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post #511 of 2123
Wonderful stuff. As my other post noted, I didn't get into this depth, and don't have the experience to put it in words, but I know what you are saying. I also have that Patricia Barber track, so I will have to take a listen.

But great to hear the W3 compared to one of the IEM heavyweights, and coming out on top. You didn't compare comfort with the two phones but can only figure the W3s are more comfortable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vorlon1 View Post
After going several rounds back and forth with the TF10s and the W3s, I’d have to say both are great phones. They have a certain similarity of sound signature also, but the W3s are slightly cleaner sounding, kind of like if you took the TF 10s and with some kind of magic sound cleanser stripped away a very fine layer of sonic film from the entire presentation. This is not dramatic, but you can certainly hear it. In addition, the bass on the TF10, while quite good, is not as deep, clean, detailed, or impactful as the W3. One of the songs I have been using for this comparison is Patricia Barber’s version of “Norwegian Wood” by the Beatles. Besides excellent recording quality and female vocals, there is a lot of stand-up bass, piano, drums and some bells in the background. While the TF10 renders the bass fiddle well, the W3 is just cleaner and more impactful, including the sound of the fingers plucking the strings, which you do get some of with the TF 10, just more resolution and impact comes with the W3. The vocals are competent with the TF10, although the placement is ever so slightly recessed compared to the main body of the music. The W3 places the vocals slightly forward of the instruments on this cut, which is, in my opinion, where it belongs. It is not way out front just a bit and pleasantly so. The W3 has a very smooth musicality to its presentation, you hear no grain in the voice, it flows very well. With the TF 10 there is a very slight hint of grain and a sense that something is resisting the flow of the music very slightly. Again, this is a subtle effect, but depending on one’s sensitivity to such things, noticeable.

The biggest difference I found between the W3 and TF 10 was in listening to classical music. I used the Cleveland Symphony’s recording of the Dvorak 8th Symphony, conducted by Christophe von Dohnanyi for this test. Listening to large string elements with complex textures of woodwinds in the mix, the W3 is phenomenal at rendering the weight of the orchestra with clarity and definition. I do not think I have heard anything like this done so well. You get the low rumble that a real orchestra creates in the hall, but the string definition is all there, not smudged or approximated, and the woodwinds and flutes are all there very clearly heard, but integrated into the sound as they should be. The 4th movement of this work starts with a big trumpet introduction and this is clear and biting while retaining a certain sweetness in the sound, like it sounds live. This section of the music can sound more biting and acerbic on lesser phones. I am extremely impressed with the W3s performance with classical music. The same holds true for piano music. The W3s ability to pick up bass energy just gives a reality to the piano that the TF 10 does not duplicate. In fact, as I have been listening to the W 3 off and on all day, I have gotten used to hearing this lower bass weight underpinning the music and now I hear the lack of it with other phones quite glaringly, when I wouldn’t have recognized it before to the same degree.

To test the higher registers I listened to a Judy Collins tune called, “All the Pretty Horses” which has bells and triangles and such. Here the TF 10 showed a lot of strength, with clarity and definition in the higher realms. The W3 was also quite good, but the higher sounds of the bells and triangles didn’t sound quite as defined, but more “in the mix” of the music. Whether they should stand out like the TF 10 allows or be slightly less emphasized like the W3 presents, I do not know. The highs on the W3 are very clear and very smooth, with a kind of golden color to them (if that can describe a sound) while some of these sounds with the TF 10 may be ever so slightly more extended and defined. Others may perceive this differently, I do not see it as a major difference. Also, I dod no mention soundstage. Generally the TF10 has a slightly larger and deeper soundstage, I’d say about 5% larger all around, not so much, but perceivable. BTW, if there are any lovers of classical violin out there, the W3s sound fantastic on violin music because of their smoothness and lack of grain and easy flowing sound they allow. So, those are my attempts to compare the TF10 and the W3. Coming later the Shure E 500s and Sleek SA 6s.
post #512 of 2123
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict View Post
I made it a point to stay away from the Westne 3 and Image X10 for most of the day, and then put in the Image X10 for a listen and it they sounded really good. So good it made me wonder if I was crazy about liking the W3 so much.

