played with binaural much but it seems promising.  Part of my barrier is that *I think* pretty much all binaural is available only digitally, and I'm an old analogphile.  I am planning to get a reasonable digital rig, but haven't gotten there.  I had fun at RMAF 2012 listening to a lot of wonderful stuff, but, while there were a few LPs in that digital desert, getting home to my turntable was still very nice.  

 

Does the Realizer get the sound "out of your head"?  I would like that, even though it is not an obsession.  "Sound in my head" is one of the aspects of disbelief I have learned to suspend with some success.

 

Statfi

post #2241 of 2628

They had COD with a 303 and the Realizer at CanJam'09 and it was amazing. I got to play a little. Really liked it.

post #2242 of 2628
Quote:
Originally Posted by statfi View Post

 

Does the Realizer get the sound "out of your head"?  I would like that, even though it is not an obsession.

 

Statfi

 

Yes. That's the amazing thing about it.

post #2243 of 2628
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aston View Post

I'm curious if anyone has tried stax sr-001, 002, 003 or even the new 003 mark II with the Realiser. Over at the dedicated thread, some initial impressions are that the SQ of the sr-003 mark II approaches that of the sr-009! At a fraction of the price and with custom molds for added comfort and a good fit, the 003 mark II sound good in theory but in practice?

My main use is for watching movies. Would 003 mark II work for this, along with a Crowson or an Earthquake for deep bass?

 

I purchased the 003mk II's and recently sent them back after they didn't work well for me.  IMO totally different league vs the 009's or 007's.  The mids were far better than other small headphones I've used (IE's or small driver over the ears), bass was sufficient, well integrated sound.  But the lack of extension and definition upper mids through top (HF roll-off) threw me..  they were far enough off for me that I didn't hook them up and calibrate them to the realiser but would have been a fun experiment.  I've not read that thread (although curious to read impressions now). 

post #2244 of 2628
Thank you for sharing your impressions. I've been contemplating using those instead of full headphones for four reasons. 1/ Stax SQ which apparently Smyth Research recommends (still haven't found any official list of most appropriate headphones from them); 2/ Less expensive than other Stax (especially when considering the 003s don't seem to scale hence no need to max out the amp plus I need a 2-person setup); 3/ Light no-sweat option that can still be complemented with a head band for IR tracker positioning (if desired - some do without and are happy) or with earmuffs (one reviewer uses http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00009LI4K/ref=redir_mdp_mobile?qid=1267408131&ref_=sr_1_1&s=hi&sr=1-1) if better isolation is sometimes needed; 4/ Some reports they are more bassy than regular Stax phones, which would be ideal in my case as I will be using the A8 primarily for movies.

I understand they do not seem to fit all equally well unfortunately but one reviewer has indicated much better comfort (and perhaps sound, can't remember) with custom molds...
post #2245 of 2628
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverlight View Post

I purchased the 003mk II's and recently sent them back after they didn't work well for me.

BTW which retailer did you use that let you return them? Did you get a full refund?
post #2246 of 2628
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aston View Post

Thank you for sharing your impressions. I've been contemplating using those instead of full headphones for four reasons. 1/ Stax SQ which apparently Smyth Research recommends (still haven't found any official list of most appropriate headphones from them); 2/ Less expensive than other Stax (especially when considering the 003s don't seem to scale hence no need to max out the amp plus I need a 2-person setup); 3/ Light no-sweat option that can still be complemented with a head band for IR tracker positioning (if desired - some do without and are happy) or with earmuffs (one reviewer uses http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00009LI4K/ref=redir_mdp_mobile?qid=1267408131&ref_=sr_1_1&s=hi&sr=1-1) if better isolation is sometimes needed; 4/ Some reports they are more bassy than regular Stax phones, which would be ideal in my case as I will be using the A8 primarily for movies.

I understand they do not seem to fit all equally well unfortunately but one reviewer has indicated much better comfort (and perhaps sound, can't remember) with custom molds...


I think custom molds / tips would be a great call with these headphones to really dial in the comfort and SQ.  I thought about trying a few others from my non-custom IEM's but the end is a little larger than IEM's (oval shape) and wasn't sure they'd fit, but a good call to experiment.  Could also be that my ear shape / fit was driving the response curve in the upper mids / highs.  I worked with Staxusa.com / Yama.  I really like them, very good to work with and of course real experts on Stax gear (fun chatting w them about vintage Stax gear).

post #2247 of 2628
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverlight View Post

I worked with Staxusa.com / Yama.  I really like them, very good to work with and of course real experts on Stax gear
Did you work with them in person at their LA location, or through a mail service? I didn't know they took returns. Did they charge a restocking fee?

Thank you!
post #2248 of 2628
Quote:
They had COD with a 303 and the Realizer at CanJam'09 and it was amazing. I got to play a little. Really liked it.

 

The proper response would have been "no Spaceace the realiser is just awful with video games. You can safely forget this expensive bit of gear. You don't want it and it really isn't worth it..." wink_face.gif

 

Sigh... I'll get one eventually. I do wish they had something other than HDMI or RCA in though. Its more complicated and probably expensive to do that right on a computer. TOSLINK would be nice. 



(Explanation of expensive/complicated)

My instinct is to use HDMI instead of messing with RCA so that I have minimal decoding going on inside the EMI hell we know as a computer. This means that I need to use an HDMI video card output. We're looking at the very begining of an explosion in resolution on monitors and HDMI is not keeping up with display port as of today so it might not even appear on high end cards in a few years(we'll see how the spec evolves)... its not on the Nvidia GTX 690 at all or on the Eyefinity specific cards from ATI right now. Barring that I fear strange driver issues especially if I'm already running triple screen.  

So... say for whatever reason HDMI is not available then I'm stuck with buying lots of good RCA cables which are expensive or lots of good 1/8 -> RCA cables which are rare AND expensive. 

 

Come to think about it why am I complaining about cables? This is an absurdly expensive way to make a gaming headset anyway. I imagine It's probably also the only way to do it really well. I need to retry Dolby headphone now that I have a decent Stax system... It didn't work very well on my amp'd 650's.

post #2249 of 2628

There's no reason why your main graphics card should have HDMI. You can find bazillion old cards for $10 which have HDMI, that's what I do (ATI HD4300). Also Displayport usually has HDMI compatibility/adapters anyway (though might require special adapters for audio to work).

 

A separate card might actually even work better than trying to mess with double/triple screen settings on the main one (as we all know, HDMI audio still requires to create a dummy video display/monitor to mess with).

post #2250 of 2628

Actually most of the adapters work very well so that isn't a bad point. There seem to be Toslink to HDMI adapters as well which would also probably work. At the price point we're already dealing with there are about fifty ways to solve the problem without blowing the budget but as I said before it is potentially more expensive and more complicated to do it right. Having said all of that I would love to have one. 

Hekeli, are you using it for movies or games?

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