The Woo Audio 2
Sep 22, 2014 at 5:27 PM Post #1,006 of 1,741
Mikoss,
Listen to Chesterfield...have learned a ton from that guy. Good ears.
Sent you a PM, take the info for as many grains of salt as you like.
I'm a big Philips Miniwatt E188CC fan for midrange. I also use the Amperex (American made) 7308's and love them. But to me their midrange is a bit recessed as compared to the Miniwatts and there is a very rich instrument timbre that the Mini's bring to the table as well.
Chesterfield is a big Tung Sol 7236 fan...I'm big on the 5998's (want to hear the 7236's though!). The soundstage on the 5998's is NOT crazy wide to my ears. Seems to scale just right for the upfront, intimate sound signature I prefer.
Good luck !!!
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 10:05 PM Post #1,007 of 1,741
amperex have nice mids, and i think the 5998s are better than the 7236 overall as well too. if you want really nice rich enveloping mids, get a pair of the GECs 
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 10:06 PM Post #1,008 of 1,741
Aww, shucks, Bill. Thanks. I've learned a lot from you too. Yeah, I really like Tung Sol 7236s (not 7236s generally--just the Tung Sols) and generally prefer them to Tung Sol 5998s. But I'm in a minuscule minority with that opinion, and I certainly recognize and appreciate the 5998s many virtues, including its superior imaging. Dubstep Girl, like billerb1, is a font of knowledge on tubes, and she's always happy to help.
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 11:18 PM Post #1,010 of 1,741
Thanks for the tips guys. I actually have a Miniwatt E188CC along with the 7308. I was under the impression that Amperex made it! It's marked VR3 delta 1D4. (halo getter).

I will have to find some GECs too... Are they power tubes? 5998s?
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 11:47 PM Post #1,011 of 1,741
Yes, the GEC 6AS7Gs are 5998-type power tubes, and they're rarer than hens' teeth. I almost had a pair a few months ago, but the tube store that had them sold out the day before I called. They're generally considered the best tubes available for the WA2--those and Western Electric 421As (which are also quite rare). They're pretty pricey too. That's why most WA2 owners--those interested in high-end tubes, anyway--end up "settling" for Tung Sol 5998s, which are considered the next best option.
 
Sep 23, 2014 at 1:11 AM Post #1,012 of 1,741
Thanks for the tips guys. I actually have a Miniwatt E188CC along with the 7308. I was under the impression that Amperex made it! It's marked VR3 delta 1D4. (halo getter).

I will have to find some GECs too... Are they power tubes? 5998s?


Mikoss,
Are you saying your current driver pair is an Amperex 7308 with a Miniwatt 188CC?  I'm sure you could run them together but to me they are different sound signatures...so you wouldn't be getting the 'house' sound of either.  That Miniwatt you have was made at the Heerlen Holland plant in 1961, a real vintage one.  The Amperex 7308's were made at that plant in Heerlen as well...but were also made in New York.  I personally prefer the American made Amperex 7308's...a touch more raw and more 'alive' to me than the Hollands. 
But for your purposes, I wish you could hear a matched pair of the Miniwatts.  I think the midrange, the weight of it,  would blow you away !!!  To me they are the path to total immersion.  They put me inside the music.  But I'm an old drummer.  I like being right there in the mix.  What I look for might be too upfront for a lot of people.
 
Sep 26, 2014 at 12:57 AM Post #1,014 of 1,741
I spent some time figuring out why I prefer Tung Sol 7236s to 5998s. It's never been about imaging (the 5998s beat the 7236s pretty handily on that measure), but about the sound signature. For me, the 5998s have always sounded slightly off in the treble, though I couldn't precisely place it. So I decided to tune my stereo with an EQ, known faithful recordings, and tuning fork, like I tune my guitars. I don't know if it's just one tube, or both my 5998s, or if this is true of all Tung Sol 5998s--but compared to the 7236s (and to my guitar) there's a slight (.3-.4Dbs, I think) spike in the 4Khz range on the 5998s. It's not about inadequate burn in. I find the spike unpleasant, even pretty jarring at times--but the moment I "tune" the EQ accordingly, the 5998s are beautiful. So, mystery solved. Sort of.
 
