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Magix levitation feet - why doesn't everyone use them? - Page 2

post #16 of 84
Erh. Dear Patrick,

Fanless laptop means there's no fan. That does not mean there's watercooling in the laptop.

Going from 2.5" to SSD does not make any sense as there are 2.5" SSDs.


One minute you're talking about laptops another minute you're talking about desktops. Make up your mind Patrick.

Your points contradict each other. Best sound from a WD 1TB drive because they use less electricity? What ever happened to SSDs? They use less electricity than HDDs.

One minute you're talking about EMU0404 USB which is external. Another minute you're talking about an internal soundcard? Make up your mind.

Do start talking about laptops then all of a sudden talk about desktops. You're going to make everyone think that it's just your imagination because you're talking about two different setups which clearly will sound different.

It's already bad enough that these small magnetic feet won't do anything because the earth's magnetic field is far more powerful and negate whatever these small teeny weeny magnets do.
post #17 of 84
COCAINE
STAY AWAY KIDS!
post #18 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
You're going to make everyone think that it's just your imagination
This is the theory that makes the most sense to me.
post #19 of 84
y doesnt every1 wear work boots while listening? i mean the huge soles give you total isolation to your eardrum so that no exterior vibrations can interfere with your hearing. you will gain immense low level detail retrieval, so much that you can listen at 10db lower than humanly possible!
post #20 of 84
Face it, Patrick. You're no audiophile if you can't accept flaws.
post #21 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwell2112 View Post
This is the theory that makes the most sense to me.
There is the possibility that Patrick enjoys having a little fun with us. Sometimes I wonder if he is a performance artist.

Not that it matters much. Patrick never takes the bait and is an awfully good sport. Just settle back and enjoy.
post #22 of 84
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
Erh. Dear Patrick,

Fanless laptop means there's no fan. That does not mean there's watercooling in the laptop.
A watercooling setup gives vibrations which hurt the sound like fans do. My point was that when I turned them off the improvement was insignificant. I could do easy A/B-testing with the flip of a switch. It became fanless with no moving parts to cool the system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
Going from 2.5" to SSD does not make any sense as there are 2.5" SSDs.
There are 3.5 inch SSDs as well. But they all use less than 1 watt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
One minute you're talking about laptops another minute you're talking about desktops. Make up your mind Patrick.
I'm not talking about either, I'm talking about isolating the motherboard from ground vibrations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
Your points contradict each other. Best sound from a WD 1TB drive because they use less electricity? What ever happened to SSDs? They use less electricity than HDDs.
I cannot afford a 1TB SSD to make the proper comparison.

Solid Data - Content-Addressable Storage (CAS) - Byte and Switch
Quote:
Cost nonetheless remains an issue in the SSD market. With a 1-Tbyte StorageSPIRE system costing between $900,000 and $950,000, the array will be out of the price range of many users.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
One minute you're talking about EMU0404 USB which is external. Another minute you're talking about an internal soundcard? Make up your mind.

Do start talking about laptops then all of a sudden talk about desktops. You're going to make everyone think that it's just your imagination because you're talking about two different setups which clearly will sound different.
Laptops are desktops but in a different casing. I use the laptop as a desktop computer with my own keyboard, mouse and screen.
My point is that laptops give better sound than desktops because of lower wattage draw. It still uses about 30 watts overall. The 2.5 inch 5400 rpm harddrive uses about 1-2 watts. 3.5 inch 7200 rpm harddrives are about 10 watts. 10 watts difference was very noticeable in my system. Going from 2.5 inch 5400 rpm to SSD will reduce another 1 watt.

I believe the best choice is having a wireless NAS instead of a big SSD. I have not compared the sound quality of NAS vs internal harddrive yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
It's already bad enough that these small magnetic feet won't do anything because the earth's magnetic field is far more powerful and negate whatever these small teeny weeny magnets do.
I don't understand this comment. Each Magix supports 12 lbs.
post #23 of 84
I recommend doing your listening while balancing on stilts. most stilts have a sort of conical base to them; this would further isolate you from the harmful vibrations that emanate from all around you. of course there would be the trade-off between these benefits and the added length you would have to add to your headphone cable. its a matter of which is the worse evil. only you can decide.
post #24 of 84
Go, go, go, Patrick!
post #25 of 84
You do not need to explain to me about watercooling. I keep telling you to get a fanless laptop and all you can say is watercooling watercooling watercooling which is clearly out of topic.

