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Review: Woo Audio WA6 vs. WA6SE (stock units) - Page 17

post #241 of 508
Quote:
Originally Posted by atbglenn View Post
I hate the term "fanboy", but I guess I'm in the same boat as you. I love Woo products immensely. I guess I'm a fanboy too.
So, what is 'self loathing' like? At least you have a great amp!
post #242 of 508
Thank you Orcin. I (and my wallet) had a feeling you were going in that direction. Since my wife is a NY Giant fan after a terrific win against Carolina, I guess now might be a good time to try and ask her and slip (the woo 6a SE) it by her. My new (as yet unlistened to) AKG 701's deserve nothing less, I imagine!
post #243 of 508
hi guys, i have a woo 6 with Sophia and western house 6de7 run with hd650. What tubes should i change to have a better sound? I found 2 Sylvania 6de7 for pretty cheap ($10). Should i give them a try?
post #244 of 508

Some Great Tubes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinvisionm View Post
hi guys, i have a woo 6 with Sophia and western house 6de7 run with hd650. What tubes should i change to have a better sound? I found 2 Sylvania 6de7 for pretty cheap ($10). Should i give them a try?
Here are some great tubes:

Rectifiers:
Tung Sol 5U4G / 5U4GB and similar
Philco 5U4GB
Sylvania 5U4GB
Sovtek 5U4G

All are great, but the Sophia is better.

Dual Triodes:
Tung Sol 6DE7s
Aperex 6DE7s (Holland Orange Label)
Philco 6DE7s
Sylvania 6DE7s
RCA 6DE7s (50s & 60s)
Raytheon 6EW7s
Sylvania 6EW7s

All are good, but the following are a "hair" better.

The Tung Sols, Amperex and Philco 6DE7s are exceptional, as are the Raytheon and Sylvania 6EW7s (which have more resolution, air and clarity, but a bit less bass drive).

If you want lots of bass drive and impact, and rich mids and highs try the all Tung Sol combo, or Tung Sol / Amperex combo. If you want greater refinement and resolution try the Philco or Sylvania Rectifiers with the 6EW7s. Or a combo of Tung Sol Rectifiers with the 6EW7s for a "happy medium."

If you've got the Sophia - you really don't need more in Rectifiers. Though, if I wanted a bit more warmth and drive - you might get a Tung Sol. I'd tend to focus more on a selection of 6DE7 / 6EW7s.
post #245 of 508
*******Caution: jack of wooaudio has let it be known that recents units of the wa6SE
have differing parts, and may need a change of the cathode caps to make use of alternative
tubes like the 6FD7 and 6GF7A. make sure your amp has the cathode caps rated at 200v or higher.
some earlier wa6SE units may have cathode caps rated at 100v only. (change to 200v or higher
if you want to make use of the 6FD7 and 6GF7A)


the following rectifiers (input) and dual triodes (output) are compatible and safe to use with
the woo audio wa6 and wa6SE headphone amps. please feel free to add any other tube types
that are confirmed compatible, and are not listed below.

i was concerned about the high "mu" or amplification factor on some of the output tube types but
fortunately i've yet to encounter any distortion in SQ nor increase in floor noise. the increase in
"mu" definitely gives an increase in dynamics and soundstage. it should help those of you who
have a relatively low output power source DAC. likewise, if your DAC or CDplayer source has a
very high power output, you may encounter some noise or distortion with the high "mu" output tubes.
i use the vda2/vac1 DAC which puts out 2.25 vrms and did not encounter any humming.

i've been trying out the output tubes for the past 2 months and would've posted them earlier but
delayed it till i had a chance to receive all of those listed and gave it a good listen. i find them
more than acceptable and preferable to the 6DE7.

after about a half a year of using the 6sn7 on the wa6 and the wa6SE i've come to the conclusion
that the 6sn7 is a superb drive tube with an efficient power section too, at least with class A SET with
a output transformer. it's quite different than the 6de7 which is a fine dissimilar triode in itself. the
6sn7 is an equivalent dual triode that seems to present a larger sound-scape or arena without any
hint of compression nor edginess. the 6sn7 presentation is more refined and has an elegant sound
that will offend the least whereas the 6de7 is very dynamic with a U-shaped freq. characterisics.
for 70's/80's rock the 6de7 is great but with classical and small ensemble jazz the 6sn7's refined
sound hits the spot dead on.