Then I switched to the W3 and the sound opened up to a huge space and the bass and weight of the instruments struck me in full, and everything sounded so much fuller and more real. And I knew I wasn't crazy anymore, and I didn't wake up from this dream because it is real this time!
Having briefly owned the X10, this gets me extremely pumped to finally, at long last, hear the 3. I'm sure my UM2 will be for sale by the end of the week.
post #513 of 2123
Quote:
Originally Posted by vorlon1 View Post
After going several rounds back and forth with the TF10s and the W3s, I’d have to say both are great phones. They have a certain similarity of sound signature also, but the W3s are slightly cleaner sounding, kind of like if you took the TF 10s and with some kind of magic sound cleanser stripped away a very fine layer of sonic film from the entire presentation. This is not dramatic, but you can certainly hear it. In addition, the bass on the TF10, while quite good, is not as deep, clean, detailed, or impactful as the W3. One of the songs I have been using for this comparison is Patricia Barber’s version of “Norwegian Wood” by the Beatles. Besides excellent recording quality and female vocals, there is a lot of stand-up bass, piano, drums and some bells in the background. While the TF10 renders the bass fiddle well, the W3 is just cleaner and more impactful, including the sound of the fingers plucking the strings, which you do get some of with the TF 10, just more resolution and impact comes with the W3. The vocals are competent with the TF10, although the placement is ever so slightly recessed compared to the main body of the music. The W3 places the vocals slightly forward of the instruments on this cut, which is, in my opinion, where it belongs. It is not way out front just a bit and pleasantly so. The W3 has a very smooth musicality to its presentation, you hear no grain in the voice, it flows very well. With the TF 10 there is a very slight hint of grain and a sense that something is resisting the flow of the music very slightly. Again, this is a subtle effect, but depending on one’s sensitivity to such things, noticeable.

The biggest difference I found between the W3 and TF 10 was in listening to classical music. I used the Cleveland Symphony’s recording of the Dvorak 8th Symphony, conducted by Christophe von Dohnanyi for this test. Listening to large string elements with complex textures of woodwinds in the mix, the W3 is phenomenal at rendering the weight of the orchestra with clarity and definition. I do not think I have heard anything like this done so well. You get the low rumble that a real orchestra creates in the hall, but the string definition is all there, not smudged or approximated, and the woodwinds and flutes are all there very clearly heard, but integrated into the sound as they should be. The 4th movement of this work starts with a big trumpet introduction and this is clear and biting while retaining a certain sweetness in the sound, like it sounds live. This section of the music can sound more biting and acerbic on lesser phones. I am extremely impressed with the W3s performance with classical music. The same holds true for piano music. The W3s ability to pick up bass energy just gives a reality to the piano that the TF 10 does not duplicate. In fact, as I have been listening to the W 3 off and on all day, I have gotten used to hearing this lower bass weight underpinning the music and now I hear the lack of it with other phones quite glaringly, when I wouldn’t have recognized it before to the same degree.

To test the higher registers I listened to a Judy Collins tune called, “All the Pretty Horses” which has bells and triangles and such. Here the TF 10 showed a lot of strength, with clarity and definition in the higher realms. The W3 was also quite good, but the higher sounds of the bells and triangles didn’t sound quite as defined, but more “in the mix” of the music. Whether they should stand out like the TF 10 allows or be slightly less emphasized like the W3 presents, I do not know. The highs on the W3 are very clear and very smooth, with a kind of golden color to them (if that can describe a sound) while some of these sounds with the TF 10 may be ever so slightly more extended and defined. Others may perceive this differently, I do not see it as a major difference. Also, I dod no mention soundstage. Generally the TF10 has a slightly larger and deeper soundstage, I’d say about 5% larger all around, not so much, but perceivable. BTW, if there are any lovers of classical violin out there, the W3s sound fantastic on violin music because of their smoothness and lack of grain and easy flowing sound they allow. So, those are my attempts to compare the TF10 and the W3. Coming later the Shure E 500s and Sleek SA 6s.
Thanks for the detailed comparisons between W3 and TF10.
I hope I don't regret passing TF10 for W3 :P
Coming from Philips SHE9850, I can almost be certain that I won't be disappointed by W3

SilverB
post #514 of 2123
Quote:
Originally Posted by toughnut View Post
I really would like to give W3 a try.
Hi toughnut,

I'll be going back to Miri during the CNY. Will stay in Sibu for 2/3 days.
Maybe we can arrange for a session to audition the W3?
I would also like to try out your TF10

SilverB
post #515 of 2123

Westone 3 finally here!!

Teeheee.. so my Westone 3 arrived today.

Here's my little review.
Comfort: The earpiece fits nicely into the ears. I can lay on bed sideways.