Did I ever say there are no 3.5" SSDs? Clearly I'm talking about 2.5" SSDs. Don't need to bring in 3.5" SSDs.

You are either talking about a laptop or a desktop as a motherboard is a part of a system. There will not be any vibrations for a motherboard if your system has an SSD and is fanless. There's no such thing as a standalone motherboard nor is there any such phenomenon as a vibrating motherboard.

Now. I did not specify that you should get a 1TB SSD which most likely you can afford since most of your gear are in the thousands. I just said SSD. Don't conclude by thinking of your own ideas. Besides, there's no such thing as a proper comparison as comparing SSDs with HDDs are like comparing apples and oranges. The different wattage usage between SSDs of different capacities made by the same company is so small that by all laws of physics it is close to negligible. For a person who talks about gear to not know this is just preposterous. So you might as well just use a 256GB SSD which can easily cost less than $1,000.

The point is Patrick is that you were first talking about laptops and now trying to change it to desktops. Make up your mind. Laptops are not and will never be desktops. Everyone who owns a computer knows that. Otherwise there's no point differentiating between a laptop and a desktop. They are both computers. But they are both not the same type of computers.

Now, the whole point using those Magix to prevent vibration when it clearly could easily be overcome by using an SSD-equipped fanless laptop, leaving the Magix practically useless. Also in regards to magnetism, whether it can carry a ton or whatever, the earth's magnetic field WILL still be going against those little magnets in the opposite direction, which makes whatever magnetic properties they provide, futile and useless.



Now Patrick. If you can't even get your sources straighten out ywt, I suggest you think carefully before you post something which can easily be contradicted.
post #26 of 84
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
Now, the whole point using those Magix to prevent vibration when it clearly could easily be overcome by using an SSD-equipped fanless laptop, leaving the Magix practically useless.
Like I said, I compared fanless vs fanned and there was almost no difference. With a completely fanless computer (with harddrive outside the case) the improvement from Magix is huge.
post #27 of 84
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
You do not need to explain to me about watercooling. I keep telling you to get a fanless laptop and all you can say is watercooling watercooling watercooling which is clearly out of topic.
A Zalman Reserator water cooling system sounds blue and liquid similar to Nordost Valhalla AES/EBU digital cable. I like that flavor more than a fanned computer. However, the improvement from Magix is a hundred times bigger so it doesn't really matter if there is a fan inside the computer or not.

Other forms of vibrating sources makes bigger differences like a Toroidal transformer which doesn't vibrate consistently, the reduction of low-level detail it makes is clearly audible. When I removed if from the casing of Benchmark DAC1 the improvement was one of the biggest I have ever heard. Vibration for a component with analog output and digital output are very different. For the digital output (of computer) only the jitter flavor changes, the low-level detail cannot be masked by vibration, it can only be masked by brightness/edginess/jitter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
You are either talking about a laptop or a desktop as a motherboard is a part of a system. There will not be any vibrations for a motherboard if your system has an SSD and is fanless. There's no such thing as a standalone motherboard nor is there any such phenomenon as a vibrating motherboard.
I have tried Magix under Benchmark DAC1, Cary 303/300, Krell KAV-500i, PS Audio GCC-100, P300 Power Plant, Premier Power Plant, Quintet Power Center, Ultimate Outlet, T-Amp, EMU0404 USB, dCS Elgar Plus DAC, dCS Verdi Encore transport.
None of them had a fan (Power Plants have a fan but I disabled it). For each component the improvement from Magix was HUGE.

I have also removed the vibrating transformers from the chassis and put them on top of their own Magix. The improvement from isolating the transformers was HUGE. The improvement from turning off the fans is almost zero. I don't believe you have even tried it yourself. I will not recommend people to try SSD until I have tried it myself, they are very expensive!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
Now. I did not specify that you should get a 1TB SSD which most likely you can afford since most of your gear are in the thousands.
My gear costs less than a thousand (EMU0404 USB and laptop).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
The point is Patrick is that you were first talking about laptops and now trying to change it to desktops. Make up your mind. Laptops are not and will never be desktops. Everyone who owns a computer knows that. Otherwise there's no point differentiating between a laptop and a desktop. They are both computers. But they are both not the same type of computers.
I use my laptop as a desktop computer. For me they are the same. The difference is that with a laptop you can't use a good soundcard, a laptop is only meant for USB output. I believe it matches very well with a dCS Scarlatti upsampler.