RECTIFIERS ( RECTIFIER ):
*these must be at or below 3.0A

5U4G/ 5U4GA/ 5U4GB/ 5U4WG ( U52, VT-244, 5931 )
5AR4 ( GZ34 )
5AS4
5R4/ GA/ GB/ GY/ GYA/ GYB/ WGA/ WGB ( CV717 )
5V4G ( GZ32, CV593 )
5AQ4
5Y3G/ T
5Z3 ( with adapter; 4-pin version of 5u4g )
5Z4G/ T ( GZ30, 52KU, CV1863, CV2748 )
U50, U54, U88
53KU
GZ33
GZ37 ( CV378 )
422A
274A ( with adapter )
274B *don't use chinese variance with 4.0A



DUAL TRIODES ( INPUT/OUTPUT ):
(#) = AMPLIFICATION "MU" FACTOR
no adapters are needed and these are
safe for use in wa6 and wa6SE:



6DE7 (17.5) - Fast transients, good for rock, pop
6EW7 (17.5) - Softer sound but slightly larger soundstage, good for some jazz, classical

*******Caution: jack of wooaudio has let it be known that recents units of the wa6SE
have differing parts, and may need a change of the cathode caps to make use of alternative
tubes like the 6FD7 and 6GF7A. make sure your amp has the cathode caps rated at 200v or higher.
some earlier wa6SE units may have cathode caps rated at 100v only. (change to 200v or higher
if you want to make use of the 6FD7 and 6GF7A)

6CY7 (68) - between 6de7 and 6ew7
6DR7 (68) - similar to 6de7 but higher gain
6FD7 (64) - punchy bass, large soundstage, fast transients

*update: with homemade adapters one can make use of the following
dual triodes in the output section. for use in the wa6 and wa6SE.

*******Caution: jack of wooaudio has let it be known that recents units of the wa6SE
have differing parts, and may need a change of the cathode caps to make use of alternative
tubes like the 6FD7 and 6GF7A. make sure your amp has the cathode caps rated at 200v or higher.
some earlier wa6SE units may have cathode caps rated at 100v only. (change to 200v or higher
if you want to make use of the 6FD7 and 6GF7A)



6DA7/A - similar to 6ew7 but hard to find
6cg7 **** - similar to 6sn7 but sounds bit more faster with less noise, smaller soundstage
6fq7 **** - same as above
6gu7 **** - similar to above
6gf7/A - higher gain with very fast transients
6cs7 - similar to 6ew7, good for string instruments
6sn7 **** - very little distortion, large soundstage, solid bass, refined mids and highs
7n7 (loktal version of 6sn7) - same as 6sn7
ecc31 - higher gain, clear sound, less euphonic
ecc32 - similar to ecc31
6dn7/6em7/6ea7 - similar to 6sn7 but less refined highs and slightly higher gain
6bz7 - similar to 6ew7
6385/2c51/5670 ** - large soundstage, clear highs, slightly higher gain
6900/5687/7119/7044 - punchy bass, fast transients
7308/e188cc - very musical with refined mids and highs, slightly soft transients
6922 /e88cc *** - same as 7308
6DJ8 /ecc88 *** - same as above with different specs.
7DJ8/PCC88 *** - same as above with differing heater req. but works with softer transients.
6N6P *** very natural, open presentation, with slight warmth. equals or betters the 6922.
..............slight mid-bass hump present compared to 6dj8 and it's variants. great for bass lovers
6H30 *** very open presentation and slightly more dynamic than 6N6P


**this is only for wa6, with or without the pdps
(but not a direct substitute for the wa6SE. one way to use them on the wa6SE is to lower the voltage
to 150v at the anode plates and to raise the resistance to grid at pin 2 to at least 50 ohms to avoid clipping due
to the high gain nature of the amp and the tube itself. this is an amazing sounding tube that's comparable to
the 6dj8 family imo. this can be internally in the amp section or in the adapter with use of resistor at pin 1 (anode
of the power section) and pin 2 (grid of power section).)

