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What is driving the Little Dot phenomenon? - Page 3  

post #31 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lapwing View Post
Even with my very limited experience in the head-fi realm I've already noticed a difference between SS and tube sound, but imo it's a subtle difference, and much smaller then the difference between comparing different headphones. How much did you spend on your amp? For you maybe that additional cost is worth the minute difference, but for me it's certainly not. I understand that audiophile is a hobby and passion and for this reason I know price isnt an obstacle for these people. I just enjoy listening to damn good sounding music, and that's exactly what I get with my relatively bargain rig.
I would say either you need to hear more amps or you are blessed by not hearing the differences. This is not a SS vs Tube thing this is a well implemented, quality parts and design thing. For example comparing a DV 336 to an extreme you can immediately tell the difference and it is not subtle. Then again comparing an extreme to a zana you immediatly hear it and again not subtle. Yes a DV or LD will amplify the sound and sound better than the headphone jack on an equally budget cd player (for the most part) but a watt is not a watt.
This is by no means mant to diminish your pleasure with your LD and I am glad you enjoy it but it is what it is, abudget amp made with compromises.
post #32 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp11801 View Post
I would say either you need to hear more amps or you are blessed by not hearing the differences. This is not a SS vs Tube thing this is a well implemented, quality parts and design thing. For example comparing a DV 336 to an extreme you can immediately tell the difference and it is not subtle. Then again comparing an extreme to a zana you immediatly hear it and again not subtle. Yes a DV or LD will amplify the sound and sound better than the headphone jack on an equally budget cd player (for the most part) but a watt is not a watt.
This is by no means mant to diminish your pleasure with your LD and I am glad you enjoy it but it is what it is, abudget amp made with compromises.
This is not a thread to debate this, we'll have to agree to disagree. I will point out though I've recently had a chance to audition my HD-650's on my friend's HeadRoom tube hybrid amp and also a high end Denon receiver, the differences between the sound were so subtle I can easy claim it was placebo, to my ears at least. Also, I've never seen any scientific review supporting the claim of amplifier audible differences, but I've found numerous ones showing the opposite -> a clean watt is a clean watt.

I bought the LD because of testimonials to it's reliability, quality of build, customer service, and price point.
post #33 of 351
I can't help but laugh at some of these posts. First thing that comes to mind is- Join Head-Fi and you can have your daily dose of General Hospital/All My Children and One Life To Live all at the same time.

As stated earlier, very counter productive...and not answering gear related questions.



Quote:
Mostly they sell to people without a great deal of experience with home amps, so they easily become the best thing they've heard, perpetuating the buzz.

Absolutely not true in a lot of cases. I have 5 home tube amps (4 Chinese- 2DVs & 2 LDs. Ironically my first home amp was the MF X-CanV3 and was more expensive than the other 4 at the time of purchase.

It's not about spending more, but finding what you like. I have emailed Jack at Woo, Singlepower, Space Labs for info on higher end amps, however, once I received my DV and LD, I was totally happy with the music I was listening to. Upgrading does not always mean spending a lot more. If what you are hearing is not up to par and want to expand, by all means do so.

I like the Chinese amps personally and I'm considering the DV3322 when it comes out, the only thing holding me back is where I'm going to put it. I like tinkering with different setups and seeing what gear has better synergy with other gear. That does not mean that I have to spend thousands of dollars to accomplish that.

In the old adage- "To each his own" and "what works for you might not work for others"...Is that not why we are here- to find out...? Whether you spend $20,000 or $200 it does not matter as long as we are all enjoying the music.

In reference to Penchum...The only thing that is certain is that he knows his LD amps.
post #34 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by grawk
Mostly they sell to people without a great deal of experience with home amps, so they easily become the best thing they've heard, perpetuating the buzz.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeatFan12 View Post
Absolutely not true in a lot of cases. I have 5 home tube amps (4 Chinese- 2DVs & 2 LDs. Ironically my first home amp was the MF X-CanV3 and was more expensive than the other 4 at the time of purchase.
Absolutely not true in a lot of cases maybe, but specifically true in your case. You had experience with 1 home amp prior to buying 4 chinese amps, and it's one that isn't universally admired. And now, because of that experience, you've decided that the amps you have are the best values to be had.
post #35 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lapwing View Post
This is not a thread to debate this, we'll have to agree to disagree. I will point out though I've recently had a chance to audition my HD-650's on my friend's HeadRoom tube hybrid amp and also a high end Denon receiver, the differences between the sound were so subtle I can easy claim it was placebo, to my ears at least. Also, I've never seen any scientific review supporting the claim of amplifier audible differences, but I've found numerous ones showing the opposite -> a clean watt is a clean watt.

I bought the LD because of testimonials to it's reliability, quality of build, customer service, and price point.
what I find funny is the threads title is 'what's driving the LD...' some people said quality sound ... another member pointed out shill marketing, our conversation and the thought that many members who buy the LD are relatively inexperienced with better amps. If the OPs intention was a LD lovefest then maybe a title like' Hey Guise Tell Me Why you Love Your LD Amp' would have been more appropriate. None of this is meant to say that the LD amps are not enjoyable or maybe even a good value. They are what they are value priced amps that perform well in their category.