I have tried RCA and AES/EBU in the past and they halved the resolution because of ground noise running through the cables. The problem was reduced by underclocking the computer. But the problem wasn't eliminated until I used optical connection and moved the computer to a dedicated AC line, however, it required me to use a double power conditioning setup; 8 Genesis power cables, 4 power conditioners, and tweaks for them would have been very expensive. Having either the DAC or computer plugged into the power conditioning setup gave almost equally big improvements, but having them both plugged into it worsened the sound overall!

The cheapest choice is to plug in the computer transport into the same power conditioned setup as the rest of the system. The only way for that is to reduce the wattage of the system, otherwise it becomes worse overall. I'm using EMU0404 USB and laptop because they use very low wattage! Compare those to dCS Elgar Plus DAC which takes 34-40 watts and desktop computer which takes 80+ watts, plugging those together sounds very edgy!
post #28 of 84
Yes Patrick. With the posts above you have clearly showed that you are trying to run away from the fact that we are not talking about watercooling.

"Like I said, I compared fanless vs fanned and there was almost no difference. With a completely fanless computer (with harddrive outside the case) the improvement from Magix is huge."

That above just clearly showed your ignorance towards SSDs. The Magix were designed to stop vibration and yet why did you not use SSDs instead of HDDs to begin with?

"I will not recommend people to try SSD until I have tried it myself, they are very expensive!"

What year are you living in, Patrick? There are quite a number of 256GB SSDs which clearly cost under a thousand.

"My gear costs less than a thousand (EMU0404 USB and laptop)."

But your other gears cost more than a thousand. EACH.

"I use my laptop as a desktop computer. For me they are the same. The difference is that with a laptop you can't use a good soundcard, a laptop is only meant for USB output. I believe it matches very well with a dCS Scarlatti upsampler."

A laptop being a desktop is your opinion to believe. But a laptop will never be a desktop. Even computer geeks will tell you that. Only meant for USB output? Have you forgotten the firewire output and the toslink output from Macbooks? Are you saying that the music industry (since most use Macs) are using the wrong gear? Well Patrick. There's no such thing as wrong gear if the artist is hearing what they want to hear from whatever gear they have. If you want to talk about low wattage, why are you using a laptop? Why not use a netbook?


Based on your reasoning, the only thing affecting your system are the magnetic properties of the Magix. Therefore one might as well buy a huge magnet and put it under their gear. Because it clearly shows their vibration damping properties are near to null since it made a "huge" difference with gear which had no vibrating parts.
post #29 of 84
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
Yes Patrick. With the posts above you have clearly showed that you are trying to run away from the fact that we are not talking about watercooling.

"Like I said, I compared fanless vs fanned and there was almost no difference. With a completely fanless computer (with harddrive outside the case) the improvement from Magix is huge."

That above just clearly showed your ignorance towards SSDs. The Magix were designed to stop vibration and yet why did you not use SSDs instead of HDDs to begin with?
Read the above again. I have compared with the harddrive placed outside the casing on top of pink foam. I haven't had the harddrives screwed into the chassis for 8 years.
post #30 of 84
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
"My gear costs less than a thousand (EMU0404 USB and laptop)."

But your other gears cost more than a thousand. EACH.
What other gear? Those are the only electronics I use. I have of course a lot of mutilated electronics in boxes, but I don't use them anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire View Post
Have you forgotten the firewire output and the toslink output from Macbooks? Are you saying that the music industry (since most use Macs) are using the wrong gear? .
Toslink output is good, but the soundcard needs to be good for that.

I have had a very bad experience from Firewire. I still have nightmares. Nothing worked to fix the harshness problem. I could fine tune it with placing RGC-24 Ground Conditioners at each end, but it was still there. If I didn't have 10 for the DAC and 1 for the transport it sounded horrible. Using 9 for DAC and 2 for transport sounded much worse. 10-1 was the way to go! I made a long thread about the Firewire problem! You know I'm no quitter, but I still ended up selling the Verdi Encore. Firewire is horrible and it was from a $15 500 transport! http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f113/d...ml#post4617559

It is weird that USB from laptop to EMU0404 sounds acceptable, I think the ground is lifted inside the EMU, does anyone know?
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