***(must lower the voltage being supplied to the anode plate to 90v for 6dj8 and 100-130v for 6922/7308
in both wa6 and wa6SE. cathode resistance must be raised to 5.2k from 3.3k for the wa6SE only, to avoid clipping
due to high gain.) the 7dj8 has a 7v heater requirement but the 6.3 seems to sufficient as the sound is great.
the 6N6P and 6H30 can be used directly, with the adapter, without any resistors in the wa6.
low and high voltages to the anode section works equally well with the 6N6P/6H30 type.
applied 22 to 24 mA seems to work well.

**** the 6SN7 works fine on the wa6 but not so good with the 6SE. However, if you raise the cathode
resistance from 3.3K to approx. 4.7k,to avoid clipping, it sounds very very fine. i love this tube. you can
work with the resistance value to voice the amp to your headphone. playing with the cathode capacitance
will further refine the sound to your liking. the 6cg7/6fq7 and 6gu7 is almost as good as some NOS 6sn7.
it seems to be quieter than the 6sn7 in that there are zero mechanical or microphonic noise.
if you use black gate capacitors after the rectifier, make sure it's rated at above 200v. ideally it
should be at 350v.

*******Caution: jack of wooaudio has let it be known that recents units of the wa6SE
have differing parts, and may need a change of the cathode caps to make use of alternative
tubes like the 6FD7 and 6GF7A. make sure your amp has the cathode caps rated at 200v or higher.
some earlier wa6SE units may have cathode caps rated at 100v only. (change to 200v or higher
if you want to make use of the 6FD7 and 6GF7A)
post #246 of 508
Am I crazy to sell off what I got and try the GS-1? I am new to this area, and I wanted to see how the solid state sounds like.

It seems that I have to sacrifice a lot of money to experience this difference.. :-( I am trying to either trade for GS-1 + $$$ or Sell it off to buy the GS-1, but I am getting some real lowball offers that make me wonder whether it's a good idea or not in the first place..

Maybe I should just stick with WA6...
post #247 of 508

WA6 or WA6 SE???

Quote:
Originally Posted by takezo View Post
the following rectifiers (input) and dual triodes (output) are compatible and safe to use with
the woo audio wa6 and wa6SE headphone amps. please feel free to add any other tube types
that are confirmed compatible, and are not listed below.

i was concerned about the high "mu" or amplification factor on some of the output tube types but
fortunately i've yet to encounter any distortion in SQ nor increase in floor noise. the increase in
"mu" definitely gives an increase in dynamics and soundstage. it should help those of you who
have a relatively low output power source DAC. likewise, if your DAC or CDplayer source has a
very high power output, you may encounter some noise or distortion with the high "mu" output tubes.
i use the vda2/vac1 DAC which puts out 2.25 vrms and did not encounter any humming.

i've been trying out the output tubes for the past 2 months and would've posted them earlier but
delayed it till i had a chance to receive all of those listed and gave it a good listen. i find them
more than acceptable and preferable to the 6DE7.

RECTIFIERS ( INPUT ):

5U4G/ 5U4GA/ 5U4GB/ 5U4WG ( U52, VT-244, 5931 )
5AR4 ( GZ34 )
5AS4
5R4/ GA/ GB/ GY/ GYA/ GYB/ WGA/ WGB ( CV717 )
5V4G ( GZ32, CV593 )
5AQ4
5Y3G/ T
5Z3 ( with adapter; 4-pin version of 5u4g )
5Z4G/ T ( GZ30, 52KU, CV1863, CV2748 )
U50, U54, U88
53KU
GZ33
GZ37 ( CV378 )
422A
274A ( with adapter )
274B



DUAL TRIODES ( OUTPUT ):
(#) = AMPLIFICATION "MU" FACTOR

6DE7 (17.5)
6EW7 (17.5)
6CY7 (68)
6DA7/A (20)
6DR7 (68)
6FD7 (64)
In which amp did you try these the WA6, or WA6 SE?