Microphonics: Surprisingly little microphonics, probably due to the light and flexible cable. Cable is smooth and feels great, although it's still possible to tangle. Sennheiser IE7's cable, on the other hand, doesn't feel as nice but almost never tangles.

Sound: Plenty of bass is the first thing I noticed. Comply tips tend to overpower the bass and muffles the treble, so I intentionally keep the seal slightly lose or just use the silicon tips. This could be a personal problem caused by the shape of my ear.

Middle range is close and strong, with good details. Not as clean as IM716 but has stronger presence and feels rich and warm. It's a bit grainy on some music. Guitars have great impact on these.

Highs are definitely softer than middle range with no graininess which will probably prevent fatigue. I wish it had a little more definition though.

Soundstage of Westone 3 is good but isn't necessarily better than other IEMs. For example, Sennheiser IE7 is clearly better in terms of soundstage.

In generally I like Westone 3 the best of all IEMs I tried (E500, IM716, Vmoda Vibes, Sennheiser IE7) due to their ability to deliver quality bass while maintaining a good overall balance. I simply love their sound signature! Sennheiser IE7 is a close second on my list. E500 is good but feels unnatural to me.
post #516 of 2123
Quote:
Originally Posted by stormable View Post
Teeheee.. so my Westone 3 arrived today.

Here's my little review.
Comfort: The earpiece fits nicely into the ears. I can lay on bed sideways.

Microphonics: Surprisingly little microphonics, probably due to the light and flexible cable. Cable is smooth and feels great, although it's still possible to tangle. Sennheiser IE7's cable, on the other hand, doesn't feel as nice but almost never tangles.

Sound: Plenty of bass is the first thing I noticed. Comply tips tend to overpower the bass and muffles the treble, so I intentionally keep the seal slightly lose or just use the silicon tips. This could be a personal problem caused by the shape of my ear.

Middle range is close and strong, with good details. Not as clean as IM716 but has stronger presence and feels rich and warm. It's a bit grainy on some music. Guitars have great impact on these.

Highs are definitely softer than middle range with no graininess which will probably prevent fatigue. I wish it had a little more definition though.

Soundstage of Westone 3 is good but isn't necessarily better than other IEMs. For example, Sennheiser IE7 is clearly better in terms of soundstage.

In generally I like Westone 3 the best of all IEMs I tried (E500, IM716, Vmoda Vibes, Sennheiser IE7) due to their ability to deliver quality bass while maintaining a good overall balance. I simply love their sound signature! Sennheiser IE7 is a close second on my list. E500 is good but feels unnatural to me.
Did you use any HP amplifier? What is your source?
post #517 of 2123
Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverB View Post
Hi toughnut,

I'll be going back to Miri during the CNY. Will stay in Sibu for 2/3 days.
Maybe we can arrange for a session to audition the W3?
I would also like to try out your TF10

SilverB
Woot. Someone else from Miri. I'll be going back a week after CNY starts though.
post #518 of 2123
Too bad SilverB, i'm not from that two divisions. I will try to go Sibu if possible, if i got time to spare. My hometown is nearby there.

But if W3 is really good, i probably will have 1 before CNY!
post #519 of 2123
Quote:
Originally Posted by tstarn06 View Post
I could not get the plug to work with my Touch 2G. It would not go all the way in
Ooops! I didn't see this bit yesterday. I don't understand. The W3 doesn't plug into the Touch 2G? I thought Flavio was using them with his, and I don't remember him saying the plug didn't fit. I'll have to go and check

HeadphoneAddict and Vorlon1 - thank you both for making the differences between the W3 and TF10 a little clearer to my 'ears'
I really like my TF10, and was hoping the W3 would at least sound as good, if not better. From what I've picked up on so far, I can assume the midrange is clearer and more forward on the W3. And that's all I need to know
post #520 of 2123
How about isolation, how good are they in this regard compared to other top IEMs?
post #521 of 2123
Isolation depends on the tip. Foam-based tips provide the best isolation/comfort. Triflanges provide good isolation too if u can endure it.
post #522 of 2123
someone convince me not to get these
post #523 of 2123
I'm tossing up between these or TF10. Anyone care to chime in with opinions comparing the 2?
post #524 of 2123
Quote:
Originally Posted by FeedMeTrance View Post
someone convince me not to get these
That's an impossible task at this juncture, if only our Australian dollar was at parity with the US some time ago. Even so, this will not prevent many from taking the plunge into that deep blue bassfull sea.
post #525 of 2123
For TF10P against W3, i'm waiting feedback from soozieq

vorlon1 already wrote his impression for both pairs at few posts back.
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