One interesting thought about science and an amps specs is it tells less than half the story. When frequency response is listed at what db +/- is it listed at to say an amp is 20-20,000 but not to say that after 60hz the amp is - 6db is misleading. Under what conditions is distortion measured.
An amps specs can be greatly massaged to show you what they want to show you. Also what are we not measuring that we can hear? What about the amps ability to control the driver, never see that one do you?
post #36 of 351
Dont you love it when people make your point for you! Way to go Grawk!
post #37 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp11801 View Post
what I find funny is the threads title is 'what's driving the LD...' some people said quality sound ... another member pointed out shill marketing, our conversation and the thought that many members who buy the LD are relatively inexperienced with better amps. If the OPs intention was a LD lovefest then maybe a title like' Hey Guise Tell Me Why you Love Your LD Amp' would have been more appropriate. None of this is meant to say that the LD amps are not enjoyable or maybe even a good value. They are what they are value priced amps that perform well in their category.

One interesting thought about science and an amps specs is it tells less than half the story. When frequency response is listed at what db +/- is it listed at to say an amp is 20-20,000 but not to say that after 60hz the amp is - 6db is misleading. Under what conditions is distortion measured.
An amps specs can be greatly massaged to show you what they want to show you. Also what are we not measuring that we can hear? What about the amps ability to control the driver, never see that one do you?
I'd be happy to discuss the science behind audio reproduction with you in the science forum. I'm a physics graduate student and I'm well versed in E&M and electronics. I'm sorry, but I trust data analysis much more than subjective ears and bias psychoacoustics.
post #38 of 351
And what data analysis have you seen regarding little dot amps as compared to other amplifiers?
post #39 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lapwing View Post
I'd be happy to discuss the science behind audio reproduction with you in the science forum. I'm a physics graduate student and I'm well versed in E&M and electronics. I'm sorry, but I trust data analysis much more than subjective ears and bias psychoacoustics.
So you bought your LD III based on specs?
post #40 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by grawk View Post
Absolutely not true in a lot of cases maybe, but specifically true in your case. You had experience with 1 home amp prior to buying 4 chinese amps, and it's one that isn't universally admired. And now, because of that experience, you've decided that the amps you have are the best values to be had.
You are obviously missing the point once again. I still have the MF and I enjoy it very much. But instead of going "up" in price range, I went "down" to try different things. I could have gone either way.

But in your book, I guess "more" is always better.

"Universally Admired".. c'mon....I can give a damn about something being universally admired as long as I like it, it's what's important...But I guess you are not confident in making your own decisions...See if olblueyez can help you out....
post #41 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeatFan12 View Post
You are obviously missing the point once again. I still have the MF and I enjoy it very much. But instead of going "up" in price range, I went "down" to try different things. I could have gone either way.

But in your book, I guess "more" is always better.

"Universally Admired".. c'mon....I can give a damn about something being universally admired as long as I like it, it's what's important...But I guess you are not confident in making your own decisions...See if olblueyez can help you out....
Heatfan12 take the pepsi challenge and come to the Tampa meet in November bring your Little Dot armada of amps and the MF amp and lets put it up against some of the other amps there. I would love to eat some crow .
Besides you will probably have a great time with the SoFlo crews that invades Tampa for their event. We can even report back on the findings.

Oh and more $$ is not always better but better design, parts and implementation is is always better. I was not bowled over with the MF amps when MyArroyo brought them over to my house for a listen, he loved them for their performance vs price but since then has moved on the a SP MPX3.
post #42 of 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeatFan12 View Post
You are obviously missing the point once again. I still have the MF and I enjoy it very much. But instead of going "up" in price range, I went "down" to try different things. I could have gone either way.

But in your book, I guess "more" is always better.

"Universally Admired".. c'mon....I can give a damn about something being universally admired as long as I like it, it's what's important...But I guess you are not confident in making your own decisions...See if olblueyez can help you out....
As long as Penchum likes your Little-Dots then they must be the best.
post #43 of 351
Price Great value. For a comparable amp, you'd pay 3X more if it was made in the US.
Performance Outstanding. Lots of power, transparent, clean and detailed.
Reliability No problems at all.
Delivery times Four days to California from mainland China. I got it before I even got tracking info from the EMS site!
Repair service Not needed...
Intangibles Excellent build quality, parts, and design all contribute to a quality amp at a budget price.
post #44 of 351
Thread Starter 

me a shill?

Quote:
Originally Posted by grawk View Post
shilling
Hardly. I own MAD Ear+ HD, SP MPX3 Slam SE, a BC SBH and a Meier 2Move. No Little Dots, and I have never even heard one.

I am generally very negative about Chinese products, because of reliability issues. But I am really curious because of its popularity and I wanted to find out why so many people are buying it.
post #45 of 351
I don't trust anyone's ears but my own. I've owned many amps, and listened to many others. The one I picked was hardly the most expensive, and no where near the least. There are lots of variables at play. All I'm saying is that it's easy to love an amp when you don't have a lot of experience with others. That's a good thing for you, but it doesn't make your judgement something that others should base decisions on.
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