I would have thought the MU would produce too much gain in the SE, which already has a lot of gain / power output. I can barely stand the volume levels above 11 O'clock with the 6DE7s and the standard 2.2 volt source. I would think that would drop to <9 O'clock with these high MUs... and... would be very sensitive to adjustment. No???

So... all these output tubes are identical, except for the MU... and... are interchangeable???
post #248 of 508
I notice a very high plate resistance of the higher mu tubes. You don't notice an high frequency roll off?
post #249 of 508
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gradofan2 View Post
In which amp did you try these the WA6, or WA6 SE?

I would have thought the MU would produce too much gain in the SE, which already has a lot of gain / power output. I can barely stand the volume levels above 11 O'clock with the 6DE7s and the standard 2.2 volt source. I would think that would drop to <9 O'clock with these high MUs... and... would be very sensitive to adjustment. No???

So... all these output tubes are identical, except for the MU... and... are interchangeable???
i've tried them on both.

it will reduce the volume pot range if your source is high but it's a trade off
for the ability to try tubes other than the 6de7/6ew7. my source is 2.25vrms,
and using the 6de7 comfortable listening volume is at 11 o'clock... with a
6fd7 it's around 9 o'clock.

and best is that most of these are very cheap ~ $1 to $5 ... except the 6DA7/A
which go for about $10. and yes, these are safely interchangeable.
post #250 of 508
Quote:
Originally Posted by takezo View Post
i've tried them on both.

it will reduce the volume pot range if your source is high but it's a trade off
for the ability to try tubes other than the 6de7/6ew7. my source is 2.25vrms,
and using the 6de7 comfortable listening volume is at 11 o'clock... with a
6fd7 it's around 9 o'clock.

and best is that most of these are very cheap ~ $1 to $5 ... except the 6DA7/A
which go for about $10. and yes, these are safely interchangeable.
So which is your favorite or do you have one?
post #251 of 508
among the new types i'd have to say the fatbottle 6fd7 seems to
have similar characteristics to the 6ew7 but better bass and bigger
soundstage. the 6cy7 and 6dr7 are closer to the 6de7 with
increased dynamics and soundstage. and did i mention they're
cheap? i got about 20 tubes for about $65... the 6da7/a is closer
to 6ew7 but the most expensive of the group. probably not worth it...
post #252 of 508
Quote:
Originally Posted by takezo View Post
among the new types i'd have to say the fatbottle 6fd7 seems to
have similar characteristics to the 6ew7 but better bass and bigger
soundstage.
I am stunned!!!! Then, IYHO, is the 6fdt better than the 6ew7? Now, which is your favorite tube?
post #253 of 508
i'd say the 6fd7 is preferable to the 6ew7...
people hear things differently and have personal preferences, so
i don't want to say "better" like it's written in stone... i like all of
the output tubes... maybe the 6fd7 the best... followed closely by
the 6cy7.
post #254 of 508
Quote:
Originally Posted by takezo View Post
i'd say the 6fd7 is preferable to the 6ew7...
people hear things differently and have personal preferences, so
i don't want to say "better" like it's written in stone... i like all of
the output tubes... maybe the 6fd7 the best... followed closely by
the 6cy7.

Is the 6fd7 worse than the 6ew7 in some area? (detail, tonality,...)


Thanks you takezo
post #255 of 508
Thread Starter 
Takezo, you are once again waaay ahead of the curve on tube selection. I believe you may have outdone yourself this time. Thank you for that excellent new information!
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