Sep 26, 2014 at 1:23 AM Post #1,015 of 1,741
I spent some time figuring out why I prefer Tung Sol 7236s to 5998s. It's never been about imaging (the 5998s beat the 7236s pretty handily on that measure), but about the sound signature. For me, the 5998s have always sounded slightly off in the treble, though I couldn't precisely place it. So I decided to tune my stereo with an EQ, known faithful recordings, and tuning fork, like I tune my guitars. I don't know if it's just one tube, or both my 5998s, or if this is true of all Tung Sol 5998s--but compared to the 7236s (and to my guitar) there's a slight (.3-.4Dbs, I think) spike in the 4Khz range on the 5998s. It's not about inadequate burn in. I find the spike unpleasant, even pretty jarring at times--but the moment I "tune" the EQ accordingly, the 5998s are beautiful. So, mystery solved. Sort of.


Chris...the "Mad Scientist of Head-Fi".  I freaking love it !!!  I'm just about ready to send my $160 off to Jack Woo and get the whole thing over with.  I know I won't regret it.
 
Sep 26, 2014 at 1:43 AM Post #1,016 of 1,741
Perhaps not a scientist so much as just plain mad. Who uses a tuning fork on their stereo? Bill, I knew I'd wear you down on the 7236s--if not with refutable logic, then at least with repetitive persistance. Seriously, though, I'm really enjoying the 5998s now!
 
Sep 26, 2014 at 1:50 AM Post #1,017 of 1,741
Perhaps not a scientist so much as just plain mad. Who uses a tuning fork on their stereo? Bill, I knew I'd wear you down on the 7236s--if not with refutable logic, then at least with repetitive persistance. Seriously, though, I'm really enjoying the 5998s now!


I win !!!
 
Sep 26, 2014 at 10:49 PM Post #1,018 of 1,741
Ha! Yes, you win. All it took for me to find the Tung Sol 5998s tolerable was an intentional distortion in the music. Speaking of which--it's really hard to tune for dynamics! But I'm not such a purist that I find an EQ morally and ethically objectionable. Isn't that big of me?
 
Sep 27, 2014 at 2:59 AM Post #1,019 of 1,741
Ha! Yes, you win. All it took for me to find the Tung Sol 5998s tolerable was an intentional distortion in the music. Speaking of which--it's really hard to tune for dynamics! But I'm not such a purist that I find an EQ morally and ethically objectionable. Isn't that big of me?


Quit tryin' to ruin all my fun.  And I DO find it morally and ethically objectionable...unless it's helpin' me...in a pinch.  You know.
 
Oct 7, 2014 at 5:11 PM Post #1,020 of 1,741
 
Mikoss,
Are you saying your current driver pair is an Amperex 7308 with a Miniwatt 188CC?  I'm sure you could run them together but to me they are different sound signatures...so you wouldn't be getting the 'house' sound of either.  That Miniwatt you have was made at the Heerlen Holland plant in 1961, a real vintage one.  The Amperex 7308's were made at that plant in Heerlen as well...but were also made in New York.  I personally prefer the American made Amperex 7308's...a touch more raw and more 'alive' to me than the Hollands. 
But for your purposes, I wish you could hear a matched pair of the Miniwatts.  I think the midrange, the weight of it,  would blow you away !!!  To me they are the path to total immersion.  They put me inside the music.  But I'm an old drummer.  I like being right there in the mix.  What I look for might be too upfront for a lot of people.

 
Just gave the Miniwatt e188cc a thorough listen this weekend and I'm floored by this tube. It has the beautiful, rich mids of the Amperex 7308's, combined with the extended, nuanced highs of the Siemens tubes, and huge soundstage. This is without a doubt, the best 6dj8 style tube I've ever heard. I've scoured eBay and bought a very strong single for my T1 tube buffered dac, and also a matched pair for my WA2. Total cost was outrageous, but I feel like this tube completely captures my music and presents it in a way that reminds me of everything that I love about vinyl without the pops and crackles. I'm wondering how a CCa could improve on these tubes... Anyway, mine are all from the Heerlen plant. Can't wait to hear the WA2 with matched e188cc Miniwatts.
 
Also, just for reference, I fed my WA7 which has the upgraded gold pin 6C45 tubes and it completely rolls off the highs. Hoping maybe they just need to be burned in some more... but I suspect the 6C45's just can't handle everything the e188cc is passing through. The WA2 on the other hand retains the beautiful highs, just needs the matched e188cc's hopefully to improve the mids.
 

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